Standard FL Die vs. Bushing FL Die

['Freak]

You are making this stuff [up]? Or; repeating this stuff because ...?"
...

One more time; I fired a case with .127" clearance between the shoulder of the chamber and shoulder of the case

F. Guffey

What you got, an extractor with the Kung FO grip, or something other? Perhaps "FM", known only to F. Guffy, Master Reloader Man, you’ve failed to or simply refuse to reveal to us ‘n unworthy mere mortals?

 

[DeadEyeDick45]

What is the unit of measure of "tensions"? Or is that just another way of saying how many thousandths of an inch is the neck wall? Just curious.

 

[dmoran]

What is the unit of measure of "tensions"? Or is that just another way of saying how many thousandths of an inch is the neck wall? Just curious.

Dick -
The word "tension" means "state of being stretched". So when people (other then @fguffey) are talking about "neck tension" we are referring to a measured amount of tension of the neck on the bullet. That measurement is most commonly referred to in inches here in the USA.

Example:
0.267" = measured neck diameter after sizing, but before seating a bullet
0.269" =measured neck diameter after the bullet is seated
0.002" = the difference, and the amount of measured neck tension

Now fguffey can only comprehend measuring tension in lb/pounds or in "holds".
Also has stated many times that he may be the only with tension gauges, but his gauges do not measure tension, and that he wants all the "holds" he can get.
The rest of us are referring to how much we size down the neck in relationship to its stretched measurement of the loaded round.
Fguffey may also be the only one who can't comprehend the references simplicity, and maybe the only one to do a lot of other things !.!.!

Donovan

 

[fguffey]

What is the unit of measure of "tensions"?

One more time and trying to type slower; I do not know, I do not have a conversions for tensions to pounds and I do not have a tension gage that measures in tensions. The first tension gage I used measured in thousands of pounds and came with a multiplier. It was most simple, read the gage and then count the cables and multiply the number of cables time the reading on the gage.

And then if the someone said something about tensions the answer was always given in tons

F. Guffey

 

[DeadEyeDick45]

Dick -
The word "tension" means "state of being stretched". So when people (other then @fguffey) are talking about "neck tension" we are referring to a measured amount tension of the neck on the bullet. That measurement is most commonly referred to in inches here in the USA.

Example:
0.267" = measured neck diameter after sizing, but before seating a bullet
0.269" =measured neck diameter after the bullet is seated
0.002" = the difference, and the amount of measured neck tension

Now fguffey can only comprehend measuring tension in lb/pounds or in "holds".
Also has stated many times that he may be the only with tension gauges, but his gauges do not measure tension, and that he wants all the "holds" he can get.
The rest of us are referring to how much we size down the neck in relationship to its stretched measurement of the loaded round.
Fguffey may also be the only one who can't comprehend the references simplicity, and maybe the only one to do a lot of other things !.!.!

Donovan

Thanks Donovan, that was/is my understanding as well.
BTW, I prefer DeadEye.

 

[fguffey]

Perhaps "FM", known only to F. Guffy, Master Reloader Man, you’ve failed to or simply refuse to reveal to us ‘n unworthy mere mortals?

Thank you. What is it about the shoulder of the case setting against the shoulder of the chamber you do not understand? And then there is clearance; I know reloaders believe the case has head space, I don't. My cases do not have head space and every tool I use is not a head space tool. And then there is that infatuation reloaders have with case head separation. It is no riddle, I have fired cases in chambers with .127" clearance. I have a M1917 with a chamber that is .002" longer from the shoulder to the bolt face than a field reject length chamber +.002". That is .016" longer than a minimum length/full length sized case and .011" longer than a go-gage length chamber. If anything I do not understand your meaning with tension units. was correct my cases would have had case head separation on the case with the .127" clearance and I would have had case stretch or case head separation with the long chamber.

I can only guess you do not understand what 243Winxb said said (in his opinion) or you can not get your mind around what happens when the trigger is pulled.

