The good & the bad reloading 45 ACP brass question

[Steve morgan]

I am going to be picking up my first 1911 - in 45 ACP and I typically reload for all my firearms so I wanted to get a head start on some brass & my daughter's boyfriend & i split 1000 once fired brass (mixed headstamp) and we sorted them out last night. We got more Winchester & Blazer then S&B, Federal & F C. As well as a few of other head stamps but these were the head stamps with enough to load with.

My question is will I have issues reloading any of these brass?

Does sorting pistol brass by headstamp make as much difference as it does in rifle reloading?

I notice mainly on some of the Blazer brass looks like it is either small pistol primers or they are military primers?
Thanks in advance
Gary

Blazer that I have has small primers, most other 45 brass has large primers. Don't mix them,will give you much grief.

 

[Rsadams]

You only use a taper crimp with 45 ACP. The best thing I have come across to stop all my functioning problems was to get a Lee Factory Crimp Die. After the rounds are loaded you use this die and it puts everything into the proper speck and my malfunctioning problems went away.

This... The Lee factory crimp die is all I use anymore....just to easy... A trick you can do is take 4 sized junk brass and 4 bullets you will be useing... I use Berry's so to much crimp is no good... Seat the bullets in the cases , adjust the Lee factory crimp die to start per instructions....

Now turn it a quarter turn in and crimp , replace that dummy round with another of the 4 , next turn it a half turn in and crimp.. Replace dummy round with the next and turn it down 3/4 and crimp and finally use your last dummy round and turn the adjustment a full turn and crimp... Now knock out all four bullets from their cases and it will show you how much crimp the die applied at 1/4 , 1/2 , 3/4 and a full turn... Most of the time you just want to remove the bell on the brass... This trick works very well when useing lead and wanting to know how much crimp the die has applied...

 

[Rsadams]

I agree most handgun bulk bullets benefit from weight sorting if trying to shoot 1 hole groups.
However...
All the Berry's bullets I've ever bought didn't need sorting. They are of superb quality in my opinion, and it shows on the targets.

Be careful I sent back a thousand pack of Berry because the weight was WAY off , normally their ok , but this pack had some big weight difference bullet to bullet. I am not knocking them , they made it right although the didn't believe me when I called them that they were that far off... They sent me a new thousand pack plus an extra 250 pack after I mailed the thousand pack back and said they were going to check on a lot of things to see what happened... Berry's is all I use still in my range loads and have shot thousands of them and due to their good C/S I will continue to do so...

 

[Matt in Virginia]

FWIW & IMHO,
Two recommendations.

1. A powder which excels at low charge weights, that you may like, is Hodgdon Titegroup. Cleaner than Winchester 231 and less flash. It was formulated for low charge weight loads with large case volume.

2. I realize you are loading on a Dillon 550 and extra die stations are not exactly jumping out of the woodwork, however, one die I don't load without, when loading .45 ACP in short runs on my RCBS PRO 2000, is a properly setup RCBS Lock-Out Die. Money well spent IMHO...







Read about it here:

http://ultimatereloader.com/2010/09/19/rcbs-lock-out-die-part-i-theory-of-operation/

Part Number: http://rcbs.com/Products/Accessorie...ing-Accessories/Progressive/Lock-Out-Die.aspx

Nothing makes up for paying close attention, however, this die(or one that works just like it) is worth it's weight in gold for double charges, no charge, or light charges(squibs). They are not cheap, however, I could not recommend them more highly. I run several on my RCBS PRO 2000(which I use for short run progressive loading).

It truly beats the dickens out of visual indicator dies(as shown below) that you can easily miss(granted we all SHOULD be paying ultra close attention, however, consider the lock-out die insurance), in that it will lock the press down cold, as opposed to just offering another visual indicator. The powder checker die below runs about two thirds of what the Lock-Out Die costs. Not even a horse race IMHO...



http://rcbs.com/Products/Accessorie...g-Accessories/Progressive/Powder-Checker.aspx

FWIW, IMHO, and YMMV.

