Tumble clean or not?

[JerryK]

I'm shooting 80-100 rounds a month, Benchrest. Accuracy wise, am I better off just cleaning cases with a nylon brush and liquid cleaner, or tumbling?

 

[TheSilverFox]

1- Clean outside of case especially where powder residue with "never dull".
2- Clean primer pocket by hand with carbide bit.,Sinclair)
3- Do a few turns with flashhole deburring tool.
4- Take bronze brush and clean inside neck till the loose stuff is gone.

 

[Skunce]

For what it's worth I use a vibratory type polisher to clean cases. I used a tumbler for many years, but it tended to batter the case mouths and I had to de-burr them after each tumbling.
I use a fine ground walnut media that I bought from Petco with some Dillon polish added. The fine walnut media doesn't plug my flash holes like the coarser stuff does. "Zilla lizard litter" at Petco or Petsmart, about $10 for ten pounds.

 

[Travelor]

I agree with TheSilverFox, except I use my vibrator cleaner after sizing.

Also, I found that if I a paper towel dampened with WD40, it will remove most of the carbon fowling at the neck before sizing,if you size before cleaning the carbon it seems to be "pushed" into the neck).

I like bright clean cases. And I like the annealed colors I find after annealing the cases after every 3 firings.

 

[songdogslayer]

Greetings,

Regarding SilverFox's second step:

2- Clean primer pocket by hand with carbide bit.,Sinclair)

Is this carbide bit you speak of the same as a primer pocket uniformer?

Also, mentioned is cleaning the neck interior with a brass brush . . . is that the same as you use for cleaning your bore? I apologize for what appear to be rather simple questions. I've been using a tumbler for years now and I'm really tired of all the deficits included with tumbling,media in flash holes, dented necks, the ultra-fine dust to clean out of and off of the brass, and I still have carbon inside the dang case!). Anyway, I plan to begin annealing my brass soon and I'm wondering, also, if the 4 steps listed by SilverFox are sufficient prior to annealing or do I have to go with Ultrasonic?

SilverFox, that is an excellent article you wrote regarding long range firing under less-than-ideal weather conditions. Beautiful pictures, too.

All the best,
~Scott

 

[Travelor]

songdogslayer,

I use the a Dewey Crocagator, http://www.deweyrods.com/cgi-bin/ccp5/cp-app.cgi?usr=DEWEY12295&pg=prod&ref=CR&cat=SPEC&catstr=HOME:SPEC ) to clean my primer pockets rather that the Sinclair which I use only the first fime in prepping the cases.

I use the same type brass cleaning brush to clean the inside of the necks as I use when cleaning the bore. I have a handle that it screws into for convience. Only run it in and out, not twist as this scores the necks.

The only way I know to really clean the carbon out of cases is with a ultra sonic cleaner and this does a great job.

I prep my cases exactly as I would for reloading before I anneal the necks. Afterward, I use a paper towel dampened with WD-40 and wipe them to prevent them from tarnishing and put them in either a cartridge box or a ziplock bag until I load them.

Just what I do.

George

 

[songdogslayer]

Thank you, George, for the reply. I went ahead and ordered an Ultrasonic Cleaner yesterday. Next on my list is the Zephyr Dynamics "Brass-O-Matic" annealing machine.

Thanks again!
~Scott

 

[TheSilverFox]

Greetings,

Regarding SilverFox's second step:

2- Clean primer pocket by hand with carbide bit.,Sinclair)

Is this carbide bit you speak of the same as a primer pocket uniformer?

Also, mentioned is cleaning the neck interior with a brass brush . . . is that the same as you use for cleaning your bore? I apologize for what appear to be rather simple questions. I've been using a tumbler for years now and I'm really tired of all the deficits included with tumbling,media in flash holes, dented necks, the ultra-fine dust to clean out of and off of the brass, and I still have carbon inside the dang case!). Anyway, I plan to begin annealing my brass soon and I'm wondering, also, if the 4 steps listed by SilverFox are sufficient prior to annealing or do I have to go with Ultrasonic?

SilverFox, that is an excellent article you wrote regarding long range firing under less-than-ideal weather conditions. Beautiful pictures, too.

All the best,
~Scott

Well my theory behind those 4 steps pretty much comes from getting bored with reloading. A few years ago I found myself looking for a quick and easy way of reloading great quality consistent ammo.