A very disciplined reloader called from a firing range; he wanted to know what was wrong with Remington ammo. I said "I do not know" and I said their phone number is on the box. Later that after noon he showed up here with 15 fired cases and 5 cases that failed to fire. He said ever shooter at the range with a 30/06 rifle had a chance to bust the primers on the failed to fire rounds. If there was any truth to what Win 243 claims the cases would have shortened from the shoulder to the case head. The failed to fire rounds had at least 6 attempts with at least 4 rifles to fire. And then there is the part about "we all know?". I measured the length of the fail to fire cases and none of them were shorter. And then I pulled all of the cases down and removed the primers, nothing suspicious. I installed the primers back into the cases they were removed from and then chambered the 30/06 cases with primers only into one of my M1917s with killer firing pins. One by one I busted the primers and measured the length of the cases from the shoulder to the case head and found not one of the cases got shorter from the shoulder to the case head when hit with my killer firing pins.

The disciplined reloader did not get the shooters phone number and he threw the new Remington box in the garbage can. The firing pins in my M1917s do not make a 'click' sound when dropped, they make that 'CLiCK!' sound. I have rifles that have a sound that is so timid I am surprised the primer ever gets busted.

F. Guffey

 

['Freak]

Thank you. What is it about the shoulder of the case setting against the shoulder of the chamber you do not understand? And then there is clearance; I know reloaders believe the case has head space, I don't. My cases do not have head space and every tool I use is not a head space tool. And then there is that infatuation reloaders have with case head separation. It is no riddle, I have fired cases in chambers with .127" clearance. I have a M1917 with a chamber that is .002" longer from the shoulder to the bolt face than a field reject length chamber +.002". That is .016" longer than a minimum length/full length sized case and .011" longer than a go-gage length chamber. If anything I do not understand your meaning with tension units. was correct my cases would have had case head separation on the case with the .127" clearance and I would have had case stretch or case head separation with the long chamber.

I can only guess you do not understand what 243Winxb said said (in his opinion) or you can not get your mind around what happens when the trigger is pulled.

A very disciplined reloader called from a firing range; he wanted to know what was wrong with Remington ammo. I said "I do not know" and I said their phone number is on the box. Later that after noon he showed up here with 15 fired cases and 5 cases that failed to fire. He said ever shooter at the range with a 30/06 rifle had a chance to bust the primers on the failed to fire rounds. If there was any truth to what Win 243 claims the cases would have shortened from the shoulder to the case head. The failed to fire rounds had at least 6 attempts with at least 4 rifles to fire. And then there is the part about "we all know?". I measured the length of the fail to fire cases and none of them were shorter. And then I pulled all of the cases down and removed the primers, nothing suspicious. I installed the primers back into the cases they were removed from and then chambered the 30/06 cases with primers only into one of my M1917s with killer firing pins. One by one I busted the primers and measured the length of the cases from the shoulder to the case head and found not one of the cases got shorter from the shoulder to the case head when hit with my killer firing pins.

The disciplined reloader did not get the shooters phone number and he threw the new Remington box in the garbage can. The firing pins in my M1917s do not make a 'click' sound when dropped, they make that 'CLiCK!' sound. I have rifles that have a sound that is so timid I am surprised the primer ever gets busted.

F. Guffey

Again you’ve shamed me, or likely “we all” , oh Master. But how’s you expect all us lower life forms to ever learn a thang when our very Master never explains how to perform these most remarkable feats of pure FM?

 

[M-61]

One more time and trying to type slower; I do not know, I do not have a conversions for tensions to pounds and I do not have a tension gage that measures in tensions. The first tension gage I used measured in thousands of pounds and came with a multiplier. It was most simple, read the gage and then count the cables and multiply the number of cables time the reading on the gage.

And then if the someone said something about tensions the answer was always given in tons

F. Guffey

Are you talking about measuring cable tension in a suspension bridge?