Regards, Matt.

 

[Zero333]

Be careful I sent back a thousand pack of Berry because the weight was WAY off , normally their ok , but this pack had some big weight difference bullet to bullet. I am not knocking them , they made it right although the didn't believe me when I called them that they were that far off... They sent me a new thousand pack plus an extra 250 pack after I mailed the thousand pack back and said they were going to check on a lot of things to see what happened... Berry's is all I use still in my range loads and have shot thousands of them and due to their good C/S I will continue to do so...

I hear ya. I always weigh and measure 20 to 30 pieces no matter who made them.

 

[pcmacd]

Due to lead in the indoor ranges, manufacturers have made lead free primers, thus far to my knowledge they only make the lead free in small pistol primers. So unless you are very lucky some of the cases will be 45acp with small primer pockets. When priming cases and have the priming tool set up with large primers it is a brick wall when you try to prime a case with a small pocket. Sort them out and save them in a lot unto themselves. When you have enough you can load them also, or get rid of them so they don't get into the works with large primers.

I have never bought 45 acp brass in my life, and Iben reloading that one for 35 years.

 

[AckleymanII]

It amazed me how the thickness of the cases varied, thus, your taper crimp would vary. A barstow match barrel gave me fits till an old timer gave me some hints on setting a taper crimp die for a particular neck thickness(brand)....problem solved.

He also suggested that I give my 200g SWC a very slight jam, very slight to start the engraving on the rifling, and the results were amazing to say the least on weight sorted 200g flat base hard wad cutters I had cast. 6g of Unique was small ragged hole at 25 yards, custom totally rebuilt Kimber Gold Stainless Target.

 

[stork]

It amazed me how the thickness of the cases varied, thus, your taper crimp would vary. A barstow match barrel gave me fits till an old timer gave me some hints on setting a taper crimp die for a particular neck thickness(brand)....problem solved.

One of the benefits/curses of not sleeping at night is you have all kinds of time to squander on "I wonder if's". I actually did measure wall thickness' one night to check uniformity. IMI, TZZ, WCC Match, Win, Fed, S&B, PMC, Starline, Blazer. 3 measurements on each piece of brass.

Brands vary considerably in both uniformity and thickness. Best in uniformity was Federal, .0002- .0003, followed by IMI, .0003. Worst was PMC, .002

Keep in mind this is not a blanket statement of a brands QC. It is based only on the dozen or so of each brand I happened to pull from my supply to satisfy my own curiosity.

Experimentation with amount of taper crimp with the different brass will also give huge differences in group size. I used to crimp religiously to .468 with lead and .470 with jacketed. Swaged bullets are now crimped to .462 (Rem & TZZ Match brass), cast to .465 (WCC 90 Match), and jacketed (50 yard stuff) to .469 (TZZ Match and Rem). I use cast or swaged lead at 25 yards & under. Jacketed 185 hp at 50 yards.

All loads are run through my Ransom Rest at an indoor 50 meter range, so there is some consistency . The RR WILL NOT give you the best the load CAN shoot. The trained human hand will normally give the best. However the RR is consistent from the first load tested to the 20th load tested. The human hand & eye aren't.

The 3.8- 4.2gr of Bullseye load with either a 185 or 200 lead bullet is an excellent mild, accurate and forgiving load. Some 1911's will need to have a lighter recoil spring, but not all. If it's going to be a hunting load the above loads do not deliver sufficient energy for anything but small game.

As was mentioned. Your barrel is the best case checking instrument. If you're loading for several 45's, determine the tightest chamber and use that barrel. Remove it from the slide & chamber each round in the barrel. Anything that goes in tight, recheck the crimp or put it into the practice can.

OAL will vary with different bullet styles within the same grain weight if you measure cartridge base to bullet shoulder. Some bullet noses are quite long & will give you functioning issues because they wedge against the inside of the magazine. Usually on shot # 2 or 3. I seat everything (except jacketed) so there's about a thumbnail thickness of of lead exposed above the end of the brass. It works for every bullet I've tried so far.

