THIS OR THAT?

[4xforfun]

600/1000 BR
MARCH X 10 - 60 X 56

OR

NIGHTFORCE COMP 15-55 X 56

TRACKING...CLAIRITY....RELIABILITY???

This is a "cry once" situation .....not interested in cost.

Tod

 

[Larry Koch]

Buy Both!

 

[Rick300]

I have the March and have looked through the Nightforce. Both are great scopes, however I obviously favor the March because I bought one. You would most likely be happy with either one, and both are seen in the top tiers of benchrest.

 

[Big_Daddy]

NIGHTFORCE COMP 15-55 X 56

 

[69mach]

i had a nf comp a 40-60 highmaster and a khales 1050 at the same time. i currently only have the nf comp left of the 3. i’ve also added nf scopes since. to my eye the nf comp was the clearest of the 3. if i had the money i’d also still have the khales. the march was in 3rd place overall to me, even though the khales glass seemed to have a slight blue tent to it. i think you be happy with either one. my eye just preferred the nf comp.

 

[Ranger188]

This is a recurring theme for purchasing a high end scope is,
YOU have to look thru it. Both are great quality.
I wondered the exact same thing.
I bought a NF comp. and the March 10-60x56 HM
at the same time just to see what I liked.
Sat them both next to each other and looked thru them, in sun and clouds
at the same time.
I own the NF. Sold the HM for what I paid.
That's the only way to tell for yourself.
They are really close.
NF is slightly brighter and for what ever reason, the March will
do slightly better in mirage.

 

[Fuj]

Not unless something was just released, the Nightforce is a 52
and not a 56. I have the 15-55x52 DDR2 Excellent glass.

 

[Mulligan]

For me, March.

I currently own, 2 NF Comps, a NF BR, March 40-60, and a 10-60 HM.
I have had to send a Comp and the 10-60 in for repair. I got a lot of arrogance from the NF service folks and the service team at March was perfect in every way. Both scopes work good now.

Additionally, I have had several shooters at many matches, ask to look through the march scopes and compare them to their NF, Vortex, Sightron, etc. When you have mirage, there appears to be a significant advantage with the March scopes. I am not knowledgeable enough to understand the "why" but I can see the difference.
CW

 

[Turbulent Turtle]

600/1000 BR
MARCH X 10 - 60 X 56

OR

NIGHTFORCE COMP 15-55 X 56

TRACKING...CLAIRITY....RELIABILITY???

This is a "cry once" situation .....not interested in cost.

Tod

I don't know anything about BR, I'm just an F-class shooter who shoots in 1000 yard matches every month or so. I don't know if BR shooters worry about mirage and conditions and how that might affect the IQ of the target. I know that as an F-class guy, I have to deal with the conditions and they do cause the IQ to deteriorate.

As you would expect, I have a March-X 10-60X56 HM on my match rifle. For 7 years prior to the acquisition of this scope, I had a March-X 5-50X56 on the rifle. The 5-50X56 has a single ED glass element and I discovered that in mirage conditions, it performed a lot better than the scope I had before it, an NF NXS 12-42X56. With the NF, I had to dial down from 40-42X when the mirage was present. Not so with the March-X 5-50X56. With that scope, I could stay at 40X all the time, regardless of mirage. I postulated that ED glass was retarding the damage done to the IQ of the target. It was not immune to mirage by any means, but the image quality (IQ) was still good enough to stay at 40X.

The March-X 10-60X56 HM as a pair of Super ED glass lenses, the two big lenses at the front. After I installed that scope on my rifle a couple years back, I realized I could stay at 50X in all mirage conditions that I was encountering. This includes South Texas year round, the Atterbury swamp land in Indiana, and many other places.

The NF Comp is a great scope, no flies on it. In perfect conditions, you would be hard pressed to find a difference between it and the March-X 10-60X56 HM, or any other scope listed here. But like I said, I know nothing of BR so perhaps you only shoot in perfect conditions. In F-class, we shoot in whatever condition exists at that time and this is where the difference between scopes come into play and for now, hands down, the Super ED glass (something only found in a few March scopes,) helps retard the IQ degradation caused by mirage and conditions. I can stay at 50X where lesser scopes need to be dialed down.

