Which progressive press and why

[Nomo4me]

Dillon is great if you don't mind shelves full of powder blue accessories in die-cast stands. Wear your "blue koolaid" hat while loading for the full effect.

I had a 550 and sold it with no regrets. Hated the clackety-clack of the horizontal motion of the dispenser and pulling brass pins if I needed to pull a case.
I love my LNL and load up 223 and 6br ammo on it for my PD shooting. I use lapua brass and redding bushing sizer and BR seater dies in it and my guns have no problem averaging under 1/2" with said ammo and benchmark powder. I do my development work and anything using large rifle primers on the co-ax and that ammo is usually a bit more accurate but I can't load up 1000's of rounds on the co-ax. Just don't have the time.

 

[Kenny474]

I went with the presses I own for a few different reasons, budget and brand loyalty after good service are likely the biggest influences, but I have been happy with what I own. I honestly could have went with a Dillon or Hornady when I bought my Lee, but I tried the Lee and liked it, so I bought one. After a few thousand rounds, I have no regrets. I don't load real "precision ammo" on it, so I can't say how it would do. But what I do use it for is consistent, so I don't think it would be all too bad.

I use a Lee Classic Turret when I need a lot of precision ammo, and I recently modified a shell plate so the dies float similar to what John Whidden does with the Dillon tool heads. It now loads nearly as good as my Lee Classic Cast, which loads exceptional ammo.

But for what I do, the system I have works excellently. I wouldn't change a thing. Yes, the Dillons are really nice, but I don't need one and they are a bit pricey for me. And honestly, the cost would limit it's usefulness for me, as I couldn't afford to set it up for as many calibers as I have my Lee.

All in all, there are many factors that go into why someone buys anything. For me, it's often cost, as I am not wealthy by any stretch. I get by and do OK, but I need to be cautious of where I spend my cash so I can afford to do the things I want, like go shooting when I want to. So if you're poor like me, then you might have to stick with Lee. ;D

Kenny

 

[xr650rRider]

The rcbs is a contraption imho. The dillon works the same way and changing the powder measure is as simple as 2 screws and a nut. By the way the buttons you speak of are there so you can remove a shell at each location to pull a bad component if you do notice something not quite right.You dont need more than 1 powder measure which comes with it.It takes 2 pins to remove the die plate as well.

Quite astute. Any mechanical device is a contraption. The Pro 2000 has less moving parts and is all cast iron not aluminum. I know that doesn't have a thing to do with anything but some like to argue it does. I had to use tweezers to remove the locator buttons to remove a case at each position. The RCBS has spring clips you just pull the case out. Much easier to use single stage. Not having to fill primer tubes just pull out a strip and insert was worth the difference all by itself.

 

[minnesota]

If it is that much better, how come other manufacturers are still very popular.I have shot some sub .25 inch groups using the LNL, with 223 rem.
I read about problems with the powder dispensers, not one with mine. switching calibers is as easy as ever with the LNL. The only thing I can see that the dillion has on the LNL is getting the cases to the shell plate.

I could only speculate as to the answer to that one...If you own one of the others it's probably like having an ugly baby...It's still your baby. I suspect if one could find the sales figures for the top four...Dillon would have a far and away lead.

Did you ever think that you have the ugly baby, I thought when you guys go blue you never change colors. Maybe nomo4me has already figured out that the dillion is the step child. And for the record I am sure each has it's finer points, but you dillion guys are like a bad cult. ???

 

[jonbearman]

The tweezers to pull out the buttons.You obviously had an early 550b,that problem was fixed as well as the spring loaded powder measure.I know both machines work (rcbs)(dillon) but your complaints are with early type machines and it has been addressed.We all like different things for many reasons.Personally I love rcbs stuff,and there are people on here that say there dies suck because they live down the street from redding etc etc etc .We just differ in opinion and thats the only thing that seperates us,however lets just get on with our lives and shoot till the cows come home.

 

[Kenny474]

Hornady does make a nice progressive, but Dillon is a rather large company and has based 80% of it's entire product line on progressive presses and accessories alone. And considering that they seem to be prospering, they evidently have something that is very desirable.

The Blue stuff doesn't come cheap either. Most all of it costs serious bank, and people are lining up credit card in hand to buy the stuff. The machine they sell to fill primer tubes, $300, the Rapid Trim 1200B, $275 w/die. This is not exactly cheap stuff! Yes, you can buy a basic 550 for $259, but it doesn't even come with a priming or powder system! You can buy a complete ready-to-load Lee Load Master for that, and in rifle and pistol calibers as well. The next cheapest press is the Square Deal, and it only does pistol rounds and needs special Dillon dies, it goes for $365.

