Truly accurate ar15

Discussion in 'Main Message Board' started by matthias, Apr 5, 2020.

  1. matthias

    matthias Gold $$ Contributor

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    please read to the end and understand my goal of this thread not degrading to a waste of time.

    As the title states, I am on an information search for truly accurate ar15s.

    i have read the daily bulletin article, and many other articles and books about building ar15s for accuracy.

    of all the ar15 rifles out there that claim very good accuracy it seems to be the best group that is touted not consistent groups.

    instead of starting a mud slinging contest i ask for two things for all you proud accurate ar15 owners.
    i ask these questions in the spirit of cooperation ,knowledge , and possibly joining your ranks.

    question 1- what is your rifle actually capable of in your hands on a regular day, not the wallet group best day.

    question 2- how and what was used in assembly and reloading of your rifle? ( a guideline if you will)

    question 3- is it really a useful rifle or is it to fussy to keep going, like a race car more maintenance than driving?

    questions are over

    i am not interested in a mud contest or negative comments. straight forward explanations of your rifles and their performance in your hands.

    Any posts not inline with the spirit of this thread will result in me deleting it. i am here to be converted to accurate ar15 band wagon or not. not here for mud throwing speaking down about rifles or any other shenanigans.

    just the facts
     
  2. Kurz

    Kurz

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    I ask a couple of other questions in addition to yours:

    Single shot, semi-auto or a combination of both?
    I shoot an AR15 single shot at 1,000 yards with the longer VLD bullets but switch to semi-auto for other competitions.

    Complete factory rifles or custom built platforms?
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2020
  3. Rocketvapor

    Rocketvapor

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    I put together a few 'Low end' AR's.
    I found the slightly extra weight of the side charge BCA upper to be strong.
    Their carrier and bolt of your choice.
    Even if it doesn't matter, I lap the upper and use a shim for a slight thermal fit barrel to receiver.
    A handguard that uses a steel barrel nut and weight/thickness instead of supper light, etc.

    I also like long heavy barrels shot from a bipod or rest.
    Pick your brand.
    I got a X-Caliber 28" bull barrel with the 30% off sale. Took about 6 weeks to come in.

    I load LONG, Single Shot, and in a few cases No-Gas.
    Reloads, get me 3@0.3, 5@0.5, 10@ 1.0, 60 @ 1.5MOA @ 100yds from a bipod.
    Hope there are bits in this post that might be helpful.
     
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  4. rsmithsr50

    rsmithsr50

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    1) I have an ar15 that shoots in the low 2's occasionally high 1's
    2) hart 1/14 1.+" plus at the muzzle, custom min spec short throat reamer, 52/53 match bullets in match sorted brass, single fed, does have gas system in place.
    3) it is a br target rifle/pd rifle. not fussy at all it does have a 3" flat forearm and a flat on the bottom of the butt stock
    it actually shoots 50gr vmax production bullets very well as in .2 also
    it is nearly 20years old
     
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  5. scasa

    scasa

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    Windham weaponry Varmint exterminator.

    Sub 1/2 moa groups at 100 yds, hand loads 75 gr amax.

    as it came from the factory
     
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  6. Frank Blum

    Frank Blum Silver $$ Contributor

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    The right combination of upper, trigger, scope and some Berger 80.5 sitting on top of 24 grains of Varget will shoot under .4 MOA out to 800. I have loads that will shoots the 77 SMK out of the mag well under .4 @ 100. I use once fired PMC prepped brass for my long range loads.
    My shooter is a complete RRA with a 20" Varmint upper. I use a Nightforce 12X42 BR scope. The trigger is an ELF adjustable. I have the bag rider on both ends and shoot it like a BR rifle. There is absolutely nothing hard about keeping a quality AR running.
    I have several uppers just for blinkers.
     
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  7. Bc'z

    Bc'z Gold $$ Contributor

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    .5 moa not to hard to achieve.
    Of the 3 we have my favorite is a hodge podge of components collected over time
    In 6x45.
     
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  8. TheOtherZilla

    TheOtherZilla Gold $$ Contributor

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    I had a very accurate AR. Rock River lower and an upper . The upper had a 1" stainless bull barrel, like 24".. My load would shoot at least 3/8" at 100 yards every time from a bench. I sold the upper. It was too heavy for this geezer.. Yes I replaced it, with an Adams arms piston upper.. Doesn't shoot 3/8" but does good enough for the targets I shoot at.
     
  9. Rustytigwire

    Rustytigwire

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    Frank,
    What velocity range gives you that kind of result?
    Thanks
    Tom
     
  10. scasa

    scasa

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    thats being consertive I've shot 5x5 with prob 3 out of 5 touching
     
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  11. Mark McMahon

    Mark McMahon Gold $$ Contributor

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  12. 300_whisper

    300_whisper Silver $$ Contributor

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    question 1- what is your rifle actually capable of in your hands on a regular day, not the wallet group best day.