Staying at 50X is very important to me because I can surgically place the aiming dot on the target because the rings are still well-defined and watch how my wind call was wrong.

Also, the 56mm objective will provide better resolution than a 52mm objective lens. On the other hand, the 52mm objective will provide for a greater depth of field than a 56mm lens. However, the March-X comes with an MD disk that you can screw in front of the objective or the sunshade and it will provide much greater depth of field compared to the 52mm objective. Remove it in a few seconds when you want.

The March-X 10-60X56 comes in a variety of reticles and I prefer the MTR-5 for F-class. I used to have an MTR-2 in my 5-50X56 but age caught up to me, and March swapped it for an MTR-5. These scopes last a very long time. The tube body diameter is 34mm because the walls are 4mm thick compared to the 2mm walls of the 30mm tubes such as the NF Comp. When I spend that kind of money on a scope, I buy for the duration. My 5-50X56 (also 34mm tubed) has been with me for 9 years, 7 of those on my F-TR rifle and now on another target rifle. These scopes are strong. And they are filled with argon instead of nitrogen, for long life.

 

[Sniper338]

March HM here. Id buy another If I had money.

 

[Turbulent Turtle]

I'm including a picture of my first setup with the March-X 10-60X56 HM on my F-TR match rifle.

The first thing you will notice is that big focus wheel. I have arthritis in my left hand and this focus wheel allows me to be extremely precise in the focus of the target as it increases the granularity of the knob. I also like to sometimes switch back and forth between say 600 yards to sample the mirage and quickly snapping back to 1000 for the surgical shot placement. There is a middle wheel that attaches to the side focus knob first and many shooters like to have only that wheel. I like the large wheel that attaches to that middle wheel, again, for my arthritic hand. I got spoiled with that level of focus, and at 50X I get to appreciate that.

I use Burris XTR signature rings because I like to keep the riflescope as much as possible in the middle, where you get the best possible IQ. I mean, if I'm going to spend over $3000 for a riflescope, I want to get the best possible picture at my favorite distance, in this case 1000 yards. Why would I want to crank the reticle close to the top and leave it there all the time? So, I use a combination of canted rails and Burris signature ring inserts to have the scope near mechanical zero at 1000 yards. For the few times I do shoot at 600, it's 20 MOAs less. The IQ is still excellent, but I don't shoot 600 yards a whole lot, maybe about 20% of what I shoot at 1000. If I was bouncing back between the two distances all the time, I would probably adjust to have mechanical 0 set for about 800 yards or so, something like 10 MOA above and 10MOA below. It's not something you'll detect much, but I like to be at the best possible. In F-Class, I spend a lot of time looking though the riflescope (or the spotting scope), not sure what you do in BR.

As you can see, this picture was taken in the very early days of my using the 10-60X56 HM (I think it was the very first match I shot with it,) and the magnification is at my usual (in those days) 40X. It took a few matches to realize that the Super ED glass of the HM allowed me to increase my standard magnification 25% to 50X and stay there. I also replaced the white fast lever with a black one.

I also have the newer windage knob; the one designed for old people where there is both a left and a right scale. This helps me in not confusing left and right and crank the windage the wrong way and collect a 7 or worse on the next shoot after making a windage adjustment.

 

[Mulligan]

Anyone ever returned a March scope to Deon for repair?

There current process is to have the customer return the scope directly back to Japan. Just wondering how this worked out and how timely the repair was. Thanks CW

forum.accurateshooter.com

I dug up this old thread regarding March customer service. As you can see, other AS members have had similar experiences with March.
They are a real class act.
CW

 

[4xforfun]

OK....sounds like it is a toss-up as far as glass goes. No one has talked about TRACKING and holding zero through a string.

 

[4xforfun]

Flip a coin.

If cost is not an issue get the Valdada 10-60x56 with the 40mm tube.

