Tim Singleton
Gold $$ Contributor
Need Lathe Advice!
- Thread starter RemingtonAI
- Start date
I seriously doubt you'll find a nice lathe cheap on Craigslist, only chance you have of getting a great USA lathe cheap is by word of mouth or at auction from a shop going out of business.
I have a 1973 Sheldon that was kept in a tool room that I got at auction. It came with thousands of dollars of spare parts, timken bearings, collars, nuts, ect... At auction.
With that being said, I hate to say this, but if you can afford a new Taiwan lathe, that would be the way I would go.
Now for the bad with new machine, it don't come with anything. If you can't afford $5,000+ in tooling, then go to auctions and find one with tooling. The lathe is cheap part, tooling is the big cost, plus once you get a lathe, you'll soon find out you need a Bridgeport mill.
It's not just going to be a hobby, if your in it this far, you'll be able to make a little money on jobs. It'll be the best tool in your shop. Best of luck to you.
I have a 1973 Sheldon that was kept in a tool room that I got at auction. It came with thousands of dollars of spare parts, timken bearings, collars, nuts, ect... At auction.
With that being said, I hate to say this, but if you can afford a new Taiwan lathe, that would be the way I would go.
Now for the bad with new machine, it don't come with anything. If you can't afford $5,000+ in tooling, then go to auctions and find one with tooling. The lathe is cheap part, tooling is the big cost, plus once you get a lathe, you'll soon find out you need a Bridgeport mill.
It's not just going to be a hobby, if your in it this far, you'll be able to make a little money on jobs. It'll be the best tool in your shop. Best of luck to you.
I like the 13".I also like that it came from a reputable race car shop. I know that doesn't mean its in great shape necessarily but I wold think there is a better chance that it saw frequent maintenance and lubrication. On the down side, i assume it takes 220 which i do not have in my "lathe room". No tooling, but looks to be a good price if the machine checks out. That's just my first uneducated impression. Think I'll call him to ask a bit more about it. Thanks! Jesse
Don't bet on that. My second lathe came out of a shop where you would have assumed it was well maintained. It wasn't and was worn out from not being properly lubed.
The heavy 10 on the other hand if it was a one owner machine bought by a gentleman that bought it to use as a hobby machine I guarantee you that is the find of a lifetime in this day.
I realize its smaller, but barrel work can still be done through the headstock with 1.375" bore.
hoz53
Gold $$ Contributor
Realize that the 13" has a wider headstock than the heavy 10. That is one reason so many prefer the 10 over the 13 for barrel work.
The 10 in the link above is really interesting, and I do actually like the shorter bed since it will be in my "man cave", which is already pretty crazy. Its more $ than i have but i did send him an offer. I can't tell you guy how much i appreciate all of your help. Jesse
If that doesn't work out I have a Logan 11" that I'm going to have to sell. I bought it to learn on but I'm moving and will have no place to put it until I can afford to build a shop to put it in. 1.375" spindle bore and 36" between centers. All gears are good and has a quick change gear box. It has a good bit of tooling with it. Follower and steady rests , 3 jaw scroll and 4 jaw independant chuck. Lantern tool post and a square four tool post. Power cross feed. I don't have any more skill than you do for evaluating it but everything works and all the gears are good. I've put new belts on it already. 115v single phase power. $1200 and I can lift it with my engine hoist onto a trailer. I'm in Jacksonville Fl. I could store it for a year or more but that would be a waste. I can take a few pictures this evening and it is plugged in so it can be run but it's just sitting on the table not bolted down or leveled.
I am a novice at machining, but have had mentoring from a tool and die maker and a person very experienced with such tools. I also have a 1946 Southbend 9", 4-1/2 foot long bed, Model A (quick change gear box). From using this lathe, several observations about old stuff.
1) Non-hardened ways. Mine are worn, but not to the point of posing a problem...yet.
2) The 0.75" spindle bore is hopeless for barrel work, but the long bed opens up other options.
3) Mine has just 6 speeds (3 pulley sizes x backgear = 6).
4) Spindle speed maxes out at 600 rpm, not fast enough to effectively use carbide cutting tooling.
5) Plain cast iron spindle bearings. The bearing surface IS the cast iron of the headstock. My bearing clearance is at the upper end of tolerance. Once past that, head stock is worn out and only way to repair is to replace it. Not likely.
6) Cross feed and compounds dials are not direct reading, and are also tiny and hard to read. You can have a nice project to correct this and improve.
7) My tail stock bore is bell-mouthed. Very hard to fix apparently, and any used ones are probably just as worn.
8) Uses threaded on chuck. Be careful if using reverse on lathe. Can quickly unscrew chuck from spindle and leave it crashing onto ways.
