Would I benefit from upgrading my dies?

[mikeinct]

Nope. I have two, the old & the new one. Hate them both.. I take a sized case & insert the bullet I'm using to find the lands. I save them. to compare the throat wear every two to three hundred shots. I use the Sinclair nuts to measure the cartridge to the lands measurement. Keep it simple.. Mike in Ct

 

[Liven The Dream]

I have been reloading since the late 60's and have always just used standard RCBS FL dies. My shooting is just casual benchrest and the maximum range that I have available is 300 yds.

The rifles I am most interested in improving the accuracy for are a Rem 700 BDL varmint in 243 and a Savage model 12fv varmint in 6.5 Creedmoor. Both just stock rifles.

My question is would better dies improve the quality of my ammo enough to make upgrading worth while?

If so, what would you suggest that I get? I would think that concentricity would be t red he area that would yield biggest gain, what else should I be thinking about? Would just adding a lee collet die be of value?

Save the money on Dies ...
Upgrade to Gold .

 

[ckrifles]

You are obviously looking for an improvement in accuracy. Upgrading your dies is one of the cheapest options you have. You are definitely not going to degrade your accuracy. Go for it.

 

[Uncle Ed]

@Uncle Ed

I have been reloading since the late 60's and have always just used standard RCBS FL dies. My shooting is just casual benchrest and the maximum range that I have available is 300 yds.

The rifles I am most interested in improving the accuracy for are a Rem 700 BDL varmint in 243 and a Savage model 12fv varmint in 6.5 Creedmoor. Both just stock rifles.

My question is would better dies improve the quality of my ammo enough to make upgrading worth while?

If so, what would you suggest that I get? I would think that concentricity would be the area that would yield biggest gain, what else should I be thinking about? Would just adding a lee collet die be of value?

Watch the video below for the inside finish of the die and the runout figures and sizing and expanding methods.
For simplicity with my Forster dies I use the dies floating expander and get very little runout. In my opinion, you can take any brand die remove the expander and use a expander die to expand the necks to reduce neck runout.

Ultimate 6.5 Creedmoor sizing die comparison

 

[Ralph Littlefield]

Watch the video below for the inside finish of the die and the runout figures and sizing and expanding methods.
For simplicity with my Forster dies I use the dies floating expander and get very little runout. In my opinion, you can take any brand die remove the expander and use a expander die to expand the necks to reduce neck runout.

Ultimate 6.5 Creedmoor sizing die comparison

Thank you for posting that. It certainly highlights the difference in fit and finish. The difference in runout was also interesting.

It would be helpful to take it a step further and show how those differences affect the results on target, after all, that is the bottom line.

 

[Uncle Ed]

Thank you for posting that. It certainly highlights the difference in fit and finish. The difference in runout was also interesting.

It would be helpful to take it a step further and show how those differences affect the results on target, after all, that is the bottom line.

The U.S. Army considers "Match Grade" ammunition to have .003 or less bullet runout.

I tested my Forster full length dies by removing the factory expander and using a expander die to expand the necks vs the Forster expander. The neck runout was so close it was not worth sizing the cases twice using a expander die. The Forster high mounted floating expander expands the necks while they are held and centered in the neck of the die.

If you neck turn or just use one brand of brass Forster will hone the dies neck to your desired diameter for $12.00. Below the 6.5 Guys are getting "LESS" neck runout with the Forster full length dies vs Redding bushing dies.

With my RCBS dies I installed Forster expander and spindle assemblies, below RCBS and Forster expanders.

Below a modified Forster expander fitted to my Redding .243 FL die to reduce drag and neck runout. The spindle was cut and shortened and a rubber o-ring was added under the lock ring to allow it to float.

 

[snert]

Best accuracy for th e money i ever spent on factory rifles was a Redding Comp seat die and the ability to systematically change seating depth as I developed loads.

 

[Dusty Stevens]

Its a pure pleasure and a stress-free task using a die properly fitted to your chamber

 

[mikeinct]

IDK Snert, I'm a cheap skate. Those comp seaters are expensive.[ I only own one in 22 caliber] grin. Anyway, I think the stem / bullet seating cup in the seating die should be as closely matched to the shape of your preferred bullets shape as possible. I want no marks on my reloads/bullets from that tool . mike in ct

 

[Ralph Littlefield]

The U.S. Army considers "Match Grade" ammunition to have .003 or less bullet runout.

I tested my Forster full length dies by removing the factory expander and using a expander die to expand the necks vs the Forster expander. The neck runout was so close it was not worth sizing the cases twice using a expander die. The Forster high mounted floating expander expands the necks while they are held and centered in the neck of the die.

If you neck turn or just use one brand of brass Forster will hone the dies neck to your desired diameter for $12.00. Below the 6.5 Guys are getting "LESS" neck runout with the Forster full length dies vs Redding bushing dies.

With my RCBS dies I installed Forster expander and spindle assemblies, below RCBS and Forster expanders.

Below a modified Forster expander fitted to my Redding .243 FL die to reduce drag and neck runout. The spindle was cut and shortened and a rubber o-ring was added under the lock ring to allow it to float.

With regard to concentricity, which would you recommend that I add to my tools, a lee collet die, a Sinclair mandrel die, or a Forster sizing die. I must say that I am impressed by what you have shown me about the Forster die. Perhaps I should look at adding a Forster expander/decapping stem to my RCBS dies?

 

[XLR308]

The Lee collet neck die is a cheap and effective addition to a die set you allready own.
It will also help extend your brass life by working it as minimal as possible if you aren't running near max loads for your rifle that would require FL sizing after every firing.
There is also the issue of your chamber dimensions versus what your FL sizing die is working the brass down to and then having to open the necks back up with an expander.either on the stem of the die or a mandrel.
With my lapua 308 Palma brass I neck turned to .014" I could get 3-4 loadings pushing a 178amax at 2650 fps before I had any hint of resistance on bolt lift using a Lee collet die.
Out of those 200 pieces of brass my average TIR was consistently around .001" with about 10 that would be in the .003-004" range that I would use for sighted or fouling shots.
My Redding Type S die sets can't do any better.

 

[mikeinct]

Ralph L wrote... " Perhaps I should look at adding a Forster expander/decapping stem to my RCBS dies? " Me 2 Ralph ..That trick showed me something that might be worth trying. It would save me some time over my process. mike in ct