During my time with the 6 PPC, I shot .261, .262, .263, and .268 necks. With the Dasher and 6 BRA, I have shot .268, .269, and .271 (no turn). What is ideal for the 6mm Cartridges? Well, personal preference has a lot to do with it, but I prefer the .268 for PPC and 6 BR-based cartridges using Lapua brass. These can be done easily with one pass and tends to give a consistent seating "feel". What is your preference? Good shooting....James
To Turn Necks or Not ?
- Thread starter jamesdmock
- Start date
dmoran
Donovan Moran
I'm a fan of thin necks, and in the 15-years / +20,000 rounds of my using No-turn 6Dasher's with necks turned to 0.011" neck wall thickness and less, have only split 1 case neck. It was on a case that had +20-firings.
Never had issue's splitting necks with 243-Ackley's or 6-PPC's either, that I also used thin necks with.
That all said, in my experience, the concerns of splitting or over-working necks, is more of a myth then an actual occurring factor.
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tom
Gold $$ Contributor
I run 3 plus clearance, don't anneal and have been known to try up to 6 thou neck holds.... I've never split a neck, ever. I think people are basically parroting what they read online, posted by someone parroting what a guy at the range said, who was parroting something he read online.....on some of this stuff.
Tom
Tom
Dusty Stevens
Shiner
Sit that case to the side and mark it. See if it repeats and then trash it
SHall
Silver $$ Contributor
Years ago when I started LR BR no one could tell me that no turn was as accuarate as turned necks. So I opted for a .268 neck reamer for my 6BR. At that time some of the best 600 and 1000 yard shooters were shooting no turn .272 Dashers, BRX’s, and BR’s. Those shooters included some record holders including Richard Schatz, Mike Davis, Rodney Wagner, Mark Shronce and some others. A few years after doing well with the BR I decided to play with the Dasher and BRX. The BRX was a .272 neck. Even though it was a no turn chamber, I still turned the necks just enough to make the necks completely concentric. That barrel shot well and did it’s share of winning. After listening to Mike Davis who chambered the barrel, he and I argued about the no turn debate several times, I decided to do an experiment. I took my best turned neck brass and shot it against no turn brass(necks I had not touched). I prepped the brass of both batches, only difference is I did not touch the necks except to inside and outside chamfer. This was the same lot of brass in both batches. I did everthing in both batches exactly the same! Same fireforming, same number of rounds on brass, loaded at the same time with exact same components. I shot in the same rifle on a morning at my 600 yard range just after daylight in as near of perfect conditions as posssible- and it was perfect that day. I shot 8, 5 shot groups. Just like a match agg. Four, 5 shot targets with each. I would alternate targets also, one with turned necks, then one with no turned. After I was done, by looking at the targets, I could not tell the difference in groups(verticle, horizontal, etc.) or size of groups. I put the calipers to the groups and measured carefully. As it turned out the two 4 target aggs were with in thousands of each other! The best I can remember it was like 15 thousands difference - IN FAVOR OF THE NO TURN ROUNDS! Now if I repeated this experiment, the turned rounds may have slightly beat the no turn. But this experiment told me there is no difference in the two. I never bought a turn neck reamer after that. Lapua 6BR brass is excellent brass, most all lots are less than one thousand total difference in neck thickness. My opinion is if you run enough clearance in the neck (2-3 thou) no turn necks are just as accurate as turned. Now if I shot a PPC at short range I would opt for a turn neck, basically because everything and everybody is set up for turn necks of .262 to .269. All equipment and data has followed this. Years and years ago, from what I have heard and read, the brass was not as good and concentric as it is today. Turning necks then surely helped. Today, IMO, brass quality has come a long way, just like most all of our components and epuipment has. Do what makes you feel good, but as for me, I am not going to spend all that time turning necks anymore! Samuel Hall
dmoran
Donovan Moran
@Rushty
Here is results of one of my own neck clearance test from a 6Dasher /105-VLD:
Except for the wind getting the better of the .264 increment, they all basically ended up about .3-MOA, with no POI shifting between the increments.
Have conducted "clearance tests" a few times over the years, all with the same basic outcome: no gains or lose in accuracy to neck clearance.
Myself use no less then .003" clearance, to eliminate some of the risks of running tighter.
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Here is results of one of my own neck clearance test from a 6Dasher /105-VLD:
Except for the wind getting the better of the .264 increment, they all basically ended up about .3-MOA, with no POI shifting between the increments.
Have conducted "clearance tests" a few times over the years, all with the same basic outcome: no gains or lose in accuracy to neck clearance.
Myself use no less then .003" clearance, to eliminate some of the risks of running tighter.
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tom
Gold $$ Contributor
Most of what we've seen is too tight "can" be a problem. Haven't seen anything too loose yet, but I haven't gone full tard yet like donovan posted.
Tom
dmoran
Donovan Moran
Have read that to.... but seen test results that show different....
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dgeesaman
Gold $$ Contributor
I dunno, I just skimmed the necks on my 6BR Lapua brass yesterday down to .012” a side for a .271 neck chamber. Didn’t take long - I got more uniform necks in one pass by taking just 1/2 thou per side. Not much downside aside from the small time investment. It would only bother me if I had to load hundreds of rounds for varmint hunting.
David
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In my limited testing I agree, had a 284 that had 3thou clearance and during tuning groups were sporadic, the only neck reamer I had access to was a .320” which gave 7thou neck clearance, was a different gun after that.. I’ve run 6thou on every barrel since with 12+ firings on hundreds of pieces of brass and never split a neck..
So the way I look at it is this, I spend several thousand dollars on a new rifle. I then spend 2-3K on a premium scope. Now add in the best components available in the world, they are not cheap either. I then spend a bunch of money for the most stable rest I can find. Don't forget to add in the expense of traveling long distances to matches. Then I sort my premium hand made bullets even though some say it isn't necessary, even weigh my primers. I refine even the smallest little things in my loading practices, after analyzing at all the processes, to promote extreme accuracy.
Now I'm going to take brass, which I can measure and see that it can be improved on, and leave it alone when my goal is to produce some of the most accurate ammunition in the world?
I'm sorry but that just isn't going to happen.
Dave.
Now I'm going to take brass, which I can measure and see that it can be improved on, and leave it alone when my goal is to produce some of the most accurate ammunition in the world?
I'm sorry but that just isn't going to happen.
Dave.
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