9) Quick change gearbox is open on bottom. Put in lube on upper oil filler, and oil runs through neat channels to lube stuff, to drip all over surface beneath gearbox.
10) No metric threading. If you are using an action with metric threads (i.e., Howa), a problem.
11) Awkward footprint. Mine has motor behind headstock, resulting in an L shaped footprint. Not ideal for against a wall.
12) Uses 3C collets, not the common cheaper 5C collets. Capacity is limited as well.
13) Parts are not cheap, but can be found at reasonable prices with some effort.
14) Not very stiff. I can mount a test indicator anywhere on it and push on a casting and the indicator moves. Even though the lathe is about 5 feet long, it is just 465 lbs. (plus or minus 10 lbs. or so). Flex is evident. Make a cutting pass and then change nothing but go back over it, and more will come off. All lathes will do this to some extent, but because of the light weight, mine does it a lot more than my friend's 14" Goodway lathe.
The good?
It does work well and is smooth. I have learned it well enough where I can cut stuff and have a very nice finish, and getting dimensions to where I can make a slip fit between two parts. It threads well, the gearbox works fine, and if in no rush, can serve well, as long as design capacity is not exceeded. My next lathe? Probably a Grizzly gunsmith lathe in 13" or so. Some things have improved since 1946. Like hardened ways, tapered spindle bearings, superior speed control, etc.
Phil
Hey guys, just wondering what you think about this Heavy 10. The guy doesn't seem to know as much as you might expect, and bought it for his fabrication shop. Says he bought it from a shop that built race cars and monster trucks, etc. The guy he bought it from "restored" it, took it all apart and said there wasn't a whole lot that needed to be done. Ok, get this. He says it has the original motor. Says the guys took it off to have it looked at/replaced and apparently it was in good condition so he put it back on? Maybe this guy interpreted the story wrong, or who knows but that's what I got. Says its in great shape as far as wear, but of course I have not seen it for myself. Opinions? He thinks it is a late 40's. I'd appreciate any thoughts on it. Jesse
http://miami.craigslist.org/pbc/tls/5687595335.html
http://miami.craigslist.org/pbc/tls/5687595335.html
Tim Singleton
Gold $$ Contributor
It looks pretty nice. New paint does that. The a loris tool holder is worth a few hundred.
Someone with more knowledge than I hopefully can answer my question on the quick change gear box.
Mine has two levers one lever you place in A,B,C,D the second lever you place in the appropriate knotch have for the threads per inch
The machine on your posting only has one lever on the threading gear box
My heavy 10 only had the one lever also, my understanding was they were the older ones. The second lever just gives you more speeds, feeds, and threads if I'm not mistaken.
You can get way more lathe for $3000. Take what phil3 said to heart- "if in no rush can serve well". not that I'm ever in a hurry, but why take an hour when you take 20 minutes to do the same thing. If you ever have to remove any amount of metal grab your lunch a beer and your recliner... Don't forget to let the bearings cool down.
Dealing with the flex/lack of rigidity is another issue.
Barrel work is a pain with the short quill travel.
I have a 6500 pound Lathe now and life is good.
Great you have learned the basics on a small lathe. IMHO I would take a NRA summer course for truing and barrel threading as a course you would enjoy and meet several professionals willing to help. It will help you in actually performing the method and understanding which size lathe will be appropriate for the machining method you choose. I have worked with both South Bends /Clausings both good lathes 13X40 South Bend 7388 ( rebadged ) Harrison M300 is what I settled on using turned out to be a good choice. The NRA class helped greatly in deciding which lathe would best fit the method I was going to be using (through the headstock method). Good Luck there are many opinions here al
Muley, that sounds extremely interesting I will definitely check it out. I'm really just learning machining in general without any intentions of doing any gunsmithing. However I do want a lathe that can accommodate different gunsmithing functions as its really the natural evolution for a guy that loves both target shooting and machining. That wont be for some while but I'll still check out the class because the more learned the better. Thanks for the recommendation! Jesse
Just an update. Heres my 1968 South Bend Heavy 10 toolroom model. Buck 3 jaw chuck, factory taper attachment and steady rest, Teco VFD, etc. Havent hooked up the VFD yet, but got to play with it under power when i bought it. Eventually ill disassemble everything to fully clean everything but now just going through and cleaning it the hard way without taking it apart. Its in great shape and runs very smooth.just thought I'd share. Thanks for everyones help again. Jesse
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Tim Singleton
Gold $$ Contributor
Nice!
spitfire_er
Silver $$ Contributor
Very similar to one of my lathes. Nice machines and capable especially for what your needs are. I had mine reground and everything scraped. Runs, cuts, and looks like a brand new machine.
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