True custom 17HMR

[skeetlee]

Just wondering if it would be worth building a true custom 17HMR. I build several 22lr here in my shop each year but never have I built a 17HMR. My past experience with the hmr has been less than interesting for me. Accuracy never very good at least by my standards.
I enjoy the RimX actions and I’ve built lots of really fine shooting rifles with them in 22lr. Because I like them so well I’m thinking I might try a 17HMR. Brux or Bartleinbarrels barrel most likely ? I do know a good barrel will certainly help with accuracy but I also know I’m still at mercy with the ammo that’s available. CCI or Winchester.
I guess I’m curious if anyone here has already been down this path and was or is the accuracy better than the standard 1 MOA accuracy that most people see with the HMR. 1/2 MOA is about all I think is possible but perhaps I’m wrong? I hate to dump a bunch of cash to be disappointed. Any thoughts?

 

[Ozzyblu]

I agree on the limited availability of quality ammunition. Probably your biggest issue. I get 1/2 MOA with my Anschutz when I do my part. A custom should do better.

 

[CharlieNC]

There is a guy on facebook with a custom build on an AR type platform and achieves surprising accuracy at 1000yd using handoads, which requires custom dies etc. Seems like he was gearing up for a mile shoot but no updates in a long while. I shoot my Savage reliably on steel at 500yd once I get the wind dope.

While a rimfire it is nothing like a 22lr, as the fast barrel time makes it more like shooting a center fire in terms of trigger follow through etc. It definitely offers superior longer range performance, don't know about 50yd BR accuracy.

A nice custom should do great if you can get a handle on ammo using a tuner with the limited offerings. Or load your own.

 

[NateHaler]

Handloaded .17 HMR? To shoot to 1,000y? IMO, why bother!

Lee, the .17HMR, like the .22WMR, is hampered by the lack of match-grade ammo. Given the novelty, there might be somebody who will buy a true custom .17 HMR, but were it my shop, I'd stick with the proven .22 LR. That realm of competition, be it rimfire Palma, PRS, F-Class, or BR, is only getting stronger.

 

[th82457]

I have a custom built on a Kimber 82G with I believe a Broughton barrel (maybe Bartlien). I bought the barrel blank from a private owner. This gun does shoot better than any prior factory .17 HMR I have owned which includes CZ 452's, Anschutz 1517 & 1717, Marlin 917. With that said, ammo is still a limiting factor. My custom actually prefers the 15.5 gr & 16 gr. no lead offerings from Hornady & CCI. Still is ammo lot sensitive & I go to the extreme of weight sorting within lot's for 100 yard match shooting. My best 100 yard groups are close to 3/8" for 5 shots - but can still open up to about an inch depending on ammo lot. My purpose for building a custom is I shoot in a competitive 100 yard rimfire league where wind flags are not allowed. What pure accuracy I give up to the high grade .22's, I usually overcome by using the faster shooting HMR with less wind effect at distance. On dead calm days the .22lr's are very good - but 80% of the time we have wind that gives the advantage to the HMR. I am curious if a custom .17 HM2 may be a better offering at this point in time ?

 

[skeetlee]

I appreciate all the responses and it all makes good sense. If i were to do something such as this i wouldn't probably even try to hand load for it.. In todays market I don't see the components very assessable, not to mention cost?
I think I'm just at a point where I have already built about everything you can build in my shop and im looking for that next challenge.
I do truly enjoy making these 22lr shoot. i didnt used to think there was much more to it compared to a centerfire chamber but there is! Picking the proper reamer for said barrel. cutting and polishing that perfect chamber. How much jam on a particular brand of ammo for said barrel, its truly a craft and I truly dig it!
One thing thats for sure. Not all rimfire barrels are created equal! Not even close! Thanks again fellas
Lee

 

[jpx2rk]

Wonder if a RF tuner would be of any benefit for the 17HMR????

 

[vlcakc]

Wonder if a RF tuner would be of any benefit for the 17HMR????

