Should I get a new barrel or, stick this one out?

[Samdweezel05]

I will have to try the H4895 Sam! First though I'm going to have to get some more bullets. I have a box of 53gr. Sierra Match Kings but, I discovered today that they are really inconsistent in length. Varying as much as .005" from one bullet to the next, not cool! Whats bad is I have a box of cheap Speer 52gr. Varmints, $14.00 a box, and they only vary .0005" from the bunch that I measured. Too bad this rough barrel of mine blows them up or I would use them. Oh yeah, I forgot to mention how this barrel would blow these cheap Speer bullets up didn't I? Reguardless, I need some more bullets before I do any testing. I will post results when more bullets are attained ! Thanks!

Mike

I have great luck with the Nosler Ballistic Tip's in 50 and 55gr. I had issues with Hornady V-Max coming apart if I pushed them too fast in a faster twist. I am not a huge fan of the Sierra SMK's but I do have some here and usually use them to fire form brass to a chamber or to foul a barrel after cleaning.

 

[CanusLatransSnpr]

To be honest, I'm not a fan of Sierra bullets at all. I bought a box of 55gr. Sierra Blitkings and couldn't get them to shoot real consistently. Been through two boxs of 55gr. Nosler Ballistic Tips and they seemed to shoot better and more consistently. I bought the box of 52gr. Speer bullets because I've had such good luck with the 70gr. Speer TNT in my .243 that I figured I would give them a try. They were priced right too. We'll get something figured out here and soon. Thanks!

Mike

 

[Goofycat]

Thanks for all the replies guys, I appreciate it. I have several different powders at my disposal: H380, H414, H4895, Varget, I4320, and I4007SSC so I may try one of those other than H380. I haven't given up on this one quite yet but, I'm getting close. A little more shooting and we will see. Thanks again!

Mike

Try out the H4895 you have now. I haven't had very good luck with H380 in any of my .22-250's. I use IMR4895. Also, I don't know how you are loading them but try and slow them down a bit. I have had a couple of Savage .22-250 barrels that didn't like to be pushed very fast. Almost like the rifling isn't doing it's job very well and they have a hard time to stabilize bullets if you load too hot. Good luck with it.

I read somewhere a few years ago that H380 ball powder tended to be a "dirty" powder when compared to the stick powder, or it maybe have been that the ball powders are inherently dirtier than the stick powders---I forget which. Ball powder is easier to meter, but I wouldn't know since I use the short-cut stick stuff exclusively and have never used ball powder. I use H4895 in my .22-250 and I haven't seen any difference in performance than with Varget. H4198 goes in the .222, and it has worked well in this particular rifle.

 

[CanusLatransSnpr]

Barry,
You are correct, ball powders are inherently dirtier than the extruded powders out there. The ease of metering, plus the velocity, make them a popular powder to use. As has been said, H380 is an extremely accurate powder with the 22-250 but, can be fussy at times too.

Mike

 

[Goofycat]

Thanks, Mike. You have confirmed that my memory hasn't completely failed. ;D It is weird that I have some full containers of ball powder that I have never used; H380 is one. I guess I got lucky hooking up with the extruded variety and just never had any reason to use the ball powder.

 

[MrMajestic]

Have you tried the 75 gr. A-Max? My Savage 12 in .223 with a 1 in 9" twist absolutely loves them, 1/2 MOA all day. I like the Varget suggestion and the single base powder may be easier on your barrel. As for clean-up try the KG products, they will take the work out. Keep it clean and it may smooth out. I use their bore polish on my factory barrels and it really helps the first shot from a clean barrel.

 

[joed49]

Like LawrenceHanson I had terrible luck with H380 in my .22-250. I had always heard it was the best powder for this cartridge, and I'll admit it shot good in mine at times.

The problem I had with H380 is it seems to be very temperature sensitive. Hunting over the winter I saw the POI drop 3" and groups open up depending on temp.

I switched to Varget and cured the problem. I will never use another ball powder in this Ohio climate.

I'm also not a fan of JB or any abrasives anymore. I drove myself crazy on one rifle trying to keep copper out. I probably caused a lot of premature wear using JB. What I use now is Sweets. I'll brush the barrel to start. Next I use Sweets on a patch. It comes out blue or green depending on how much copper there is. I continue till the patch comes out clean. Then I run an oiled patch through followed by a dry patch.

