1%, as in .3 increments? That should be enough to bring this thread to life. How much money has been spent on scales to weigh within .01 of a grain and how many are splittling kernels?
Vertical Dispersion: Flat spots on the MV ladder test are meaningless
- Thread starter Beiruty
- Start date
Alex Wheeler
Site $$ Sponsor
.3% is about right for long range BR. Thats about one tenth of a grain in a 6bra. A lot of guys are going finer yet. 1% in LR BR is roughing in. I will go as course as .5% in the big magnums at LR. 1% is way too big at long range. If low es is your goal I wont argue because its not something I care about. Theres many different goals when it comes to tuning. Since we are talking ladders I will assume we are talking LR accuracy. That advice in your book is wrong. A pile of records support that statement. Now, in part I agree. Groups are better than ladders, but 1% is huge.
I dont like getting into these threads, but I also like to make sure people get good info. No matter what your needs are, find a successful person thats does it and ask them. If your into LR BR ask a winning LR BR shooter, if your into SR BR ask a winning SR BR shooter. If your into F-class ask a winning f-class shooter. If your into LR hunting ask a guy that is having success tuning his rifles. You want advice from those that are doing it and proving it.
I dont like getting into these threads, but I also like to make sure people get good info. No matter what your needs are, find a successful person thats does it and ask them. If your into LR BR ask a winning LR BR shooter, if your into SR BR ask a winning SR BR shooter. If your into F-class ask a winning f-class shooter. If your into LR hunting ask a guy that is having success tuning his rifles. You want advice from those that are doing it and proving it.
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LVLAaron
Gold $$ Contributor
To be fair, the non-highlighted part of the book says it's unreliable... And why I run the same ladder several times (all details and graphs posted earlier in the thread) But, I'm just an F-Classer.
I will not argue or defend that my way is the right way, but it's gotten me pretty far, so I stick with it... and I think you'd be hard pressed to find an FTR guy who says the sweet spot for juggernauts isn't 2725-2750 in a 30 inch barrel.
I will not argue or defend that my way is the right way, but it's gotten me pretty far, so I stick with it... and I think you'd be hard pressed to find an FTR guy who says the sweet spot for juggernauts isn't 2725-2750 in a 30 inch barrel.
/thread
When I started reading your post, I read the first part as “I’ll have to get a copy of that book for my target.” !
Sorry. Just where my brain went. Bottom line is information is just that, information. Some is good, some is bad and sometimes it is hard to distinguish the difference. With all the variables involved whatever you are told may not, and probably will not, apply in your particular situation with your particular rifle and cartridge. In the end the paper tells the story.
Dave.
CharlieNC
Gold $$ Contributor
I don't have the book, but this excerpt alone is not clear. It seems to infer a single shot ladder is not suitable using a Chrono, and that a number of shots are required for statistical significance; in my experience that would be 10. That's a lot to cover the fine increments. It also mentions charge ladder test on a target, but nothing more?
Yes sir, we can have in depth discussions, talk hypothetically, share information for discussion and analysis, but when it comes right down to it the only paper worth reading is the 1 we just poked holes in.
1 thing I've learned is all the different disciplines have a different methodology in which to achieve thier goal, and not all methods fit every discipline.
Finding tid bits of method to apply to ones practice/ development can be beneficial but is not the end all be all.
600 yard test. Do you call 29.7, 29.8 and 29.9 a flat spot? I couldn’t tell you the average velocity. I couldn’t tell you the ES. I couldn’t tell you the SD. I rarely chronograph.
What I can tell you is I absolutely love it when a lower powder charge impacts higher on the target than a higher powder charge does. I’ll pick it every single time. The target is all I really need. I do call it a flat spot, and 29.7 shot a record aggregate at 600 yard Nationals last year.
Dave.
What I can tell you is I absolutely love it when a lower powder charge impacts higher on the target than a higher powder charge does. I’ll pick it every single time. The target is all I really need. I do call it a flat spot, and 29.7 shot a record aggregate at 600 yard Nationals last year.
Dave.
It depends on how far you would be shooting
1) To reduce group size, adjust seating depth
2) To lower MV SD, start with good brass and hunt for OFPS
3) To reduce vertical dispersion, see chart in response #231
4) Adding a tuner is effectively acting as dampener for the muzzle vertical oscillation, flattening the curve in response #231
Acing the reading of the wind, would trump all the above.
With all respect to the lifestyle of the Amish people, I never saw an Amish debating Einstein on the presence of dark matter!
Like this ?
Attachments
12 ‘
Now send the Brick..I’ll bet a that brick back that half the guys responding didn’t read the theory op posted.
All kidding aside isn’t everyone saying the same thing ?
OFPS Theory.docx
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Impressive how you’re telling one of the best long range shooters of all time how to tune. Hilarious!
Bart
I am delighted to see you being amused. You are the smartest person to figure out that no novice shooter ever read this forum.
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