UPDATED again: new RANGE RESULTS - Need a starting point for 6.5 x 55 Swede.

[Mike7.62]

The CG-63 rifles were re-barreled for heavy target barrels using the 1:8.66" twist rate (220mm). The ammunition was most often M41 surplus. Privi Partizan makes brass and loaded ammunition for these rifles.

One thing to check for sure are the dimensions of the bore and groove. Using a lead slug, upset the slug so it fits the bore/groove snugly. Tap it out and measure it. There is a possibility that the groove diameter might as large as 0.265" rather than the now standardized 0.264".

Ahh. I thought that they had the same twist as the '96. Belay my last on the 150/156 bullets, but I would still give the 140/143's a shot-no pun intended.

Did they also shorten the leade in the CG series when they rebarreled, or did they keep it the same?

 

[Kurz]

There was a move by the Swedish government to the M41 ammunition for all military rifles. The chamber was optimized for the 143 grain bullet shape.

 

[logandiana]

I ordered some 6.5x55 Nosler brass on sale from midway, and a shooting buddy gave me a handful of Nosler RDF 130 grain bullets to try out. I've used Nosler brass before, but never tried their projectiles.We'll see what happens I suppose.

 

[tomswede]

The CG-63 rifles were re-barreled for heavy target barrels using the 1:8.66" twist rate (220mm). The ammunition was most often M41 surplus. Privi Partizan makes brass and loaded ammunition for these rifles.

One thing to check for sure are the dimensions of the bore and groove. Using a lead slug, upset the slug so it fits the bore/groove snugly. Tap it out and measure it. There is a possibility that the groove diameter might as large as 0.265" rather than the now standardized 0.264".

As a junior in the early 70’s in Sweden our club got some M41 from the government that was used for the junior program. No M41 ammo was generally available and could not be purchased. Most people were shooting Norma factory reloads “Silvertorped” that were similar to the M41. The top of the line ammo were loaded with 140 MK’s.
Nobody worried about twist, whatever the rifle came with.
Have not checked mine in a long time so I’m not sure about the lead. The current Sauer STR rifle has a shorter lead, not hard to get the desired distance to the lands in mine.
Have never seen anybody use the old 156gr load ( there were some around the club in the 70’s, a novelty that nobody shot).

 

[tomswede]

As a junior in the early 70’s in Sweden our club got some M41 from the government that was used for the junior program. No M41 ammo was generally available and could not be purchased. Most people were shooting Norma factory reloads “Silvertorped” that were similar to the M41. The top of the line ammo were loaded with 140 MK’s.
Nobody worried about twist, whatever the rifle came with.
Have not checked mine in a long time so I’m not sure about the lead. The current Sauer STR rifle has a shorter lead, not hard to get the desired distance to the lands in mine.
Have never seen anybody use the old 156gr load ( there were some around the club in the 70’s, a novelty that nobody shot).

Never thought back then that I would be shooting that CG63 in Ohio

 

[Zero333]

No you will not. Your rifle will shoot 140s just fine. Also be advised that the Berger twist calculation is what is optimum for that bullet. You will never know until you give them a try. The 156 gr RN military bullet is a long sucker with a lot of bearing surface. I would say that your chamber is cut just like the military rifles and they have long throats for that long 156 gr bullet so don't think that with shorter lighter bullets that you can load to get close to the lands. With a round loaded with the 140 Sierra Match King at COAL 3.050 which will just fit in the magazine and work fine but is still a looooog ways from the lands still will shoot as good as you can hold with the load I mentioned earlier.

I once went to the range and there was this guy there that I knew was very anal about everything and always put a bunch of money into every rifle he had but he really was not a very good shot.
He had a 8 inch steel swinger set up at 500 yards and was shooting off the bench in a full bench rest type press bag set up. He was shooting a rifle he described as a "blue printed" Rem 700 with a heavy Heart match barrel in 308 Win. with 168 Match Kings. He could pop the steel most of the time. I ask if I could take a shot at it with my rifle and he said sure. I go get my rifle out of the truck which was a full military dress 96 Mauser Swede. The only thing I had done was change the front sight blade to one that was higher so I could bring the POI down to match the back sight settings. This was my vintage military match rifle that a group of guys had started up way before it got popular with the NRA. This fellow did not know that I had this rifles sights dialed in so I could set for 500 yards. He ask if I wanted to use his rest and I said no. I sat down on the ground and got into the sling and fired and DING. Fellow said "you got lucky". I said "probably did, what to bet $10 I can do it again". I knew he was the type of person that would take the bate. He said "I will take that bet." I got into my tight donut hold and fired and DING. Sure did thank that fellow for the gas money to the range and back that day. LOL

The CG-63 might not have a military chamber. It's a target rifle.
Yes, ALL 140 gr Match and hunting bullets will stabilize fine in the 8.7" twist, but sometimes (not always) at the price of accuracy.