​

Looks nice...but.....48 oz!!!

 

[Turbulent Turtle]

OK....sounds like it is a toss-up as far as glass goes. No one has talked about TRACKING and holding zero through a string.

You're asking about that regarding a March? You can't be serious.

Tracking and holding zero has never been an issue with my March scopes.

 

[4xforfun]

You're asking about that regarding a March? You can't be serious.

Tracking and holding zero has never been an issue with my March scopes.

March 10 - 60 x 56 is 32 oz.
NF 29 oz

 

[Turbulent Turtle]

March 10 - 60 x 56 is 32 oz.
NF 29 oz

I have the impression that we are not communicating, or more probably, that I am not following your train of thought.

I explained how the March HM with its Super ED glass elements retards the degradation of the IQ more than less-glassed riflescopes. I did state that I do not know if this of any importance in BR, like it is in F-class. You responded by saying the glass was a toss-up.

I also explained that tracking and holding zero are not an issue with the March scopes and you replied that the March is 32 ounces to the NF's 29 ounces.

You had not mentioned weight as a parameter but if it is, consider this. March has 2 fixed power scopes that are designed and prized by benchrest shooters. The March 48X52 with Super ED glass, and it weighs 22 ounces. The other one is the March 40-60X52 EP also with Super ED glass and this one weighs 24 ounces.

The benefit of a fixed magnification scope (and an FFP) is that there is absolutely no POA shift in the riflescope as you zoom in and out. The 40-60X52 uses an eyepiece 1.5X zoom to go from 40 to 60. This guarantees no POA shift going from 40 to 60X; the scope is fixed power; the eyepiece has the zoom.

Yes, SFP variable scopes can have POA shift has you go through the magnification range. I have detected that in a NF scope some years back. I have not been able to detect that in my two March scopes. But then again, I stay at 40X all the time on my 5-50X56 and now 50X all the time in my 10-60X56 HM.

This issue is in all SFP scopes. Lots of people will say, "not in my xxx scopes." Let's just say it's very difficult to detect, much more so nowadays compared to 10-20 years ago or more.

The NF comp is 29 oz, and it has a 30mm tube with thin 2mm walls and a 52mm objective. The March HM is 32 oz, and it has a 34mm tube with thick 4mm walls and a 56mm objective.

You should know that all March scope bodies start from an ingot of aluminum. And not just ordinary, run of the mill 6061 or 7075 aluminum like other riflescopes, but a special aluminum much better suited for this purpose. The ingot is machined down to its final shape; there is not extrusion, no gluing, no tricks; pure machining. There are no doors or other access ports to the inside, just the knobs and front & rear. The innards are fitted and installed, and this makes for a solid, homogenous and sealed riflescope. The March-X and -FX series have the tube bodies with 34mm diameter tubes, and the wall of these tubes is 4mm thick compared to the 2mm thickness of the 30mm tubes.

The March scopes are engineered to control the weight while maximizing the strength of the riflescope. I don't want to say any more than that but let's just say that I understand why these riflescopes are so strong and keep their zeros seemingly forever. Further, the knobs on the March scopes are excellent. They have a positive click feel and no backlash.

I have been accused of being a fanboy for March scopes, and I confess that I am. I learned a great deal about them over the years, talking with the designers and engineers at Deon. I have great respect for them and their accomplishments. I'm a long-time photographer enthusiast and I have been aware of ED and Super ED glass for decades. Deon was the first riflescope maker to use ED glass in riflescopes starting about 13-14 years ago and they are currently the only one using Super ED glass. I had a long thread here a year or so back discussing the benefits of ED and Super ED glass for control of CA and my hypothesis that another benefit was the reduced IQ degradation due to mirage.

Other riflescope makers copied Deon and introduced ED, or XD or HD glass since Deon started that, but no one else is using Super ED glass. So far.

 

[4xforfun]

I have the impression that we are not communicating, or more probably, that I am not following your train of thought.

