What release agent with DevCon Plastic Steel?

[Alex Wheeler]

Yes that article is why everyone thinks marine tex shrinks less. I have measured it shrink so bad the bolt would bind if the action was torqued. Devon has never done that to me. I would guess I go through about 30 pounds of epoxy a year and was a staunch Marine tex guy until it caused me to have to re-do enough jobs to piss me off. But the majority of it was good stuff. It sure is nicer to work with and tools last a lot longer.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Yes that article is why everyone thinks marine tex shrinks less. I have measured it shrink so bad the bolt would bind if the action was torqued. Devon has never done that to me. I would guess I go through about 30 pounds of epoxy a year and was a staunch Marine tex guy until it caused me to have to re-do enough jobs to piss me off. But the majority of it was good stuff. It sure is nicer to work with and tools last a lot longer.

I’ve had bad Devcon too. One batch would cure and have these porous white spots that weren’t hard. Another two cans were bad the second I opened them. You’re gonna get that with anything. Especially if you use high quantities. Hence the testing jig I suggested.

You haven’t used very much Devcon if you haven’t got a bad batch yet.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Probably only a couple hundred pounds.
All I am saying is that I have used both, I bed 60-70 stocks a year. Devcon is a more consistent product in my limited experience.
Back to op, kiwi johnsons paste, ext. Any wax that has a film and you can buff. The nicer you buff it, the nicer the job turns out. Dont be scared and leave it thick. It will come apart if you buff it off.
Another tip, mix your epoxy by weight, not volume. Devcon steel putty is 9 to 1 by weight.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Well as Speedy says,
“I’ll tell you what I know or do, but it’s not my job to convince anyone to do it my way”

 

[Alex Wheeler]

I think the op has his answer so I will ad a little to this about bedding jobs.
All epoxy shrinks. And based on my experience, different lots shrink differently. Its unavoidable. However the amount in the thickness we use would be hard to measure. The epoxy debate will likely never end, but the discussion should really be about how to deal with the shrinkage. What I do is try to keep the epoxy layer thickness as even as possible. That keeps the shrinkage even. I also set the pillars to the bottom of the inlet. If your action is setting on 2 pillars and the epoxy shrinks, what does it matter how much? It is either touching or its not. Any shrinkage will pull away from the action. On real sloppy inlets you have to bed twice so the final layer is even. Like I said earlier, you should be able to produce a good job with any of them. Keep in mind the stocks we are using, composite stocks are full of epoxy end to end, how much shrinkage do they have over time? And wood stocks never stop moving through their life. The thin layer of bedding wont stop that. All of these reasons are why Im a fan of the glue in. But thats not always practical.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Yeah glue in definitely would solve a lot of issues

 

[blvedere]

I think the op has his answer so I will ad a little to this about bedding jobs.
All epoxy shrinks. And based on my experience, different lots shrink differently. Its unavoidable. However the amount in the thickness we use would be hard to measure. The epoxy debate will likely never end, but the discussion should really be about how to deal with the shrinkage. What I do is try to keep the epoxy layer thickness as even as possible. That keeps the shrinkage even. I also set the pillars to the bottom of the inlet. If your action is setting on 2 pillars and the epoxy shrinks, what does it matter how much? It is either touching or its not. Any shrinkage will pull away from the action. On real sloppy inlets you have to bed twice so the final layer is even. Like I said earlier, you should be able to produce a good job with any of them. Keep in mind the stocks we are using, composite stocks are full of epoxy end to end, how much shrinkage do they have over time? And wood stocks never stop moving through their life. The thin layer of bedding wont stop that. All of these reasons are why Im a fan of the glue in. But thats not always practical.

Is there any way to get a glue in apart? Such as heat or cold, put the stock in the freezer or oven.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

Is there any way to get a glue in apart? Such as heat or cold, put the stock in the freezer or oven.

Heat. Around 300 degrees. Glue in is not really something you want to do on a rifle action that does not have a trigger hanger and side bolt release, ie; factory Rem 700 or anything else with a pinned trigger.

