A Question for the Learned about Corrosion

[Dusty Stevens]

It just makes me nervous even using it. Its the only cleaner i know of that states to not leave it in your barrel. I use it on like chrome lined military type stuff is the main thing.

 

[Hntndad]

I Get ya. I use it on factory barrels that copper foul like nobody's business or after long long strings with my varmint rifles. Its got its purpose. I'm not saying it's absolutely the cause of Lenard's issue but I wouldn't count it out. When I was younger, I used jb on a patch and scrubbed until a solvent patch came out white. It got all of the copper out and probably 1/2 the steel that was in that barrel as well.

Bought some tire/wheel cleaner last year as well. High quality name brand. Read instructions. Started using it. This year the wheels on my fancy truck have pitting because of it. Did it clean my wheels??? Sure it did!

 

[watercam]

FWIW, I had a CZ 527 in .204 Ruger that was shot out after 500 rounds. Large chunks of steel missing, diagonal scratches that crossed lands and grooves alike that were not there when new, looked like the surface of the moon after a meteor shower. Re-barreled with a Chrome Moly Douglas barrel in .223 and have had stellar luck with it. More than 600 rounds down the tube and the throat still looks lovely. I think that the Czech steel may be unfit for varmint calibers!

 

[impalacustom]

Maybe someone used kerosene to clean it before you owned it, you said you questioned the idea of it being never shot before. Kerosene will get into the pores of the steel and cause rust.

 

[Mozella]

Maybe someone used kerosene to clean it before you owned it, you said you questioned the idea of it being never shot before. Kerosene will get into the pores of the steel and cause rust.

Huh?

I don't know about your rifles, but my barrels are made out of martensitic steel which has a crystalline structure without any pores. Kerosene will not soak into my barrels.

 

[LHSmith]

Huh?

I don't know about your rifles, but my barrels are made out of martensitic steel which has a crystalline structure without any pores. Kerosene will not soak into my barrels.

I disagree. Kroil is a perfect example of a liquids ability to penetrate "creep into millionths of an inch spaces". In fact the whole "Nano" industry is based on accessing the voids below metal surfaces. This is why I don't use Kroil anymore, it keeps creeping out of these micro crevices delaying that initial layer of powder fouling from taking hold.....it takes more fouling shots than just using plain oil for that first shot.

 

[Lenard]

I believe that in answering a question, it has gone into the realm of more questions. I know for fact the cosmoline had been removed from the barrel. I have been told by those who purchased the early 527's had a heck of a time removing cosmoline. I bought a new 22 Hornet a couple years later and all traces of cosmoline were gone when I received it.

So, as stated previously, the Sweets could have soaked into the steel.
The powder could be the culprit as possibly being caustic, although it has zero impact on stainless.
It could be faulty barrel steel as a small part of one land is gone about 3/4 of the way to the muzzle.
Could it be a reaction to brake drum cleaner.

I might contact CZ on this and see what they have to say.

 

[Paddyd]

I highly doubt kerosene is in any way the culprit. Almost all everyday bore solvents are based in kerosene. Brake cleaner will strip all oils out of the bore. Even those microscopic cracks. Then if you use any water based cleaners the water gets in any cracks. Then you seal it in with the preservative. Over time that trapped moisture causes corrosion. At least that's my theory.

 

[Mozella]

I disagree. Kroil is a perfect example of a liquids ability to penetrate "creep into millionths of an inch spaces". In fact the whole "Nano" industry is based on accessing the voids below metal surfaces. This is why I don't use Kroil anymore, it keeps "creeping out of these pores" delaying that initial layer of powder fouling from taking hold.....it takes more fouling shots than just using plain oil for that first shot.

Well, the idea of porous gun barrels will come as a big surprise to lots of people who know a thing or two about steel, including those of us who have studied metallurgy. Thanks for the warning.

 

[Dusty Stevens]

What kind of steel is this porous type so i can avoid using barrels made from it?

 

[LHSmith]

Well, the idea of porous gun barrels will come as a big surprise to lots of people who know a thing or two about steel, including those of us who have studied metallurgy. Thanks for the warning.

You well know I am talking about microscopic cracks at the surface level. Poor choice of words on my part to use "pores" and I corrected that in my post.

 

[Lenard]

Well, I got a reply from the powder company. It is from the email and copied to be exact.

oad data

Ramshot Customer Service <customerservice@ramshot.com>
To
lenard


Today at 8:27 AM
Lenard,

The reason you see the problem in a chrome moly barrel and not in a stainless barrel is for the same reason you can cut chrome moly steel with a cutting torch but you can’t cut stainless steel with a cutting torch. A cutting torch oxidizes the steel. Adding nickel to the steel helps keep it from oxidizing. It’s the same principal that happens with the flame produced by the gun powder.



Accurate 2200 is too fast of a powder for the TAC 20. Accurate 2520 is the ideal powder as pressures will be lower and barrel life with be longer. You should also see better accuracy as the case fill will be much better



Don W.

CSR Western Powders

406-234-0422

 

[Webster]

I purchased a 527 223 HB in Carbon Steel. The accuracy dropped off at around 1000 rounds and it was replaced. Gunsmith said it was pitted in lots of places.

Carry this over to two days ago when my Lyman scope came in and I started evaluating the barrel. It was etched in close to 40% of the barrel. I had purchased the gun as new, which I doubted, After some work on my part, the gun easily shot 1/4" groups using a 40 v max and 2200 powder.

I had used some sweets on the gun early on and then went to wipe out. I would oil the barrel after cleaning and never let the sweets sit overnight.

I posted this on Saubier and one fellow suggested the 2200 powder might be the problem. So I emailed AA and they said they had never had anyone report a problem with etching and 2200 powder. What ever the situation, my stainless barrels are unaffected.

Have any one any experience with this powder as far as corrosion is concerned.

I was involved with a corrosion study for the army. They were testing various protective oils on steel panels. The panels were oiled then put in a humidity cabinet. The oil was to be used for long term storage of vehicles. I learned corrosion will take place under oil on a steel panel dipped in oil if moisture is present on the panel. I run three dry patches through the bore after cleaning. Use sweets very seldom. If I am at the range I like to clean the rifle after shooting at targets then fire one fouling shot to make sure I am zeroed in case I go GH hunting. No oil put in the bore. After 3 patches and one shot the bore should be dry. It's a SS barrel and I still do this.

They call the barrels 416 CrMo stainless. I x-rayed a Douglas barrel a long time ago. From memory it was about 10-12% Cr Zero Mo, Zero Ni. Depending which spec you read the Mo is optional in this alloy. Never contains nickel.

 

[ireload2]

I have barrels made out of all sorts of steel from the soft steels of a 22 rimfire to 416 stainless barrels.
I have never harmed a one of them. I have not used Sweets much. My only bottle of Sweets cracked and started leaking in the garage so I tossed it and never bought another. I assume that the ammonia in Sweet's will become more concentrated as it air dries. This may happen with a hot barrel.