I would stick with 120 to 130 grainers. And unless you're shooting 500+ yards, there is little disadvantage using 120 / 130 gr bullets.

 

[tomswede]

As a junior in the early 70’s in Sweden our club got some M41 from the government that was used for the junior program. No M41 ammo was generally available and could not be purchased. Most people were shooting Norma factory reloads “Silvertorped” that were similar to the M41. The top of the line ammo were loaded with 140 MK’s.
Nobody worried about twist, whatever the rifle came with.
Have not checked mine in a long time so I’m not sure about the lead. The current Sauer STR rifle has a shorter lead, not hard to get the desired distance to the lands in mine.
Have never seen anybody use the old 156gr load ( there were some around the club in the 70’s, a novelty that nobody shot).

Another addition, the rifles were used for 300m target shooting on the international target and for “field shooting “ at distance up to 650m. There were very few complaints regarding accuracy of them for this. Very good scores were frequently shot on the tough 300m target. All with the 140 class bullets.
For lighter bullets the 120 Sierra MK is very forgiving and basically a shorter 140.

 

[joshb]

I tried Hv100 with the 120 MK and 123’s and got very good results in my Swede.
Just looked up my recipe: 38 grains Hv100 with the Hornady 120 AMAX.

 

[logandiana]

I ordered some 6.5x55 Nosler brass on sale from midway, and a shooting buddy gave me a handful of Nosler RDF 130 grain bullets to try out. I've used Nosler brass before, but never tried their projectiles.We'll see what happens I suppose.

Alright in addition to the 130 grain Nosler RDF bullets, I was able to get my hands on a box each of Nosler 140 Custom Completition, 140 Sierra MK, 136 Lapua Scenar-L, plus a box each of PPU 139 SP BT cartridges, and PPU 120 match HP BT cartridges.
So this weekend I need to put together several load of each. I've already got some H4350, IMR3031, and Varget. Thnking about starting out with 42 grains of H4350. I'll try to pick up some RL22 soon as well.

 

[joshb]

You should really try the H100V. Trust me on this.

 

[logandiana]

I have an update with some results, a few pics, and some surprising results.
I worked up some loads to test at the range today. I made 12 rounds of each with Nosler custom brass, CCI primers, and H4350 (this is the only powder that I have a lot of, and could find loads for each of the different bullets). The cartridges were seated to 20 thousandths off of the lands with a Forster benchrest seating die.
Distance was 100 yards. Temp was cold, humid, and ever so slightly breezy (but nothing that I would call 'windy'). Shot off a rest with the factory CG63 target aperture sights.
Magnetospeed attached to the barrel. The barrel was allowed to cool for 15ish minutes after each 12 shot string.

1)
Nosler Custom Comp 140g with 41gr H4350
Hi 2669, Low 2637, Spread 32, Avg 2650
2.5 inch group

2)
Per the suggestions above, I loaded up some 140 SMKs
Sierra MK 140g with 41gr H4350
Hi 2753, Low 2718, Spread 35, Avg 2741
1.9 inch group


3)
Nosler RDF 130g with 41.5gr H4350
Hi 2834, Low 2672, Spread 162, Avg 2749
2.25 inch group
This is one of the ones I had high hopes for. The Nosler marketing is good, the bullet looks good, but I didn't get great results. Look at the spread! The empties came out very dirty too, carbon all over the case mouth and necks. I imagine some of the reasoning behind the results on this were because in order to seat the bullet just off the lands with this one meant that the case was barely gripping the bearing surface of the bullet. Perhaps I may give this one another shot in the future, seating further and sacrificing distance off the lands.


4)
Lapua Scenar L 136g with 41.5gr H4350
Hi 2778, Low 2732, Spread 46, Avg 2751
1.8 inch group
This is another that I had really high hopes for. Out of all the bullets, these just look the best to me. Everything looks uniform and exact, like they really did their QC on these. My first time loading anything Lapua.



