bit of advice please

[zx10mike]

i am running a very accurate 7mm shehane,my normal load is with rs 60 (rl17) with this powder i'm getting good speeds but es in the 20's.I weigh to single kernel on 2 scales using br2 primers in neck turned lap brass.
i decided to give 4831sc a bash and this powder is damn accurate too but again es is 20 .i'm getting only 2820 fps with 56.5 through my research this seems a tad slow.i have carried on to 57.5 in small increments with no preasure sighns at all with the 1 grn extra i gained 20 fps.there seems a common theme of good es around the 2890 mark but that means keeping going with powder looking for pressure .i can't find anyone online using 58 or above.because i'm getting good speed with rs60 i don't feel it's a slow barrel more a slow batch of powder.i'm thinking every rifle is different so keep going till i see a preasure sign but christ knows how much over published/researched normal max i will end up.any advice welcome please guys.
i have done a seat deapth scan to see if that had much change in es but no real difference worth chasing showed all the way back to a jump of 70 tho so i quit.

 

[zipollini]

Weight sort your cases and primers. Yes - it makes a difference

 

[zx10mike]

i don't weight sort primers so that is a plan but i have heard a lot lately and read weight sorting cases makes no difference so if i'm wrong please give me your opinions.thankyou zipollini both tips taken on board.

 

[jghoghunter]

My ES came down when I changed neck tension. I went from .003 to .002 and the ES came down. My groups also improved. Just my .02.

 

[moajoe]

I think the benefit of weight sorting bullets, cases and even primers make for more consistency especially at say 1,000 yards. Once you find your node you can start to tweak neck tension, seating depth etc. to squeeze out more accuracy.

 

[zx10mike]

thank you hoghunter worth a try .my loaded is 309 actual sized neck is coming out 308 from a 306 lewilson bushing ???? as luck would have it i have 308 and 307 so i'll give 2 tho tension a try.got to be worth a go.

 

[dcali]

ES does not mean much of anything unless you tell us how many shots. When people compare ES or SD, they never seem to mention how many shots. It matters - a lot.

 

[zx10mike]

moajoe accuracy is great but with these es i guess we are talking long range accuracy.i do shoot 1000 quiet often so just trying to tweak that es.weighing primers and brass and changing neck tension is on my try list.thanks all

 

[jlow]

ES does not mean much of anything unless you tell us how many shots. When people compare ES or SD, they never seem to mention how many shots. It matters - a lot.

Agreed! Not to mention that ES of 20 is actually not bad as I would bet you the Sdev is less than 10 fps.

 

[zx10mike]

damoncall with es of 20 or there abouts i'm shooting 4 and quiting as soon as any test breaks 20 fps.when i start to get it down i'll test 5 and just see how it translates during a friendly comp.

 

[zx10mike]

slow an es of 20 fps will not hold that 5 ring if i believe what i read or the tighter i can get it the bigger the target as such

 

[zipollini]

Sort bullets for bearing length to the .001". No need to weight sort bullets.

 

[newbieshooter]

Sort bullets for bearing length to the .001". No need to weight sort bullets.

Any recommendations for a easy to use tool for measuring bullet bearing surface length?

 

[zipollini]

Any recommendations for a easy to use tool for measuring bullet bearing surface length?

This is what I use

You want two matching one of these for the caliber you are measuring.

http://www.brownells.com/reloading/.../lock-n-load-comparator-insert-prod32794.aspx

You want two of these

http://www.brownells.com/reloading/...-n-load-bullet-comparator-body-prod34053.aspx

and you want a nice set of calipers.

For me measuring bearing surface is a better and more accurate and repeatable measurement than base to ogive. You also don't need to weight sort bullets. Take a look at this video with Bryan Litz to understand.

 

[newbieshooter]

This is what I use

You want two matching one of these for the caliber you are measuring.

http://www.brownells.com/reloading/.../lock-n-load-comparator-insert-prod32794.aspx

You want two of these

http://www.brownells.com/reloading/...-n-load-bullet-comparator-body-prod34053.aspx

and you want a nice set of calipers.

For me measuring bearing surface is a better and more accurate and repeatable measurement than base to ogive. You also don't need to weight sort bullets. Take a look at this video with Bryan Litz to understand.

Do you find that using the bullet comparators/inserts results in repeatable measurements (to .001)? For example, if you measure a batch of bullets and sort them by .001 buckets - come back the next day and measure the same bullets in one of the buckets - do you still get the same measurements - or do you find some of the bullets now measure a different reading which results in having to put the bullet into another bucket?? I've heard that using the comparators - there is some variance and that re-measuring the same bullets results in a variance more than the .001 buckets one is attempting to achieve.

Just wondering about the repeatability of the bearing surface length using this method. thanks!

 

[davidpatton]

The best improvement in 1000 yard accuracy for me was after loading on a k&m press with a force indicator. That way I can actually get a number for seating pressure instead of just a feel. I haven't spent any time on the chrono since changing but groups have tightened up a lot.

 

[zx10mike]

guys i want to say thank you for all your help,i think i thought i could just load develop my way to single digit es but what all the comments have pointed out are i need to get much more anal with making that ammo.i'm going to be happy with that slower load and concentrate in this area.

thank you
mike

 

[zipollini]

Do you find that using the bullet comparators/inserts results in repeatable measurements (to .001)? For example, if you measure a batch of bullets and sort them by .001 buckets - come back the next day and measure the same bullets in one of the buckets - do you still get the same measurements - or do you find some of the bullets now measure a different reading which results in having to put the bullet into another bucket?? I've heard that using the comparators - there is some variance and that re-measuring the same bullets results in a variance more than the .001 buckets one is attempting to achieve.

Just wondering about the repeatability of the bearing surface length using this method. thanks!

I have a Sinclair and a Tubb bullet comparator for measuring both base to ogive and bearing surface. I have found that using the calipers and the above mentioned parts and measuring bearing surface provide me with more repeatable results and are also faster once you practice a little.

 

[dogdude]

Get Bob Green's tools..base to ogive (for calipers) and his ogive comparator with the dial indicator (each mark on dial is 1/10,000) if these don't help..its your barrel!!

 

[Alex Wheeler]

First, forget es. How does the rifle group at 1k? That is all that matters. I am certain if you tweak your load at 1k you will find the accuracy you need. This is assuming you are doing the basics like sorting bullets and turning your necks.