what gives?

[rinky]

Ok so i reloaded a few rounds today and necksized them only, they were once fire winchester brass and everything was fine but when i tried to chamber them they all did not want to go in the chamber and when i removed them and inspected them the berger bullet had a small spot on the ogive that you could see had been roughed up.

Im new to reloading and am pretty sure i used the necksizing die correctly, i twisted the die in, until it met the press arm and then turned the die back about an eighth of a turn. Am i doing something wrong??

 

[Jonathan Zimmerman]

You may be seating the bullet too far out. I only say that because of your comment about the ogive being roughed up. Of course that is only if you weren't intending to jam your bullets. Your neck tension would have to be high for that one unless the bullet is really out there. You could also see if a case will chamber without the bullet, and that should let you know if that is the problem. It may be something simple to check. Good luck.

 

[fdshuster]

Two very important measurements you need to know regarding your chamber: the actual throat length, and the headspace length. Throat for bullet seating depth, so you know if you are seating to touch, .020" off, .040" off, etc. and headspace length so you are not pushing the shoulder back too far, or in your case, maybe not far enough. Sinclair and Hornady both make tools that take these measurements. I tool with different gage attachments for your dial caliper. The advice about screwing the die down 'til it touches the shell holder, then backing it off, whatever distance, is a "one size fits all", and not always good information. Get the measuring tool & find the true, actual dimensions. The use of the Hornady tool is very clearly described in a feature article on this sites home page.

 

[rinky]

Well i know its not me seating into the lands too far, i know exactly where they are at because i have the hornady oal guage but i don't know how far back im bumping the shoulder. And that could very well be it. I know the backing it off method isn't very precise. I may have to get that headspace guage and bump them back. .001 only.

Any other thoughts out there fellas?? Thanks for the help.

 

[wvuredneck09]

Are the bullets "marked" all the way around the ogive or to one side or another, helps determine the problem, where you loading one at a time or using the magazine to load the rounds in the gun?

 

[fdshuster]

I like to feel a little resistance when closing the bolt, and because of that try to keep the headspace length the same as the headspace of the fired case, as it came out of the chamber. When I feel the bolt getting just a little more difficult to close, I'll push the shoulder back .001" or .002".

 

[rinky]

The scuff on the bullet is about a 1/8in squared and its only on one side of the bullet and i know its from me trying to push it intolerance the.chamber. i am loading the shells one at a time.i know feeling a little resistance is perfect but this was way too. Much.

 

[rinky]

Please excuse my phones typos haha.

 

[necchi]

Well i know its not me seating into the lands too far, i know exactly where they are at because i have the hornady oal guage

I'll leave it to the pro's, but it does sound like your jamming the bullet. Now don't get upset, but it's real easy to miss read a micrometer, maybe take a double or triple check on that measurement, slow down and take a real good look at it.

 

[Kenny474]

Simple way to solve the dilemma of if they are loaded too long or sized incorrectly, pull a bullet and chamber the empty case.

If you don't have a bullet puller, you can use your press and pliers or vise grips, though it junks the bullet. Just put the round in the press and raise the ram to the top with no die in the press. Grab the bullet with the pliers and lower the ram. Simple and quick.

 

[rinky]

No i definitely know im not jamming the bullet, the problem has only just occurred with fireformed brass.

 

[Kenny474]

Did you try to chamber a piece of brass without a bullet? Have you read the instructions that came with the dies, if there were any? If you have a mark on the ogive and the bullets are not hitting the rifling, do you know what it is contacting? What have you used to measure the distance from the base of the brass to the ogive and what is the measurement? How long does the round need to be to jam? What is the bullet weight and the loaded round's OAL? Have you measured the brass to make sure it isn't over max length? On rare occasions even new brass is close to being over, and a tight chamber will have issues if it stretches after firing and sizing. I read of that happening on another forum.

Also, if you are using a neck die you are not bumping the shoulder at all, you need a bump die or a full length die to bump the shoulder back, that's why it's called a neck sizing die as it only sizes the neck. What brand of dies are you using and what caliber is the rifle and is it a factory built rifle?

All of this info will be helpful in solving your dilemma. Also, your willingness to try what people suggest so as to eliminate possible problems will help as well. Lot's of the people on here have been reloading for many years and have a great deal of knowledge. I know little compared to some and I have been reloading for ten years, so it's nothing to be ashamed or upset about if you made a mistake, as we are trying to help you. Being open minded and accepting that something is wrong is the first step to finding a solution. Trying different things to fix the problem comes next.

First off, pull a bullet and see if the brass will chamber, as you can't shoot them anyway if they won't chamber. If it won't, we need to figure out why and how to solve it. If it will, than we are a lot closer to getting you back to the range with your own reloads.

