6.5 creedmoor lapua brass
- Thread starter vmaxpro
- Start date
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It's not far fetched in the slightest. I've heard from two different people who have reached out to Lapua to ask about it in the past few weeks. One was told "We are working on it" and "Not too long". The other was told that they are starting trial runs in the coming weeks, with a possible announcement date of Shot Show in January.
I'm very hopeful, would seriously consider a 6.5 Creedmore build if this came to fruition.
I'm very hopeful, would seriously consider a 6.5 Creedmore build if this came to fruition.
CJ6
Silver $$ Contributor
This ^^^^
CJ6
Silver $$ Contributor
Probably the same as why they don't make 6 Dasher brass, WSM brass or any of the RUM brass.. It's not like shooters haven't been begging them to make it that's for sure.and why wouldn't they if there is a demand in the market.
I thought that's how economy works
Because only Lapua produces 6.5X47L brass and ammunition, and only two manufacturers worldwide list rifles chambered for the cartridge - and there is no sign of that changing soon (or ever). 6.5X47L is consigned to a custom rifle / handloading niche which however we participants in this forum, Snipers Hide and a few others might see it, is a very small part of the free world's sporting rifle activities and overall market.
6.5 Creedmoor by comparison with the Lapua design (and 260 Rem) is a commercial 'winner' with an increasing number of rifle and ammunition manufacturers adopting it. Lapua therefore has a very hard choice - does it start producing Creedmoor brass and maybe ammo that will sell very well especially in North America, or does it 'protect' its own creation?
They are producing 'unfinished' 6.5 Creedmoor brass with your choice of primer pocket! Just a little bit of work on my end to complete it
. Oh, and nevermind that .308 headstamp
. Kinda like the 80% rule parts for AR receivers....kinda.
It would be nice if they made factory Creed....that is big advantage of the 6.5 x 47 over the Creedmoor....great factory brass.
Actually, making the 6.5 Creed from .308 is fun for me as I recruit my father who loves anything associated with reloading and shooting (his eyesight keeps him out of competitive shooting) and he can live vicariously as we prepare and test match loadings.
. Oh, and nevermind that .308 headstamp. Kinda like the 80% rule parts for AR receivers....kinda.It would be nice if they made factory Creed....that is big advantage of the 6.5 x 47 over the Creedmoor....great factory brass.
Actually, making the 6.5 Creed from .308 is fun for me as I recruit my father who loves anything associated with reloading and shooting (his eyesight keeps him out of competitive shooting) and he can live vicariously as we prepare and test match loadings.
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This is my first creedmoor, its not bad. But when I rebarrel Im without a doubt going to the x47 just for this reason. I got persuaded into the CM for the " great" factory ammo. It does shoot pretty good but it is extremely hot in my gun.For guys with loose firing pin fit the creedmore or 260 is a winner. That said, 6creed of just going to cut into 47L sales. It doesn't make sense UNLESS someone like Prime Ammo has approached them and guaranteed about a million pieces out of the box. That should pay for R&D and tooling.
I do see it as a different situations than the Dasher as well. Up until last month (and probably still for now) 99% of the Dashers out there were re-formed Lapua 6BR brass. Making Dasher brass just cuts into the 6BR sales. So it's a zero sum gain in sales + the added expense of R&D, getting it through CIP and tooling. What is their incentive?
In the end, I would prefer Lapua make all the brass I use. I love it, even with the BS undersized flash holes and 2-4% of the shoulders creased or rolled right out of the box. When it comes to the creedmore brass, if they do make it I wonder how many shooters are going to need to recut their chambers? Who knows what the external dimensions will be? I'm sure they will make it to fit at least one of the current factory chambers, but which one? If it's the tight arse RPR chamber, some guys may be chasing a reamer into their barrels....
I do see it as a different situations than the Dasher as well. Up until last month (and probably still for now) 99% of the Dashers out there were re-formed Lapua 6BR brass. Making Dasher brass just cuts into the 6BR sales. So it's a zero sum gain in sales + the added expense of R&D, getting it through CIP and tooling. What is their incentive?
In the end, I would prefer Lapua make all the brass I use. I love it, even with the BS undersized flash holes and 2-4% of the shoulders creased or rolled right out of the box. When it comes to the creedmore brass, if they do make it I wonder how many shooters are going to need to recut their chambers? Who knows what the external dimensions will be? I'm sure they will make it to fit at least one of the current factory chambers, but which one? If it's the tight arse RPR chamber, some guys may be chasing a reamer into their barrels....
WD
Grimstod
Machinist, Designer, and Shooter.
6.5x47 lapua makes up Lapuas second largest cartridge by sales (after 308W because a lot of military guys in Europe use it). Its doing very good. Remember Lapua is a small company that tailors to the custom guys. Not mass market stuff like Hornady. Lapua had even been hard pressed to keep up with the sales of 47L brass lately. I would say they are making plenty of money on it.
Grimstod
Machinist, Designer, and Shooter.
With all of these factors below in Lapuas favor why would they make Creedmoor brass?