    Consistently capable of .5 MOA with 5 shot groups with .223 rem federal 77 grain GMM. The wallet groups are quarter MOA for 3 shot groups.

    question 2- how and what was used in assembly and reloading of your rifle? ( a guideline if you will)

    Started out as a stock SW MP. Had my smith tear it down to a stripped upper and lower. Got some $200 BCG that he head spaced and timed to the shilen select match barrel. It’s 20 inches long, 1:8 twist, medium profile, fluted, extended gas tube, and free floated in a Midwest industries rail. It also has a geissele SSA-E trigger. It has accuwedges in the upper and lower to keep it from moving. He’s a very talented smith / machinist, so he also did whatever other weird AR voodoo youre supposed to do. I guess there’s more too it than just slapping pieces together.

    question 3- is it really a useful rifle or is it to fussy to keep going, like a race car more maintenance than driving?

    Yes, it is a very useful rifle. I use it hunting a lot. Very tough, durable, never had a jam. I clean it every 200 rounds. I have killed hogs, deer, fox, and bobcat with it. Great rifle. To keep the car analogy going, it’s like owning a lifted Toyota Tacoma. Lol

    EDIT: Groups are off a bench at 100 yards.
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2020
  13. matthias

    matthias Gold $$ Contributor

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    this is what i am looking for . thank all of you for your replies. always looking for more info
     
  14. 338 Mollett

    338 Mollett Gold $$ Contributor

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    I have been on this quest for the last 6 months.Les Baer is the only guy that guarantees 1/2 at 100 yds.So I started studying how and why this is accomplished .It is my understanding they hand fit their own uppers and lowers.This can only be done if they are made over sized and filed down.There is about 60 to 70 thou slop between the BCG and the raceway.Some company's make an oversized carrier.The barrel extension fit up is huge,some use glue some shims,if you can find an oversized extension grab it .Adjustable gas blocks etc. etc.Heavy walled uppers help,and truing the face helps but don't do it with a drill !After all this and swapping between 2 Kriegers and a Jp supermatch 2 rifles rifles shoot .5 every other day.
     
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  15. Frank Blum

    Frank Blum Silver $$ Contributor

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    Here you are Rusty. I don't load anything on the hot side in any of my guns. These are not loaded to bench rest standards. I used the brass from PMC $7 a box 55 grain loads.
    77 Grain SMK 24 #15 @ 2682 fps
    80.5 Berger 24 Varget @2674 fps
    82 Berger 23.5 Varget @2647 2017-06-14 10.50.34.jpg
     
  16. rwh

    rwh Gold $$ Contributor

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    I built an AR I use for 300 yard across the course matches. I always shoot from a sling so I don't have any pictures of really small groups. However I consistently shoot 198 10-15x in matches with 77 gr match kings. I started with a billet upper and lower with a 24 inch Krieger barrel chambered by them with 1-7.7 twist match chamber. I put on a Geissele match trigger and a white oak armament 6 way adjustable butt stock and matching float tube and topped it off with a Nightforce 4.5 SR scope. I can shoot sub MOA 5 shot groups off of a sling with this rifle but for some reason always send 2 into the 9 ring when I try a 20 shot group. I do not blame the rifle, wish I could, but I can't. This rifle is not fussy at all.

    77 gr SMK, lake city brass, remington 7 1/2 primers, 24.0 grains N140, 2.260 OAL

    20181014_124025.jpg
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2020
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  17. Frank Blum

    Frank Blum Silver $$ Contributor

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    And the 77s. 20200405_135032.jpg

    ARs are hard for me to shoot of the bench and get consistent good groups. Took me a long time to shoot good every time out. I push the bag rider hard into the rest stop with the pistol grip and use a lot of shoulder pressure. Works for me.
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2020
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  18. chkunz

    chkunz Gold $$ Contributor

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    Visit a NRA or CMP high power rifle match some time and observe the prone slow fire stage of the match and see what the 20 shot groups for record look like for the Master and High Master class shooters. Then look to see what equipment and loads they use. There is a lot of research going on there and most will share with you.

    Then participate in this type of event yourself. You may not consider yourself to be a competitor but this is the best place to learn. You will be among the best marksmen with the best equipment and can learn directly from them and your own experience and then you can also teach other who have questions like yours.
     
  19. 338 Mollett

    338 Mollett Gold $$ Contributor

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    This also something to watch out for as most factory barrels have a "hope to hit a barn "throat in them.
     
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  20. 300_whisper

    300_whisper Silver $$ Contributor

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    My boss has a presidents 100 tab. This is spot on. Hes forgotten more than I currently know.
     

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