Rachet Rifled barrel longevity
- Thread starter Lightload
- Start date
butchlambert
Site $$ Sponsor
No difference.
Dave L Kiff
Site $$ Sponsor
Eddy, give me a call . I have a new throat design that has been breaking records and makes every barrel last longer wit less pressure, more speed . give me a call at my custom shop, thanks Dave Kiff, ask for me if i don't answer , 1-541-826-5808-
That ought to make
That ought to make the phone ring.
Dave do you want to explain it a little here so you don't have to do it 100 time over the phone.
Its great your always thinking of new things.
Hal
That ought to make the phone ring.
Dave do you want to explain it a little here so you don't have to do it 100 time over the phone.
Its great your always thinking of new things.
Hal
Dave L Kiff
Site $$ Sponsor
Hal I figure if I have the time for the phone, than the person asking the Question does to . Right ? Call anytime and I guaranty i can cut your groups in half. thanks Dave KiffThat ought to make
That ought to make the phone ring.
Dave do you want to explain it a little here so you don't have to do it 100 time over the phone.
Its great your always thinking of new things.
Hal
Ledd Slinger
Silver $$ Contributor
I may be wrong, but im pretty sure Dave is referring to the stepped throat reamer. It reduces the thickness of the rifling (increases bore diameter) for a short distance before the bullet engages full thickness rifling (original bore diameter). Basically a dual lands, or might also call it a form of 'semi-free bore'
Supposed to allow loading with higher pressures and reduce wear on the initial lands.
Supposed to allow loading with higher pressures and reduce wear on the initial lands.
centershot
Silver $$ Contributor
What is the purpose of rachet rifling?
Ledd Slinger
Silver $$ Contributor
Similar to purpose of R rifling. Reduced stress on the bullet jacket and easier cleaning.
butchlambert
Site $$ Sponsor
People ask for it, kinda like people asking for 5R.
No idea where you got that but it is not correct. The theory is that it provides somewhat better wind handling properties, plain and simple.
Dave L Kiff
Site $$ Sponsor
There is more to it than my pat,pend multi world record holding Borerider formula for what i'm talking about you need to ring me because I have to know each persons, case, bullet, bore, and a couple other things . The bore rider if used like the one I put on the new 6.5 Weatherby that now hold's the Title fastest SAAMI 6.5 cartridge in the world per Wheatherby . I tell you this , It hold's 18 world records and on average depending on the cartridge will increase the average speed between 50 to 128 fps before we add extra powder for speed and utilize the double bump to center line the projectile and release bad pressures, that's not even talking about the extra barrel life. Thanks Dave
Ledd Slinger
Silver $$ Contributor
That's a theory. That theory is based upon increased bullet speeds. I would assume the increased speeds are due to less drag on the bullet jacket. If you read on Shilen website, 'easier cleaning' is plainly stated as a benefit to the ratchet rifling. It has always been a known benefit to 5R rifling as well. I have a Shilen SS ratchet rifle barrel and have owned 5R barrels in the past. I can assure you their wind handling capabilities are no different than standard rifled barrels. But the ratchet and 5R do in fact clean out much nicer and easier. So I'm not pulling this out of my ass. I actually have experience with those types of rifling.
I am also currently using a 3 groove 20 cal barrel on a rifle to determine if the claimed 20% longer barrel life is true. Tho it will be hard to match the shooting conditions of my past 6 groove 20 Cal barrels to draw a definite conclusion.
I'd be most interested to learn exactly how the type of rifling has anything whatsoever to do with bullet speed.
Easier cleaning would be what I'd call " marketing" and has nothing to due with how it came into being.
Study up on how all of these rifling patterns came back into favor, ratchet, 5R, 2 groove, octagon, MI, they all presume to impact wind and/or coriolus effect.
As to rifling patterns vs barrel longevity....don't get your hopes up, I have shot every configuration on the planet in benchrest rifles for a long time........it's got far more to do with the lot of steel than enything...how lucky do you feel?
Ledd Slinger
Silver $$ Contributor
Yeah my hopes aren't high with the 3 groove. The idea is that a less amount of wider rifling will wear slower than thinner more numerous rifling. Makes sense, but it all boils down to steel quality and how hot a person allows the barrel to get while shooting. All else being equal, a 6 groove barrel which never sees more than 3 rounds fired in succession before cooling, as in coyote hunting varmint rifle, will likely long outlast a 3 groove barrel where 30 to 50 rounds are fired before cooling (and generally in warm temps) as seen in a varmint rifle used for gopher and prairie dog fields. So steel quality plays a part, but shooting conditions and methods play a much bigger role.
As far as cleaning, I believe 5R and ratchet rifle barrels do clean easier. This is not a guess. I have a bore scope that I use to inspect every barrel after cleaning. Whether you believe this or not doesn't really matter to me. I believe what my bore scope shows me.
Well Tim. Your the one who is partly wrong not Ledd Slinger. Ledd Slinger is correct about less stress on the jacket and easier to clean. Ratchet rifling is that the driven side of the land is of conventional shape with a sharp angle at the top and bottom, the opposite face curves into the top of the land and the bottom of the groove, and also the decent into the groove maybe sloped rather than perpendicular to the bore. The advantage of cleaning is there is lack of a sharp corner on one side of the grooves which means there is one less place for fouling to gather. 2nd, there is improved obduration which means less stress on the jacket because curves are easier for the jacket to conform to. Your right Tim about wind handling. In theory there is a significant lessening of a cross wind effect thought to come from the fact that the impression of the gently curved non driving side of the land ( which is a leading edge in relation to the bullet's spin) causes less "fin effect" from the rifling marks as the bullet spins while going at a tremendous rate while going to the target. It may be that this reduces the thickness of the air that is being disturbed around the bullet as it spins, shrinking the effective area that a cross wind can push on. The lessening of applied force should also result in less of the gyroscopic precession effect that causes a bullet to rise or fall in a pure side wind.
Better'n the funny papers.
Like I said....marketing. I own, have owned and shoot with both RF and CF everything from 2,3,4,5 and 6 groove, ratchet, MI and everything in between and they clean up pretty much the same, as does everybody elses. I cannot recall a single comment at a match and/or from a barrel maker ever commenting on different cleaning for different configurations because, frankly, it does not exist.
As to easier jacket conformity relative to bore. You really think, in a PPC, for instance, a 62-68 gr slug starting out at some 65,000 psi, that makes any.....any measurable difference? If you do, we should talk about that prime swampland in Florida I can get you a deal on.
Like I said,marketing.....talk to a few guys that actually make barrels...I have/ do......often.
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