Now things go up in price really fast with Dillon. A true ready-to-load 550B is $420, a 650 is $550, and the 1050 is $1600. And it's not like they don't sell many 1050's either! Then you have the .50cal BFR, which goes for $1000. You don't exactly buy a Dillon with the change in your ashtray, but the guys who want a top-notch progressive will line up, cash in hand, ready to drop $$$$ on them and a host of accessories to load massive quantities of precision ammo.

The real difference between the Dillon's and the rest, is the massive amount of aftermarket support as well. There are machines to run the press 100% automated, CNC toolheads, and a bunch of other upgrades as well. And it's not that they aren't a great press to start. These are upgrades to make these presses go beyond what most progressives were ever meant to do, in precision as well as production.

Now I'm not knocking the other guys, but they just don't come close to Dillon when it comes to serious gear for the progressive reloader. None of the other major companies (Lee, Hornady, Lyman, Redding, etc) make a machine comparable to the 1050, it's basically in a class of it's own. You can load enough rounds in one hour to cook a 6.5-.284 barrel with a 1050! The Hornady just can't compete with that.

Kenny

FWIW, I don't own a Dillon and likely never will. I love my Lee and stand behind it 100%. I feel every machine has it's place, and your needs should dictate what color your press is more than anything. Don't just buy a blue press because "it's nice", buy what is going to work best for you in your situation because it has the features you need and it will do what you want. Just because it's blue doesn't mean it's automatically what you need.

 

[jonbearman]

To show you what a dillon can do: I just loaded 45 test rounds for my ar-15 and tested the loaded cartridge for run-out.This is the result: .0008-.001 thousandths run-out.The dillon and others can do this with patience.

 

[JOHN708]

If your interested in the Hornady lock and load I bought a new press that I never used. Nothing wrong with it, I decided I didn't need a progressive press. I intend to sell it at a good price. If your interested send me a PM.

John Skowron

 

[xr650rRider]

To show you what a dillon can do: I just loaded 45 test rounds for my ar-15 and tested the loaded cartridge for run-out.This is the result: .0008-.001 thousandths run-out.The dillon and others can do this with patience.

After you fill that 30 round mag and hit the bolt release, they won't be that runout after they bounce off the feed ramp shoving home. Guess what...........I won't matter they'll still shoot the same.

 

[Kenny474]

To show you what a dillon can do: I just loaded 45 test rounds for my ar-15 and tested the loaded cartridge for run-out.This is the result: .0008-.001 thousandths run-out.The dillon and others can do this with patience.

After you fill that 30 round mag and hit the bolt release, they won't be that runout after they bounce off the feed ramp shoving home. Guess what...........I won't matter they'll still shoot the same.

I have actually seen tests on this idea, and it takes a bit to hurt the concentricity of a loaded round, usually more than going up the feed ramp of an AR. I thought the same thing, and then after seeing the tests did a bit of my own, and it does take more than you would think to hurt a loaded round.

Kenny

 

[minnesota]

Basically what everyone is trying to say is they are all happy with the rigs they run. It is your turn to make your decision, your situation will depict what machine you will run with.
Have fun looking at all of the adds and deciding. ;D
Alot of gun nuts are like the clip on the web page below

http://www.xtranormal.com/watch/8122723/

 

[Grmart]

Hi everyone,

I'm the FNG here.

I've been using a Dillion 650 for 10 years and it has worked very well for me. I also load about 500 rounds of 12 ga a week on a Dillion SL900 (trap shooter) and that machine just keeps on cranking them out.
One of the best things about a Dillion is their no BS warranty. If you have a problem of a part break just call the tech dept and help and/or a new part will be on the way, no charge. Even if you bought it used, tha warranty is the same.

Cheers,

George

 

[benelli7979]

I gotta say that what I am hearing here most is that the dilon reloaders either are not built well or have been miss used people are claiming a great warranty. From what i have read here they have a no BS warranty. I have been reloading for awhile and as of yet(knock on wood) had not had to use the warranty for anything lee, or rcbs. I appreciate all of the replys from people but i dont care to much about a warranty, i care about functionality, reliabilty and ease of use. again i am not trying to bash dilon or anybody else. I would like to know about these details for both presses though as i have not used either. Thanks

 

[xr650rRider]

With a progressive you will bend some parts and you will break some parts because your moving alot of ammo thru them. If your planning on NOT breaking anything, then you don't need a progressive as you don't shoot enough.