 

[CanusLatransSnpr]

Majestic and joed, thanks! I have considered using the 75gr. A-max but, I'm just hung up on speed and for some reason don't want to sacrifice it. I guess I still need to grow up in the rifle world huh ? As far as the JB goes, I don't use it very often, maybe every 75 shots or so give or take. My normal routine is a couple wet patches of Butch's. Then 10-15 strokes of a bore brush. A couple more wet patches of Butch's. Dry patch all the Butch's out then go after the remaining copper with Patch out. Seems to have worked pretty well. Maybe my cleaning routine is the hole in the prophylactic? What do you guys think?

Mike

 

[joed49]

Trust me, lose the JB and other abrasives, they aren't doing you any favors. I honestly think I shortened barrel life by using it. Once I switched to Sweets and my current cleaning method I've noticed no problems with copper. When the patch comes out with no green you're done.

Many people don't realize that bronze cleaning brush is also giving the appearance of copper in the barrel. That is why I start with the brush and follow with Sweets. If there is any copper in your barrel this stuff will remove it, without abrasives. Just don't leave this stuff in your barrel and put it away. It works great but I wouldn't leave it in the barrel for long periods.

I fell into the Sweets when I went to a high power match here. Noticed many of the shooters using it, so gave it a try. I have enough of it to last my lifetime.

And unless you live in Hawaii where the climate is always the same I'd get away from the H380. It shot good in my rifle but I noticed every range trip it produced different results.

Varget has worked but I still think there's something better for the .22-250. Until I find it I'll continue using Varget.

 

[joed49]

I'm also not a fan of the heavy .224 bullets like the 75 gr Hornady. I like velocity for one thing. My second biggest reason for not using heavy bullets is the areas I hunt are somewhat rural but there are houses and farm animals around. I want a bullet that disintegrates on contact like the light varmint bullets.

I got rid of a Savage 10 fp in .223 because the only bullet it would shoot great was the 69 gr match bullet. It was fantastic at the range but worthless for varmint hunting. Hated to sell it but I moved on to the .22-250 at this point.

 

[joed49]

I'll also throw one other item out there on bullets. I'm fairly new to reloading for the .22-250 even though I have been reloading for 34 years.

I had a terrible time getting good groups in the beginning until someone happened to mention they had problems with their rifle if the length was over 2.350. I actually thought the person was nuts as I've always seated bullets out close to the lands for other cartridges. In desperation I tried the recommended length and produced 1/2" groups where I had 2" before. This still has me shaking my head but it works.

Also, my rifle and a friend's seem to be picky with bullets. The 2 best bullets so far have been the Sierra 55 gr SBT and the 52 gr Match. I've had no luck with Nosler or Hornady bullets.

Loading for the .22-250 has really been an experience, different from any other cartridge I ever loaded.

 

[benchracer]

If lighter bullets and higher velocity is your cup of tea in the 22-250, I have to question the selection of a model with a 9 twist barrel. I don't know if your problems are being caused by a twist rate/bullet weight mismatch or not, but I've got to think that it at least is a possibility. If you ultimately decide to rebarrel, I would carefully consider what bullet weights you really want to shoot and choose an appropriate twist.

I have a 22-250 with a 1/14 A&B barrel. It is shooting pretty well, but it took a lot of load development work and rifle tweaking to get there. After stubbornly refusing to shoot under an inch with any factory ammo, my rifle is producing pretty consistent .6" groups @ 100 yards with 50g VMAX's and 52g AMAX's seated at 2.435" COAL over near-max charges of Varget.

It does change point of impact after a thorough cleaning though. Following a thorough cleaning, it takes about 15 rounds to foul the bore. After that, the point of impact shifts about 2" low and stays there long enough that I have run out of ammo before I have seen another change in point of impact. I am going to firelap the bore and see if that makes the point of impact more consistent or reduces the number of rounds needed to foul the bore before it settles down.

In comparison to my other rifles, I would definitely agree that the 22-250 can be somewhat temperamental. Because of that, I don't think that you should give up on your factory barrel just yet. I believe that you should experiment a bit with different bullet weights and consider firelapping. If your rifle still doesn't respond, then change barrels.

 

[joed49]

In comparison to my other rifles, I would definitely agree that the 22-250 can be somewhat temperamental. Because of that, I don't think that you should give up on your factory barrel just yet. I believe that you should experiment a bit with different bullet weights and consider firelapping. If your rifle still doesn't respond, then change barrels.

Temperamental? That's an understatement. Of all the cartridges I've loaded the .22-250 is the hardest to get to shoot well. My current rifle is actually my third in this cartridge. I started with a Savage 12 VSSF, a nice looking rifle that no matter what I did it strung shots vertically. The second was a 700 VS with a nice rigid synthetic stock, and it was accurate. Like a fool I sold it and kept a Savage 10 in .223.