The 6.5x47 is more accurate then the 6.5 Creedmoor.
I once considered the Creedmoor and asked this same question on many forums. What I asked was if anyone who has both a Creedmoor and a 47L, of their two guns which was more accurate. The answer was 100% unanimously the 47L so I went with the 47L.
Since then other things have come up that have convinced me further of the virtues of the 47L vs Creedmoor.
In this article the author of rifle shooter.com states very plainly that the 47L is more accurate.
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2016/03/6-5-creedmoor-barrel-cut-down-velocity-tests/
Another major thing to think about is the life of the brass. Lapua's last 25 reloads at worst case scenario. While Creedmoor guys struggle to get 10 reloads and most only get 5-7. That means the brass ages fast and it changes from shot to shot a lot more then the Lapua does. This I believe is a major reason for the greater accuracy of the 47L.
I will include a nice graph for you by Precisionrifleblog.com As can be seen in this graph if you shoot a 47L you are much more likely to place or win in PRS. As you can see the numbers for both the 6mm and 6.5mm version are better for the 47L then the Creedmoor. By the way a smaller number is better in this graph.
Next and probably LARGEST REASON the 47L is more accurate is that the 47L has set a hug slough of world records. The Creedmoor has yet to produce ANY and don't anyone say that is because no on is shooting it. There are a ton of people shooting it thanks to excellent marketing. But once again it has yet to produce any winning results.
Next there is that primer pocket. The USA Palma team has proven that small primers produce a smaller ES. And that gives the 47L an edge in accuracy. http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2013/11/308-winchester-large-vs-small-flash-hole-test/
Then there is the cost. At first you would think the CM is cheeper to shoot right? NO it is not. Think of it this way.
A batch of Lapua brass costs $105 for 100. Creedmoor costs $66 for a batch of 100. Noe divide both of those $ by the number of reloads you get out of each. The Creedmoor you are guaranteed to get at least 5 reloads.... well ok lets be nice and say 10 even though practically no one does. That works out to be $0.066 ea. While the Lapua gets at worst 25 reloads that works out to be $0.042 ea reload. That is an astounding 50% difference in cost with the Lapua coming out to be much cheaper to shoot. And we are not even connoting that Small primers are cheaper and the 47L needs less powder to get the same performance as the CM.
Lastly remember that these to cartridges are basically Balistic twins. Both do the same thing ballistically.
I see only one reason to by a Creedmoor. That is factory ammo. If you do not reload then get a Creedmoor but if you reload then it would be stupid to get anything other then a 47L.
The 6.5x47 is more accurate then the 6.5 Creedmoor.
I once considered the Creedmoor and asked this same question on many forums. What I asked was if anyone who has both a Creedmoor and a 47L, of their two guns which was more accurate. The answer was 100% unanimously the 47L so I went with the 47L.
Since then other things have come up that have convinced me further of the virtues of the 47L vs Creedmoor.
In this article the author of rifle shooter.com states very plainly that the 47L is more accurate.
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2016/03/6-5-creedmoor-barrel-cut-down-velocity-tests/
Another major thing to think about is the life of the brass. Lapua's last 25 reloads at worst case scenario. While Creedmoor guys struggle to get 10 reloads and most only get 5-7. That means the brass ages fast and it changes from shot to shot a lot more then the Lapua does. This I believe is a major reason for the greater accuracy of the 47L.
I will include a nice graph for you by Precisionrifleblog.com As can be seen in this graph if you shoot a 47L you are much more likely to place or win in PRS. As you can see the numbers for both the 6mm and 6.5mm version are better for the 47L then the Creedmoor. By the way a smaller number is better in this graph.
Next and probably LARGEST REASON the 47L is more accurate is that the 47L has set a hug slough of world records. The Creedmoor has yet to produce ANY and don't anyone say that is because no on is shooting it. There are a ton of people shooting it thanks to excellent marketing. But once again it has yet to produce any winning results.
Next there is that primer pocket. The USA Palma team has proven that small primers produce a smaller ES. And that gives the 47L an edge in accuracy. http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2013/11/308-winchester-large-vs-small-flash-hole-test/
Then there is the cost. At first you would think the CM is cheeper to shoot right? NO it is not. Think of it this way.
A batch of Lapua brass costs $105 for 100. Creedmoor costs $66 for a batch of 100. Noe divide both of those $ by the number of reloads you get out of each. The Creedmoor you are guaranteed to get at least 5 reloads.... well ok lets be nice and say 10 even though practically no one does. That works out to be $0.066 ea. While the Lapua gets at worst 25 reloads that works out to be $0.042 ea reload. That is an astounding 50% difference in cost with the Lapua coming out to be much cheaper to shoot. And we are not even connoting that Small primers are cheaper and the 47L needs less powder to get the same performance as the CM.
Lastly remember that these to cartridges are basically Balistic twins. Both do the same thing ballistically.
I see only one reason to by a Creedmoor. That is factory ammo. If you do not reload then get a Creedmoor but if you reload then it would be stupid to get anything other then a 47L.
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