I picked up those steps from the top benchrest shooters I met at the Kelbly's Supershoot,Its like the indy 500 of short range benchrest)

Anyway, I dont think the miracle is in a super "like new" clean brass everytime, just the 4 steps I do or similar.

Yes, the tool I use is a primer pocket uniformer. I will uniform and trim my "new" cases after two firings when everything has settled.I do this once, for the life of the brass. After each other firing, I just hand turn the carbon out by hand. I also use an old brass bore brush for the inside of the necks.I usually will shoot the same brass up to 10 times. After that I throw them away. Annealing is supposed to help in consistent neck tension but most shooter anneal after 10 cases. In 6ppc, most guys shoot 20 cases over a match and might reload the same cases over 12 times during + fireforming + practice. And still manage to shoot in the one's. I know 6ppc and bigger calibers are different so make your own opinion on that.

If you are serious about figuring this out and want to skip a lot of R&D. Then I suggest you purchase Mike Ratigan's book on extreme rifle accuracy.

IMO, spend more time on.
Rifle tune: brass headspace, bullet seating, powder charge.
Shooting: reading the conditions,Flags), bench technique.

 

[songdogslayer]

Thank you, SilverFox, I will try your technique. Regarding the shooting suggestion - reading flags & bench technique - I am not a competition shooter. I am, however, a long range shooter, taking prairie dogs, fox, coyote, racoon, etc, etc, at considerable range,well, considerable to this guy).
We have so dang much snow out here I've decided to purchase a couple snowmobiles for my family - can't get around on the rural roads anymore! Now I can drive my target out to 500 - 600 yards with a sled and practice,don't tell the wife).Thank you, again, for your response. I appreciate you taking the time to share your insight with me.
~Scott

 

[Travelor]

songdogslayer, Look at the Ken Light annealing machine.

I have one and believe it is much superior to the Brass-o-matic as the aluminum shell wheels are heat sinks to keep the cartridge base temperatures down.

George

 

[BigJim]

I am confused, we can use WD-40 for case cleaning??? No amounia in it, will it not fry the primers from the oil??

Please let me know.

Thanks
Jim

 

[TheSilverFox]

Thank you, SilverFox, I will try your technique. Regarding the shooting suggestion - reading flags & bench technique - I am not a competition shooter. I am, however, a long range shooter, taking prairie dogs, fox, coyote, racoon, etc, etc, at considerable range,well, considerable to this guy).
We have so dang much snow out here I've decided to purchase a couple snowmobiles for my family - can't get around on the rural roads anymore! Now I can drive my target out to 500 - 600 yards with a sled and practice,don't tell the wife).Thank you, again, for your response. I appreciate you taking the time to share your insight with me.
~Scott

I understand. When I go hunting I don't go and ask Bull or cow Elk to wait for a minute so i can setup my flags so I can take an accurate shot at them, lol.

I do tune my sniper rifle with flags though. Flags are usefull because It takes some guess work out of the equation. During a barrel tune I am able "or at least try to" read the conditions so that i can estimate where a bullet will go. If you're trying to shoot a group and you see a condition change and you shoot without leading the bullet then you'll know why your group gets bigger. You know its not the gun or loads fault. If you have a good group going in an east wind wind picks up from 5mph to 10 mph and your bullet goes left and up, you know your rifle is in tune. If you shoot a group and cant figure out why you get flyers then you know your load needs work.

 

[fieldratsniper]

I am confused, we can use WD-40 for case cleaning??? No amounia in it, will it not fry the primers from the oil??

Please let me know.

Thanks
Jim

i think what they are talking about is using a paper towel that they have sprayed with a little wd, and then wiping of the neck. i get some carbon burned onto the necks of my 22-250 brass. my 223 never has any.

i wouldnt spray any wd40 directly onto the case.

 

[fieldratsniper]

oh, and ive got a question about #3.

is deburring and reaming the flash hole the same thing? ive never done either...

i know some guys dont ream the lapua 6br brass because it will reduce accuracy. apparently the lapua brass is very uniform in its flash hole.

Jeremy

 

[TheSilverFox]

Yeah, Lapua drills their flasholes Vs. the other guys punch them out.
I just turn the deburrer to remove residue, I do not remove any metal.