I never loaded for the first 2 rifles and just had a good supply of factory ammo. Last year I started loading for a friends .22-250, that's when I discovered how temperamental this cartridge can be. Factory Remington ammo produced 3/4" groups in his rifle while my reloads produced 2" groups. That was my first lesson with this cartridge, keep the length at 2.350.

Over the summer my friends rifle shot fine. By September he noticed the POI kept changing as temperatures started to drop. By October it was hitting 3" lower. We switched to Varget at this point and POI stayed constant. In October I got my third .22-250, a 700 SPS VS Stainless Cabelas Edition.

Having a supply of H380 I started there. Just like my friend I noticed POI changed with the temperature. So now I use Varget also. No big thing, I keep Varget on hand for my .308 Win. So far mine prefers only the Sierra 52 gr match bullet, nothing else has given good accuracy. I can cover 3 shots with a dime.

I have 60 rounds through my latest rifle and I'm waiting for a nice day when I can get some range time with it.

And darn, I did not want a .22-250 in my latest rifle. I wanted a Swift but just couldn't find one. Remington offered the Swift in the 700 VS SFF, at a price of $1100. I picked up the Cabelas Edition for $480 but ended up changing the stock and trigger. I'd bet the Swift is no where near as temperamental as the 250. I'll always wish I'd held out for that Swift.

Looking ahead, when it comes time to rebarrel I may go for the .243. But that's a ways off, and who knows, I may hit the right combination that gives great accuracy before then.

 

[Goofycat]

I have had no problems with my .22-250, using 55-grain Noslers and 32-33 grains of H4895 ignited by CCI bench rest primers and Remington brass properly prepared. Of course, a blueprinted 40X action and Hart barrel, all put together in a McMillan stock by Darrell Holland may have influenced the accuracy. 8)

 

[joed49]

I have had no problems with my .22-250, using 55-grain Noslers and 32-33 grains of H4895 ignited by CCI bench rest primers and Remington brass properly prepared. Of course, a blueprinted 40X action and Hart barrel, all put together in a McMillan stock by Darrell Holland may have influenced the accuracy. 8)

By Hodgdon's data you probably are moving that bullet slightly slower then 3500 fps. It doesn't keyhole? What twist are you using?

 

[Goofycat]

I haven't noticed any keyholing. I'm using a 1:14 twist. I suppose I could jam more powder into the cases, but since things work well with the present loads, I decided that if it ain't broke.......

 

[CanusLatransSnpr]

From what I've read the longest 55gr. ballistic tip in .224 is the Sierra Blitzking. I've heard of some guys havin difficulty in shooting those through a 14 twist barrel but then shoot the 55gr. Noslers just fine. You guys are right though, the 22-250 is a tough cartridge to get to shoot well. Atleast for me anyways.

Benchracer, no offense but, if the best groups I was gettin from a custom barrel were .6" I would have to think about getting a different barrel. Thats just my opinion though. As for your comment on the bullet weight I'm shooting versus twist. I got the fast twist so I had the "option" of shooting the heavier pills and still be able to shoot the lighter ones if I felt like it. Hind sight being 20/20 I should have opted for the 1 in 12 twist but, it is what it is.

Mike

 

[m-saunoras]

i concur with all of the above. I gave up on the same barrel as the OP, 9 twist savage VLP 22-250. I liked the concept but i didn't like the way it shot

I've since gone to a shilen 8 twist and what a shock, it doesn't shoot that much better. it took me almost 300 rounds through the new barrel to find a VLD bullet,powder combo i was satisfied with.

The heavy bullets will shoot but load development was very discouraging as a shooter. There were many times i wish i had gone with a 6BR

EDIT- also, i found a harder hold on my rifle is necessary to settle down the heavier bullets.

 

[CanusLatransSnpr]

cammed3800, I found the same to be true with my 22-250 even with lighter bullets. If I held the stock some what firm with my right hand and snug against my shoulder that the groups would be a little better. I thought the same thing also that a 6BR would be a better option if I were to rebarrel.

Mike

 

[benchracer]

Benchracer, no offense but, if the best groups I was gettin from a custom barrel were .6" I would have to think about getting a different barrel.

No offense taken. The barrel on my 22-250 is a cheap PTSC A&B, so it is kind of straining the definition of custom to call it a custom barrel. I have a 1/12 Shilen waiting in the wings for when I have shot this one out. For a varmont rifle, .6" isn't great, but it is sufficient to do what I need it to do. Smaller groups might make me feel clever, but are really not necessary for my intended application.

From the beginning, this rifle has been intended to function as a test bed that I have used to good effect to teach myself some things about gunsmithing, hand loading, and marksmanship. It has served me well in that capacity.