Several have mentioned that the 45 is not a difficult cartridge to load for, and they're right. You can make this as easy or difficult as you want.

Enjoy.
Al

 

[EOD Rob]

The only separation I do is the primer size. Don't bother with headstamp. The biggest problems with reloading the 45 is closing the mouth and bullet choice as it affects feeding. Be VERY persnickety when setting up your dies. Expand the mouth of the case as little as you can and still get the bullet seated without shaving. Then set up your seater/crimper die to "straighten" the case wall. If you leave the slightest flare, you'll have feeding issues. I mean the slightest "can't see it with my readers on" flare. They are easy and even fun to reload because it goes so much faster, BUT getting to the range and having feeding issues with your son and friends waiting to shoot is a bummer! Ask me how I know.
I have one gun that hates semi wadcutters. It only likes roundnose bullets.

To add to joshb's flaring issue (totally agree), also understand that different head stamp can mean different case length. I dont seem to run into this problem with 45ACP as much as I do with 9mm. This will effect the crimp. If you set the dies on a long case, the shorter will not be crimped enough. If you set up on the short case, you risk wrinkling the longer ones. I tend to separate my brass for this reason. I dont trim, but maybe I should to get away from this issue. It would save adjusting the dies.

 

[cw308]

Got into this post late , I reload 45acp it's a simple round to reload , you don't have to trim . As for different brass brands and primer pockets , different brass brands may be thicker the others , it a good practice to separate and load one brand at a time , you will feel the difference when sizing and seating . Federal /FC are switching to small pistol primers . I just use small pistol primers on those I don't ream out the pockets. Most of the problems you will have in loading 45 auto is case bulge , get a 45auto case gauge to check your loaded rounds . I found the Lee Factory Crimp ( taper ) Die very helpful when used as the last step for tapering . I found when a few loaded case didn't fit flush in the gauge , running them through the Lee FCDie it corrected the problem . That doesn't mean you can just slap them together and the FCD will correct the problem but every once in awhile a bulge in the case may widen the case , the carbide ring at the base of the die will smooth it out. After using the FCD all my reloads operate 100% I'm using a mild load 4.8 W231 under a 230 FMJ in my 5" 1911 Colt , 4.6 in a 3" 1911 100% operation for target shooting.
Hope I Added some help.
Chris
PS: if you want you can look into the Lyman M Die instead of a flare it slightly widens the case mouth to seat the bullet straight , it's more of a step then a taper. Works very well.

 

[Catgunguy]

I agree with all of the above posters. I use the Lyman M die for the flare, and Lee factory crimp die.
I also sort by brand to control variations of brass thickness but also sort by over all length with in the brand of brass I will be reloading. That way once I set the flare die it will be uniform and also the crimps will all be the same.
P.S. Use the barrel of the gun you will be firing these loads in for the check gauge. It is the only check gauge that matters.

 

[cw308]

Cat
You go the whole nine yards . I'm not finding much of a difference in my 45 case lengths , always best to have them the same length for a proper crimp . The plunk test is good , the case gauge is a little tighter maybe picking up a slight deformity. There both good .
Chris

 

[XTR]

A really long time ago.... like when WW231 came in metal cans, I shot a 45 in USPSA/IPSC games. It was an absolute blast. I never was a competitive, but I had fun, and I practiced a lot. I shot thousands of rounds in the yr that I played. I found that 90+% of FTF problems were magazine problems, and I was shooting light SWCs with a huge flange for a shoulder. Back then there was no limited class so running light bullets fast with a high muzzle pressure ran the compensator better.

If you shoot TC, RN or heavier more reasonable SWCs you should be fine.

As others in here have said, I shot any and all brass or nickel plated 45 cases that I picked up at the range (there were no Small Primer 45s back then)

carbide dies;
as noted above, minimum flare,
lee taper crimp die