Sorting Brass

[Twud]

Just got in 400 rounds of Remington brass for a PDog hunt in the spring, 200 in 222 and 200 in 223. I know that Remington brass is not the best, but Lapua and Nosler would have been a little pricey.
Question is, should I sort them? If so, on what basis? WT, neck thickness or concentricity? Does it really make a difference in a factory chamber. The guns are a pair of VS SF Remingtons.

 

[skipper]

For a factory rifle, I would spend my time deburring the inside flash holes since you can get some really big chunks of brass out of Remington cases. Then I would uniform the primer pockets with a Sinclair uniformer so the primers all seat correctly. Then I would chamfer the inside of the necks and fire form those puppies. After that I would trim all to the same length, chamfer again and deburr. If I really wanted to get picky I might turn the necks just enough to get them uniform and then I might think about sorting them based on internal volume. For a PD shoot, I probably wouldn't do much sorting at all.

You might want to consider coating your bullets with WS2 so you can shoot more and clean less often during the heat of battle.

 

[billmo]

I'm not a BR shooter. I have however, done a fair amount of shooting, reloading, and studying results. My thoughts on this subject is - there are some aspects of BR brass prep that does make a difference in factory rifles. I have tried several combinations of doing this thing and that to improve group size.
Some made a difference and some did not seem to help at all. Just my experience. Thanks, Bill

 

[Spotcheck_Billy]

DMCA67,

I don't have a dog in this fight and don't pretend to be the forum etiquette cop but please realize that we all have the right to our own opinions and should be free to express them on this board without being subjected to name calling and verbal abuse.

I'm quite sure that Catshooter can defend himself perfectly well, but that's not the point I'm trying to make here. This site is one of the few shooting sites on the net that has remained pretty civil over the years, and I for one would like to keep it that way. There's no place for insults and name calling here. I feel that the way you presented your opinions was out of line and would hope that you'd refrain from repeating this kind of lapse in civility in the future.

 

[jb77]

Catshooter, once again I see that you bring out the best in people.

Every comment of yours that I have read lately has an undercurrent of,your stupid if you do not do it this way).

Are you capable of giving advice without causing controversy?

You and DMAC take the vulgarity somewhere else please.

P.S. Most of us have seen great groups at far longer ranges than the one you posted. Because you can shoot doesn't give you the right to condescend.

 

[jb77]

I didn't say your advice was wrong. I object to your tone and your choice of verbage when responding to DMAC. I also object to what DMAC said.

You have adopted this air of it wasn't me, he called me a name first attitude on several occasions.

I am not questioning your background or qualifications. But your offensive tone and vulgarities are not appreciated. I am asking you as a fellow member of this Forum to clean it up a little.

 

[Spotcheck_Billy]

Donovan,
Just to keep the facts straight - it wasn't my question, it was Twud's.

 

[mysticplayer]

Twud, to answer your question directly, here is how I prep my brass for LR plinking. Same lot of brass from same manf which you have done. Deburr that flash hole,yep, chunks will come out but it only has to be done once). FIREFORM - I feel this is the most important step before load development. I use a very small charge of pistol powder and cream of wheat/cornmeal.

I resize using the Lee collet neck die. Will not induce runout which is the killer for accurate ammo.

Trim if you want - no biggie. Deburr inside and out - this is a big one as sharp edges on the neck can and will scrap up your bullets or cause bullets to seat cockeyed.

I also just neck turn enough to clean up 70 to 80% of the circumferance. Not a biggie but I feel better about max the brass potential. I want to be able to hit out to 1000yds.

Big one is get a concentricity guage. If you can keep your finished ammo to within 3 or 4 thou runout, you can make that pipe shoot. Properly bedded and tuned, that Rem should get 1/2 MOA with quality handloads.

Work up a load per usual small increments of powder,1 tenth of a grain is not too small). I like Benchmark, H322 as they meter very well if you decide to go large volume powder dispenser route. Varget is another good one but I have to weigh them as my powder drop will not give good consistency as the grains are too bulky.

I like CCI BR4 primers but the Win SR/CCI 200 might give you enough accuracy. I feel match primers help with LR dispersion which is critical to me hitting small targets. For the very small increase in price per shell, worth it to me.

Load accurate bullets. I shoot alot of Hornady poly tipped bullets and they will shoot near BR levels if your rifle is up to the task. Presently playing with 75gr Amax and have had no issue hitting pop can sized rocks at 670yds last time I was out.

If this is a max 250yd rifle and you are putting through bulk 55gr SP varmint bullets, go reg primers, dump your powder,military pull down like H335/A2230 is superb) and have fun. For this type of shooting, grab a Lee 1000 or other progressive press and fly at it. You can make MOA grade ammo without working too hard which is accurate enough.

If this is for shooting at extended distance, then I feel the extra effort to use a match primer, extruded powder and a match/varmint bullet is worth while.

Enjoy...

Jerry

 

[jb77]

Catshooter maybe you need a spellchecker also,as you have several misspelled words in your latest post.

Weren't you on Saubier not long ago. Seems to me that you were known for ranting over on that board also.

Personally I for one do not need or want your advice.

I cannot abide such a contentious person as your posts make you out to be.

I am done with you sir, you have lost any credibility you might have had in my humble opinion.

 

[CPorter]

Twud:

I disagree with Catshooter. Anything that decreases dispersion in a match will also decrease it on the field shooting prairie dogs and is worth the effort. Will you be able to tell the difference? Possibly not. Will it be worth one more prairie dog? Probably.

I have a Rem 700 VLS in .243 that I am using. I initially started like most shooting factory loads and reloading those cases like most people. I still have them and use them. Some of those cases I prepped after years of shooting and that prep did help reduce dispersion,group size).

In the last couple years I have bought 500 Remington cases and 100 cases in Norma and Lapua.

Remington does need the flash hole deburred. You can also sort by weight. Out of the 500 I found 250-300 that were within 1 grain of the same weight and used those for competition. Fire forming, trimming, ultrasonic cleaning and then sorting by case volume might be a better idea. Neck turning so all the cases are a uniform thickness is also a good idea.

I bought the Norma and Lapua after reading for years on the websites that they were better. The weight difference is certainly less than the Remington and they do the flash hole different. The cases I received had lips around the flash holes of varying sizes like they had been drilled with a dull bit. The necks are also more uniform than the Remington. The Norma needed the primer pockets uniformed as they were quite shallow, the Lapua primer pockets are deep enough the uniforming tool doesn't hit bottom usually.

I recently did a 400 yard match. For practice and rough sighting in I used some of the Remington brass I had sorted and prepped. After that I switched over to the Lapua. I noticed the group sizes were smaller with the Remington so I may do some more testing to see which of the many brands of brass I have produces better results. Come to think of it, the one time I finished in the trophies was with Remington brass and a Tasco scope. So, with good prep, the Remington cases will do fine. Without it, you might miss a little more often but you can still shoot and have fun.



DON'T FEED the TROLLS

 

[Twud]

Didn't want to start a cat fight.
As my case beburrer indexes off the mouth, shouldn't the cases be trimmed first?

 

[alf]

I quit indexing off the case mouth for deburring flash holes.
On Rem. & Win. brass the webb varies too much in thickness.
I chuck mine in a drill, set the stop a little long, and deburr with feel and sight. It only takes a few to get the hang of it.
You can hold the case up to the light and look inside with a magnifying glass to check your work. You don't need a huge bevel.
Btw, I detail all my prairie dog brass. Makes me feel good. I don't sort, but do toss the obvious defective ones.

Al.