Like I said, WE WANT TO HELP. I have never had brass that won't chamber after one firing and neck sizing, so something is wrong and we need to figure it out to get you back to the range.

Trying to help.
Kenny

My LEE and RCBS dies all state to screw in until contacting the ram and then adding 1/4 turn. That way you are compensating for any press flex and insuring the ram contacts the die and the brass is fully sized. Other dies often have different methods of set-up.

 

[rinky]

No, i was never trying to come off like i wasn't appreciative of the information you all are providing me with. It means alot to me.
I havent tried to chamber one of the cases yet. But i did try to chamber a new brass load a minute later and i even shot a 3shot group of them too. It was a half inch group at 100. No resistance to being chambered. The cases are definately not trimmed to length i know and that very well be the issue.

The gun is a factory remington 700 sendero sf2 in 7mm remington mag. Im using 168gr bergers and once fired winchester brass fired from my rifle earlier, never was a problem until i started to reload the used brass.

The biggest reason i have that makes me think it isn't the lands is that the scuff is the size of the base of the bullet and right where the ogive meets the main body of the bullet.

I am using a rcbs neck sizing die and i know that everyone on here is lightyears smarter than me. Not trying to offend anyone at all.

I haven't been able to check what it could be yet because im at a rodeo and using my phones internet to call upon all of the knowledge you guys have. Im at a rodeo a ways from home but will be able to check it out tonight and see if its the brass or not, really thinking it is. I couldn't find the instructions for the neck die.and was going by memory (or so i thought) haha. I do have a bullet pulled, oh and if i have a unfired primer in the case will the recapping rod set it off in the press?

Again i truly do appreciate all the help you're offering to me especially when its on your own time. Thanks.

MJ

 

[Kenny474]

I have deprimed live primers a few times, and while it's far from the safest, I have yet to have one go off. Though it's probably a good idea to keep your face back and wear safety glasses. Just be careful. Primers contain more energy than most people think, and can really hurt you.

Just go slow and easy.

 

[rinky]

Haha well i will be sure to loom away when i do it, i know a guy that had a 50bmg primer that he put ina view and set it off with a punch and a hammer. He said it damn near took out the windows in the garage lol. I will be sure to be super careful and look away, distance myself etc. And i will keep you all posted as to what i find out. Thanks.

MJ

 

[rinky]

Wow, after reading some of my posts, my phone likes to put in words close to what i typed... sorry about that.

On the bright side I took the bullets with the scuff mark to a buddy and he didnt really think its anything much, you cant feel it but it is visable. They do feed into the chamber but its not as simple as just closing the bolt. There is some resistance and it feels springy, its weird.

A case fits in the chamber just fine.

Back to the bright side, my buddy asked me if I wanted to shoot them and I decided to try em. I dialed the scope in to 6.5MOA and held on a rock the size of a basketball in the pasture by his place. At 450yds she hit dead center with a tail wind and low light.

Uploaded picture is of the scuff, turns out the scuff is just below where the ogive meets the body of the bullet and looks like a little barcode type marking.

I know last week when i first shot my necksized fireformed brass that it felt a little different when chambering but wasnt too this extent as these last couple rounds. They shot fine and grouped at .68MOA at 100 yards.

What do you guys think?

 

[wvuredneck09]

You need to get your chamber checked, looks like a ruff spot in the chamber to me, or you have a ridiculous amount of run-out, which u may have if your cases are over-sized to the point of jamming them in the chamber, thus resulting in the brass deforming to fit, pull a bullet like others have said to check for this, and then let us know what is happening.

 

[Kenny474]

Now you say your brass will chamber, correct? But loaded rounds feel springy? Is the empty brass springy? Are you running a compressed load?

How many rounds since cleaning and are you using something to scrub the throat?

 

[rinky]

There shoudnt be much runout since the gun is next to new, and the cases chamber just fine.

Its been about 80rounds since i last cleaned the chamber or barrel and it is dirty but i've been load developing, didn't want to change anything while i was looking for the best load.

 

[Kenny474]

Run-out in loaded rounds often has nothing to do with the chamber, and a lot to do with loading technique and process. If you have run-out in fired brass before sizing, you have a chamber issue.

I think you are looking at a carbon issue starting to develop. You need to keep the barrel clean until you break it in and actually see how long it can go without cleaning until accuracy suffers once you find an accurate load. So in reality, a clean barrel is essential to load development. You may need to shoot a few fouling shots, but going without cleaning will hinder far more than help, especially in a new barrel that has yet to smooth out.

Clean the barrel and use some JB or Iosso on the throat until it is clean and carbon free.