I recall reading a thread years ago where Alex heats his action wrench to transfer the heat to the receiver. Pretty ingenious method. Others use a clothing iron on top of the receiver scope rail to transfer the heat. But that’s not so good if your scope rail is not integral and you have bedded the rail to the receiver

I’ve heard of people putting them in chest freezers overnight but not sure how well that works. Heat seems to be to normal consensus

 

[Alex Wheeler]

Like Ledd said, most epoxy will let go at 250-300 degrees. You can strip the action bare with it glued in so theres no reason to un glue them. Assuming it has a trigger hanger. But the main reason I do not do it on sporters is the tapered barrel wont come out of the barrel channel so you would have to unglue every time you wanted a new barrel.

 

[Edd]

Yes that article is why everyone thinks marine tex shrinks less. I have measured it shrink so bad the bolt would bind if the action was torqued. Devon has never done that to me. I would guess I go through about 30 pounds of epoxy a year and was a staunch Marine tex guy until it caused me to have to re-do enough jobs to piss me off. But the majority of it was good stuff. It sure is nicer to work with and tools last a lot longer.

Which Devcon product do you use?

 

[AlNyhus]

The Johnson or Kiwi works well as a release agent. My preference is the mold release wax that comes with the Score High Pro Bed....basically an industrial mold release wax.

Having tried several of the aerosol mold release agents, I always go back to the wax/buff X's 2 method. You want a clean release so you're not pulling on the epoxy and slightly distorting it as you come out with the barrelled action. Years ago, I made a fixture to pull the barrelled action straight up out of the stock...works great.

Good shootin'. -Al

 

[eddief]

I have used them all over the years, plus a lot of exotics from a buddy in the boiler business. With that being said, I have seen the inconsistencies with Marine Tex. Honestly, never cared for it. Speedy's article is not gospel and any time you change a variable in a test, the shrinkage levels will change and one that performs best the first time, doesn't next time. For me, Devcon over Marine Tex. The outrageously expensive Steel-Bed by Brownells is by far the best I have used over the years. It simply shrinks very little and consistently does the same properties wise every time.

 

[Ledd Slinger]

I have used them all over the years, plus a lot of exotics from a buddy in the boiler business. With that being said, I have seen the inconsistencies with Marine Tex. Honestly, never cared for it. Speedy's article is not gospel and any time you change a variable in a test, the shrinkage levels will change and one that performs best the first time, doesn't next time. For me, Devcon over Marine Tex. The outrageously expensive Steel-Bed by Brownells is by far the best I have used over the years. It simply shrinks very little and consistently does the same properties wise every time.

Yeah definitely inconsistencies in most epoxies. Have not tried Steel Bed. Might have to check it out.

For scope ring bedding I use JB Weld. Never had inconsistencies with JB to date (fingers crossed) and it has an amazingly long shelf life. I’d imagine it shrinks a little more than some others but it’s good stuff. Recently bedded an entire action with JB on a varmint rifle of mine just to see how it performs over time. Will see...

 

[boltfluter]

Great thread guys! Finally something interesting to read about with actual fact based info.

 

[Jud96]

Has anyone ever bedded a rifle with JB Weld or Pro Bed 2000?

 

[Alex Wheeler]

I have not used JB to bed but I have used pro bed. It was a little too thick for my liking. Probably would work good for guys in a warmer climate.

 

[painter]

I use SEM 39747 two-part epoxy for replacement panels on cars and trucks, it somewhat thinner than Devcon, how can I measure shrinkage?

 

[Jud96]

I have not used JB to bed but I have used pro bed. It was a little too thick for my liking. Probably would work good for guys in a warmer climate.

Did the Pro Bed setup well? I used Marine Tex on a couple rifles but I I’ll be going back to Devcon. I think it’s easier to work with and seems to be more forgiving and gets less air bubbles and imperfections in my limited experience.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

I didnt have any trouble with how it set up.

 

[Shooter71]

After mixing marine tex I place it in a vacuum chamber.