Maybe? I have a 17 HMR AR conversion upper with a Harrell's tuner installed. I have only been able to do limited testing due to weather and other constraints, but can say the tuner does open and close two shot sequences in a regular wave pattern. I have shot too few 5 or 10 shot groups to reach any firm conclusions, but the tuner does seem to reduce group size somewhat. Eric Meyer and other Utube testers have reported sub one inch groups with this AR conversion without the tuner. With our current weather situation it may be awhile before testing can resume tho.

 

[th82457]

A tuner may help. The two factors in .17 HMR ammo that I have seen that hurt accuracy are wide velocity spread from round to round and variance on overall length - distance of bullet ogive to lands. I make the assumption that the powder charge in 17 HMR ammo varies enough to cause the velocity variation. This is why I sort by weight. I am sure there could be variation in brass & bullet weight - but I think powder weight is majority of weight variation. I have found up to .8 grain difference in weight between shells in a single box. since the powder component is only about 5.5 grains - this is a significant % variance. Just my theory. I know in my .22 match ammo, most boxes will vary less than .2 grain shell to shell, some less than .1 grain.

 

[doclu60]

With that said, ammo is still a limiting factor. My custom actually prefers the 15.5 gr & 16 gr. no lead offerings from Hornady & CCI. Still is ammo lot sensitive & I go to the extreme of weight sorting within lot's for 100 yard match shooting.

th82457, I am brand new to the .17hmr and have been reading a lot about the round lately. Yours is not the first opinion I have read saying the nontoxic rounds have given better performance. Enough has been posted about those results by others that when I can get my hands on some of these loads, I will be testing them.

TO THE OP.....Lee, I have seen only one custom .17hmr. It was built by a highly accredited full time rifle smith. I saw it in his shop when I was picking up an Unlimited RFBR rifle he built for me. I don't remember what barrel was on it, but it was a Stiller Lonestar action and was stocked in a straight line benchrest stock. I asked him about it and he told me he did range test it and it shot very well. Turns out his customer was an 'egg' shooter. There are some areas in the country where egg shoots are not only popular, there are some that take it VERY seriously! In RF egg shooting I believe the eggs are at 100yds. I have a good idea what one of his rifles cost and his customer had to be one of the 'serious' guys. If you are hankering to try something new to build, it would be interesting to see how your project turns out if you decide to follow through with it.

I see you are in my state. Perhaps I can visit your shop one day.

Scott

 

[NateHaler]

Turns out his customer was an 'egg' shooter. There are some areas in the country where egg shoots are not only popular, there are some that take it VERY seriously! In RF egg shooting I believe the eggs are at 100yds. I have a good idea what one of his rifles cost and his customer had to be one of the 'serious' guys.

Egg, not agg. Been there, done that, and a fun way to end a match (600y BR in this case outside Reno, NV).

For rimfire 100y, I would suggest quail eggs. I think typical store-bought chicken eggs would be too easy... especially for the types who say "My so-and-so rifle will shoot sub 1" groups all day long, no matter what ammo".

(As to the egg shoot at 600y that time, the least number of rounds fired to hit the -- chicken -- egg was 7. A friend with his new 6 Dasher that he was breaking in prior to campaigning it at 1,000y matches went a bit nuts, and fired more than 30 rounds relatively quickly without hitting the egg. It took me 13 shots. Next time, ostrich eggs or I'll just watch.)

 

[th82457]

That sounds like fun !

 

[Shawnba67]

I would think if you could shotrten the factory freebeore you might see marked improvement. My only 17hmr mush prefered the 20gr fodder. It shot pretty well .5 moa usually with the 20gr over 1 moa with the 17gr stuff

 

[doclu60]

Egg, not agg. Been there, done that, and a fun way to end a match (600y BR in this case outside Reno, NV).

For rimfire 100y, I would suggest quail eggs. I think typical store-bought chicken eggs would be too easy... especially for the types who say "My so-and-so rifle will shoot sub 1" groups all day long, no matter what ammo".