 

[benelli7979]

what are some of the things that break on them

 

[xr650rRider]

On mine, since I bought the Pro 2000 when it first came out, it had a different strip priming system than what they come with now. The ratchet stips would break. They sent an entire tool head assembly to replace it as well as new style ratchets to replace if they broke. The new priming system needed the frame opened up slightly and without doing that it broke the cam system that actuates the priming arm. I've bent the springs that hold the cases on the shell plate too far and they have replaced the whole top plate. I've gone thru more decapping assembly pins in the dies than anything. You get a case cocked and I've bent the entire rod not just broke the pin off. The more ammo you load the chances of a failure of some kind usually goes up. I've never paid RCBS for any part. They even sent me a new dial indicator for a Case Master that I bought used. I'm sure all the manufacturers are the same. I've only had trouble with Redding. I bent a decapping assembly on a .270 Win die and had to pay for it. I try not to buy there equipment.

 

[Kenny474]

With a single stage or even an auto indexing turret like my Lee Classic Turret, you can easily watch the case to be sure it's lined up and there are very few moving parts as well. This just makes for a simpler machine that you can more easily stop before an issue arises. And really, what can possibly break on a single stage? Unless, of course, it's grossly misused and abused, though on rare occasion they can and will break during hard, but normal, use. But they usually have very few moving parts of robust design that are not prone to breakage.

I have however broken a Lee press :, bent a Lee press handle, damaged a Lee die, destroyed an RCBS decapping rod (the rod, not the pin) as well as countless pins, and have broken and bunged up numerous other pieces that I thought would never break. All of it was replaced for free, with the exception of the press handle, as I made a much stronger unit as the original was hollow. ??? This was all damaged while using a single stage press.

But I use my gear and use it hard. I am not easy on it, and I ask a lot of it regularly.

Now when it comes to a progressive, you likely have 20 moving parts to every one on a single stage, actually there are likely more than even that. And you are not watching every round that goes around the shell plate all the time, as it's impossible to watch between 3 and 6 stations at once, especially when you are pounding out 150-300 rounds an hour. You just rely on it to work and do it's job. But then cases tip, primers stick, stupid stuff happens and stuff gets broken or bent. It's the nature of the beast. Not to mention with all the moving parts there are multiple bushings, wear points and pivots, etc. that will eventually wear out and need replacement.

It's like comparing a bicycle to a motorcycle. The motorcycle has many more moving parts and will need more maintenance as well as parts replaced than the bicycle. But it also does a lot more as well.

Don't get me wrong, progressives are robust machines and most are very well built and engineered. But they do have many more moving parts and as such will need more maintenance and have a much higher chance of having a breakage of some kind.

But since I have had my Lee Load Master, not sure exactly but around 8-10 months maybe, I have not had anything major break or bend and I have loaded several thousand rounds of pistol ammo alone on it.

It's just the nature of the beast. When it's more complex, it has more to go wrong, and then Murohy's law kicks in.

Kenny

 

[jimbires]

I've got a Hornady with the brass feeder . I shoot some bullseye pistol matches . I load around 10,000 rounds of 45acp per season , and I've shot 3 seasons . the only thing that has happened to this set up is the spring that holds the brass cases into the shellholder plate got buggered up . I caused the problem by taking the case out to dump the powder on my scale to check the charge it was metering . I pulled a case out numerous times making adjustments and must have pulled the spring out of place because it was only a stroke or two and I had the retainer spring smashed . I called Hornady and bought 10 of them . I think they were $1.50 each . I'm not asking for warranty for $1.50 spring , so I couldn't say how their warranty would have been on this . I would buy this press and brass feeder again , I like it . Jim

 

[cfrazier77]

I have a Hornady LNL progressive and have found their customer service is excellent. I had bent the ejection wire to try to clear a die and messed it up. When I called to buy one they would not let me and said they would send it to me for free. I told them it was my fault and not theirs, but they would still not let me pay.

Here is a second and even better account. My wife called Hornady at the beginning of December to order the conversion kit for me for Christmas. It changes to the new improved ejection system. They said that they did not have any in stock and machined them once per month. After my wife asked when it would be this month since it was a Christmas present the lady on the phone asked to put her on hold and got a hold of the machinist and had him make it that day. She promised my wife that she would have it in time for Christmas. My wife was very impressed.