I explained how the March HM with its Super ED glass elements retards the degradation of the IQ more than less-glassed riflescopes. I did state that I do not know if this of any importance in BR, like it is in F-class. You responded by saying the glass was a toss-up.

I also explained that tracking and holding zero are not an issue with the March scopes and you replied that the March is 32 ounces to the NF's 29 ounces.

You had not mentioned weight as a parameter but if it is, consider this. March has 2 fixed power scopes that are designed and prized by benchrest shooters. The March 48X52 with Super ED glass, and it weighs 22 ounces. The other one is the March 40-60X52 EP also with Super ED glass and this one weighs 24 ounces.

The benefit of a fixed magnification scope (and an FFP) is that there is absolutely no POA shift in the riflescope as you zoom in and out. The 40-60X52 uses an eyepiece 1.5X zoom to go from 40 to 60. This guarantees no POA shift going from 40 to 60X; the scope is fixed power; the eyepiece has the zoom.

Yes, SFP variable scopes can have POA shift has you go through the magnification range. I have detected that in a NF scope some years back. I have not been able to detect that in my two March scopes. But then again, I stay at 40X all the time on my 5-50X56 and now 50X all the time in my 10-60X56 HM.

This issue is in all SFP scopes. Lots of people will say, "not in my xxx scopes." Let's just say it's very difficult to detect, much more so nowadays compared to 10-20 years ago or more.

The NF comp is 29 oz, and it has a 30mm tube with thin 2mm walls and a 52mm objective. The March HM is 32 oz, and it has a 34mm tube with thick 4mm walls and a 56mm objective.

You should know that all March scope bodies start from an ingot of aluminum. And not just ordinary, run of the mill 6061 or 7075 aluminum like other riflescopes, but a special aluminum much better suited for this purpose. The ingot is machined down to its final shape; there is not extrusion, no gluing, no tricks; pure machining. There are no doors or other access ports to the inside, just the knobs and front & rear. The innards are fitted and installed, and this makes for a solid, homogenous and sealed riflescope. The March-X and -FX series have the tube bodies with 34mm diameter tubes, and the wall of these tubes is 4mm thick compared to the 2mm thickness of the 30mm tubes.

The March scopes are engineered to control the weight while maximizing the strength of the riflescope. I don't want to say any more than that but let's just say that I understand why these riflescopes are so strong and keep their zeros seemingly forever. Further, the knobs on the March scopes are excellent. They have a positive click feel and no backlash.

I have been accused of being a fanboy for March scopes, and I confess that I am. I learned a great deal about them over the years, talking with the designers and engineers at Deon. I have great respect for them and their accomplishments. I'm a long-time photographer enthusiast and I have been aware of ED and Super ED glass for decades. Deon was the first riflescope maker to use ED glass in riflescopes starting about 13-14 years ago and they are currently the only one using Super ED glass. I had a long thread here a year or so back discussing the benefits of ED and Super ED glass for control of CA and my hypothesis that another benefit was the reduced IQ degradation due to mirage.

Other riflescope makers copied Deon and introduced ED, or XD or HD glass since Deon started that, but no one else is using Super ED glass. So far.

I think you are reading this wrong. The weight thing was in response to someone's sugjestion of the Valdada..which weighs 48 OZ!!
The "glass is a tossup" thing comes from a few people saying "they are close....get what you like best...everyone's eyes are different".

 

[Turbulent Turtle]

I see. I guess I got confused when you responded to my message about tracking with a list of weights.

Conversations can be difficult in a forum.

As to the glass, I'm sure people are correct when they talk about them being close when they compare them in normal conditions. As I said earlier, excellent glass will be difficult to differentiate when you compare in good or excellent conditions. It's when the mirage hits the fan that things get interesting and when, in my experience and opinion, Super ED glass shines. I stay at 50X all the time.

 

[Mulligan]

I will take either of my March scopes any day and especially in mirage over my NF Comp scopes.
I do not know enough about lens coatings and such to speak intelligently about it, but I feel the difference in image quality is substantially better with my March scopes.
CW