Smokeless Powder flame temp.

[46and2]

Does anyone have an updated list of the heat of explosion/flame temp of powders in current production?
I've seen an old list a few years ago, not sure if it was from Quickload.
Thanks.

 

[Zero333]

https://pierrevanderwalt.com/barrel-life-calculator/

Choose the bullet diameter,
the charge weight
the powder manufacturer
then the powder, and it will show you the powder heat potential.

Not all the powders are there, but most of the popular ones are.

 

[46and2]

I've got that file from MikeCR, its pretty limited. I was mainly curious about N570, Ramshot LRT, RL26, RL23 and newer ones.

 

[Ranger188]

I wish I could copy and paste it here, but wouldn't let me, so I'll type it out. I'm leaving some out, mostly pistol.
If there is one missing let me know and I'll see if it's on the chart. Theirs 138 on the list.
Didn't see Ramshot LRT


Powder------ Burn Temp
VV N165--- 3500
H100v ------ 3545
VV N135------ 3590
VV N160------ 3620
H1000------ 3630
VV N133------ 3630
IMR 7977------ 3660
ACC 4064------ 3700
VV N170------- 3700
Retumbo------ 3710
IMR 4831------ 3720
VV N140------ 3720
H4350------- 3760
IMR 4350------- 3760
RL23 ------- 3770
VV N130------- 3770
VV N150------- 3780
RL16 ------- 3800
IMR 7828------- 3850
H4198------- 3860
H4831------- 3870
IMR 4064------- 3880
RL26------ 3905
IMR 8208------- 3920
IMR 4166 ------- 3920
IMR 4955------- 3950
Ramshot Tac------- 3950
VV N570------- 3950
RL19------- 3980
H335------- 3980
RL15------ 3990
RL17------ 3990
RL22------ 3990
IMR 4451------ 3990
RL10x ------- 4000
VV N560------ 4020
Varget------ 4050
VV N550------ 4050
H4895------ 4060
VV N530------ 4100
VV N540------ 4100

 

[46and2]

Imr8133?these are the ones I have.

 

[prwhite]

What's the pressure standard for those results?

 

[Webster]

Does anyone have an updated list of the heat of explosion/flame temp of powders in current production?
I've seen an old list a few years ago, not sure if it was from Quickload.
Thanks.

Is heat of explosion/flame temp a constant or is it determined under one set of conditions. Burn rates are determined under conditions that don't exist in a rifle.

 

[46and2]

Is heat of explosion/flame temp a constant or is it determined under one set of conditions. Burn rates are determined under conditions that don't exit in a rifle.

I'm taking that into consideration, even if it is hypothetical. I can tell that a barrel shot with N570 is hotter than Imr8133 or Retumbo loaded to the same pressure.
And throat erosion and fire cracking shows it too.

 

[AZgone]

How can Accurate 2700 be so much lower heat than 760 & 414, when all three are the same powder?

View attachment 1160826

 

[Murray Brook]

How can Accurate 2700 be so much lower heat than 760 & 414, when all three are the same powder?

View attachment 1160826

I never knew that they were the same powder. I knew of 760/414 but not AA2700.

 

[ebb]

That's why Ive been using VV165 in my 6.5-284 for years now.

 

[Alliant Reloading]

How can Accurate 2700 be so much lower heat than 760 & 414, when all three are the same powder?

View attachment 1160826

This observation/question sums up the fidelity of this list, I am sorry to say.

 

[kolar55]

How can Accurate 2700 be so much lower heat than 760 & 414, when all three are the same powder?

View attachment 1160826

Comparing charge weights and velocity, and pressure numbers in Quickload, Accurate's load data, and Hodgdon's load data along with the temp charts, I would say 2700 IS NOT the same as H414/760. Where did you get your information that they are the same?

 

[AZgone]

Where did you get your information that they are the same?

Western Powder, and Handloader Magazine has also published that info. October 2013 is one edition where that is published.

 

[AZgone]

Maybe I should ask a different question:
Is there a statistically significant difference in _any_ of the claimed heats of combustion on that list?

Or: What is the range of 1 standard deviation of testing 1 lot of each of those powders 30 different times? What is the range of 1 sd of testing 10 different lots of each of those powders? What is the repeatability (and reproducibility) of whatever test was performed to obtain those numbers?

It could easily be that someone somewhere tested something, possibly just one time and possibly on a very small quantity, and those numbers were the results of whatever test was performed. However, unless one knows something about the test and the variability of both the test and the powder lots, those figures may all be exactly the same (meaning, within 'normal' variation of the test or the powder, etc.).

I'm constantly amazed by how much significance we shooters seem to want to attach to a single number relative to any particular thing in our sport, and how little we seem to know or care about the variation that goes into such a number. I'm not convinced we 'know' even 5% of what we'd like to think we know about the things that go into our sport.

 

[46and2]

I'm not sure of the exact means the info was created but it didn't appear out of thin air, we as handloaders are trying to make sense of the madness. We're by no means taking anything at face value but trying to find meaning and qualify the intricacies and nuances of the value of 'powder A vs powder B'.

It's all in the name of curiosity, which often in history gives way to innovation.

 

[Zero333]

RL-23


=================================
RL-26


============================
RL-33

 

[Zero333]

N-565


========================

IMR-7977


======================

IMR-4955

 

[Zero333]

You should be able to click on the images to make them a little bigger.

 

[46and2]

Thank you very much.

Is Ramshot LRT or Imr 8133 available yet?