(As to the egg shoot at 600y that time, the least number of rounds fired to hit the -- chicken -- egg was 7. A friend with his new 6 Dasher that he was breaking in prior to campaigning it at 1,000y matches went a bit nuts, and fired more than 30 rounds relatively quickly without hitting the egg. It took me 13 shots. Next time, ostrich eggs or I'll just watch.)

Yes Nate, egg not agg. Sorry if you read agg and not egg. And yes, they were chicken eggs. I shot a sanctioned RFBR match up in Michigan several summers ago and they even shoot them at 50yds up there. RF, must be the 'new' egg shooters, or informal egg shooters.....Lol!

When I walked up to the target board at 50 to hang my first card there were shells on the ground and dried egg all over the place. I asked the MD what the heck was going on and he told me they shoot egg matches up there. Hum?...strange I thought. They're money matches and they were shooting one over on the CF range the same time we were shooting our ARA match. Not sure the distance, but pretty sure the club didn't have the enough ground for 600yds.

As for quail eggs, I prefer mine raw over salmon roe in a nice sushi restaurant, not as a rifle target!

Lee, please keep us up to date if you build a custom Hummer. I am very interested in the subject.

Scott

 

[NateHaler]

Yes Nate, egg not agg. Sorry if you read agg and not egg.

I knew eggsactly what you meant, hence my (boring) story.

 

[Travelor]

The "problem" with 17 HMR acuracy is not the gun but the ammo. Try weight sorting the ammo and it will scare the bejesus out of you. The weights are all over the scale. I weight sort and try to get a box of similar weigthed ammo and it shoots better. Ammo I am using is Hornady 17 grain V-Max.,

 

[dgeesaman]

Just wondering if it would be worth building a true custom 17HMR. I build several 22lr here in my shop each year but never have I built a 17HMR. My past experience with the hmr has been less than interesting for me. Accuracy never very good at least by my standards.
I enjoy the RimX actions and I’ve built lots of really fine shooting rifles with them in 22lr. Because I like them so well I’m thinking I might try a 17HMR. Brux or Bartleinbarrels barrel most likely ? I do know a good barrel will certainly help with accuracy but I also know I’m still at mercy with the ammo that’s available. CCI or Winchester.
I guess I’m curious if anyone here has already been down this path and was or is the accuracy better than the standard 1 MOA accuracy that most people see with the HMR. 1/2 MOA is about all I think is possible but perhaps I’m wrong? I hate to dump a bunch of cash to be disappointed. Any thoughts?

I’ve bought a couple of Lilja 17hmr barrels for Sako Quad action.

Accuracy was ordinary, on par with a factory Anschutz 17hmr. In fact I think Sako factory barrels will outshoot it.

I guess for my money I wouldn’t bother unless it’s an easy barrel to change out.

 

[drover]

There is not much reason to spend money on trying to make a 17 HMR more accurate since ammo is the main limiting factor. I have found that most off the shelf 17 HMR rifles will group around an inch or so for 5 shots at 100yds which is more than adequate for what the cartridge was designed for - shooting ground squirrels and other small varmints.
Also since there are no sanctioned competition classes for the 17 HMR there is really no incentive for the manufacturers to build more accurate ammunition for it. Sort of a perfect storm of reasons as to why things will likely stay the same.

drover

 

[Dub]

I cannot see it as a worthwhile endeavor Lee.

 

[searcher]

Maybe better to buy a $400.00 factory gun. My Savage (and my buddies) all shoot 1/2" MOA with Hornady ammo (mine prefers the unleaded). At that price , you can go through a few to find one that really shoots. That said, I have often wondered what a really nice barrel might do. Maybe consider the .17 WSM too. Some of those are capable of shooting very well - so the ammo might be up to it. Two of the biggest money pits I have thrown myself into were building rimfire rifles and/or trying to make them shoot.