5)
Thought I would shoot some factory ammo as well, just to get an idea.
I pulled one to measure it and see what it was filled with. 38.3 of something...
This was my first group of the day actually, and it was the biggest, at just under 3 inches across, yikes!
PPU factory ammo SPBT 139g with 38.3gr of something
Hi 2609, Low 2553, Spread 56, Avg 2588
2.975 inch group


6)
The previous group confirmed my suspicions that factory ammo is usually not great, so I tried the lighter MATCH version and was impressed! Best group of the day, just under inch and a half. Powder looked to be the same as the other factory ammo, just more of it.
PPU factory Match HPBT 120g with 48gr of something
Hi 2841, Low 2777, Spread 64, Avg 2811
1.45 inch group




So now the big question is what next? Based on the above results my gut feeling is to think this guy Zero333 must be right!

CG-63 most likely have barrel twist of 1 turn in 220 mm which = 1 in 8.7"

Stick with 120 / 123 gr. bullets. You will not regret it.

H-4831sc would be my first choice for powder.

With 120/123 gr bullets, MAX would be around 49 gr H-4831. So start at 45 /46 gr.

H-4831sc = Accurate with out exceptions.

I was able to pick up some H4831SC at the LGS afterwards today, but they were out of H100V, Reloader 22, 19, 17, N150.

Not sure if I am ready to abandon the 135-140ish bullet weight just yet, but I do think I need to try some options in the 120ish range. Probably the 120 SMK, and Lapua makes the same Scenar L in a 120. I still have yet to try any thing from Berger or Hornady.

 

[joshb]

I have to apologize. My memory was wrong on the bullet I used in my load. I went back and dug it up from an old thread. The gun I shot these targets with is an M38 Husquvarna.

It just so happens that I bought a CG63 a couple weeks ago so I’ll be testing too, soon.

 

[Rdlningcltchdmpr]

I have an update with some results, a few pics, and some surprising results.
I worked up some loads to test at the range today. I made 12 rounds of each with Nosler custom brass, CCI primers, and H4350 (this is the only powder that I have a lot of, and could find loads for each of the different bullets). The cartridges were seated to 20 thousandths off of the lands with a Forster benchrest seating die.
Distance was 100 yards. Temp was cold, humid, and ever so slightly breezy (but nothing that I would call 'windy'). Shot off a rest with the factory CG63 target aperture sights.
Magnetospeed attached to the barrel. The barrel was allowed to cool for 15ish minutes after each 12 shot string.
View attachment 1157428
1)
Nosler Custom Comp 140g with 41gr H4350
Hi 2669, Low 2637, Spread 32, Avg 2650
2.5 inch group

2)
Per the suggestions above, I loaded up some 140 SMKs
Sierra MK 140g with 41gr H4350
Hi 2753, Low 2718, Spread 35, Avg 2741
1.9 inch group
View attachment 1157423

3)
Nosler RDF 130g with 41.5gr H4350
Hi 2834, Low 2672, Spread 162, Avg 2749
2.25 inch group
This is one of the ones I had high hopes for. The Nosler marketing is good, the bullet looks good, but I didn't get great results. Look at the spread! The empties came out very dirty too, carbon all over the case mouth and necks. I imagine some of the reasoning behind the results on this were because in order to seat the bullet just off the lands with this one meant that the case was barely gripping the bearing surface of the bullet. Perhaps I may give this one another shot in the future, seating further and sacrificing distance off the lands.
View attachment 1157424

4)
Lapua Scenar L 136g with 41.5gr H4350
Hi 2778, Low 2732, Spread 46, Avg 2751
1.8 inch group
This is another that I had really high hopes for. Out of all the bullets, these just look the best to me. Everything looks uniform and exact, like they really did their QC on these. My first time loading anything Lapua.
View attachment 1157425


5)
Thought I would shoot some factory ammo as well, just to get an idea.
I pulled one to measure it and see what it was filled with. 38.3 of something...
This was my first group of the day actually, and it was the biggest, at just under 3 inches across, yikes!
PPU factory ammo SPBT 139g with 38.3gr of something
Hi 2609, Low 2553, Spread 56, Avg 2588
2.975 inch group


6)
The previous group confirmed my suspicions that factory ammo is usually not great, so I tried the lighter MATCH version and was impressed! Best group of the day, just under inch and a half. Powder looked to be the same as the other factory ammo, just more of it.
PPU factory Match HPBT 120g with 48gr of something
Hi 2841, Low 2777, Spread 64, Avg 2811
1.45 inch group
View attachment 1157427



So now the big question is what next? Based on the above results my gut feeling is to think this guy Zero333 must be right!


I was able to pick up some H4831SC at the LGS afterwards today, but they were out of H100V, Reloader 22, 19, 17, N150.

Not sure if I am ready to abandon the 135-140ish bullet weight just yet, but I do think I need to try some options in the 120ish range. Probably the 120 SMK, and Lapua makes the same Scenar L in a 120. I still have yet to try any thing from Berger or Hornady.

I shoot a 6.5 swede 1915 match rifle, i use Lapua 100 grain scenar's only and it is amazing. If you tried them you would love them. Most people won't try them.

 

[Zero333]

I shoot a 6.5 swede 1915 match rifle, i use Lapua 100 grain scenar's only and it is amazing. If you tried them you would love them. Most people won't try them.

If shooting inside 200 yards, the lighter flat base bullets are stupid accurate !

The .264" Lapua 100 gr Cutting Edge is definitely worth a try.

 

[Zero333]

Thanks for the update.

That's some great shooting with the PPU ammo !

The PPU 120 gr ammo could have 48 gr of any of the following powder...

N-160
N-560
RL-19
RL-22
Norma MRP
Lovex S071
ReloadSwiss RS 70
Rottweil R905
Somchem S385
Bofors RP14
Bofors RP5/NP
Bofors RP15

But.... 48 gr of H-4831sc also falls right onto the expected velocities with 120 gr bullet.

Regardless of what weight bullet you choose... H-4831sc is ALWAYS accurate and never failed to deliver excellent accuracy whenever I tried it.

 

[logandiana]

Thanks for the update.

That's some great shooting with the PPU ammo !

The PPU 120 gr ammo could have 48 gr of any of the following powder...

N-160
N-560
RL-19
RL-22
Norma MRP
Lovex S071
ReloadSwiss RS 70
Rottweil R905
Somchem S385
Bofors RP14
Bofors RP5/NP
Bofors RP15

But.... 48 gr of H-4831sc also falls right onto the expected velocities with 120 gr bullet.

Regardless of what weight bullet you choose... H-4831sc is ALWAYS accurate and never failed to deliver excellent accuracy whenever I tried it.

Back from another day at the range. Today I went with 3 new loads.
120g Lapua Scenar-L
120g Sierra MatchKing
120g Hornady ELD

I loaded 10 rounds of each with exactly 45g of H4831sc, and bullets seated to .020 off of the lands.

Distance was 100 yards, and it was pretty breezy today 10-15 sustained with 20-25 gusts. Barrel cooled 10-15 minutes between each string.

Scenar-L
Hi 2884
Low 2835
Spread 49
Avg 2859



SMK (actually had 12 loaded up here)
hi 2909
low 2829
spread 80
avg 2871



Hornady ELD match
hi 2998
low 2935
spread 63
avg 2967



Based on the previous results with the 120g Match factory ammo and these results with 120g reloads, I think I will definitely stick around this weight for a while.
All of these shot well despite the gusts, but the ELD was the obvious winner here with a 10 shot group of just over an inch.
I was surprised at the how much spread there was between the different brands though, especially with all the same weight and same powder load.
So now what is the next step for me here developing this load? Do I experiment with adjusting the powder weight, or do I work on adjusting seating depth?

 

[Zero333]

Those groups are with the peep sight ... Right ?

That group with the 120 eldm is phenomenal.

I'd try a different primer to see if the ES goes down.

 

[logandiana]

Those groups are with the peep sight ... Right ?

That group with the 120 eldm is phenomenal.

I'd try a different primer to see if the ES goes down.

yes, the rear sight is the Swiss made Elite diopter and the front is the stock cg63 tunnel with a 2.4 ring.

I was using CCI large rifle, but only because it was handy at the time. I normally use federal primers for everything.

 

[Zero333]

Usually CCI primers are great.

If you're planning on using this rifle inside 400 yards, I wouldn't worry about high ES.

Let the target dictate what the rifle likes.

 

[logandiana]

Usually CCI primers are great.

If you're planning on using this rifle inside 400 yards, I wouldn't worry about high ES.

Let the target dictate what the rifle likes.

I was just saying I was surprised that the 3 different bullets, all 120g, and all loaded with 45g would have such an big spread across them.
The avg of the first 2 isn’t too off, 2859 vs 2871, but the eld avg was 2967, almost 100 FPS faster.
I am going to stick with the ELD, but hopefully I can tighten the group a little with load adjustments.