There is always a reason, Matt. In the lottery that we call relay assignment, winners and losers emerge. Shoot enough matches and it will happen. Thanks for the insight.
Scores Canadian Nationals
- Thread starter manitou210
- Start date
There is always a reason, Matt. In the lottery that we call relay assignment, winners and losers emerge. Shoot enough matches and it will happen. Thanks for the insight.
Matt, i have to say i dont agree with the "bad relay" determining the rank of a shooter. Of course it can affect a score but the best shooter will always find the way to be on top. In this case, even if 20+ points were lost in that specific relay, there was still a gap of 41 points between Kevin and Brian.
Believe me i understand your point. At last year Nationals, i was squadded with a beginner that started with a bunch of misses, was not able to keep score and once on target, was using all of it making it hard for the pullers. Did it affect my score, yes. Do i blame the shooter or target puller, no. Its up to me to become stronger and not get affected by distractions.
Once a shooter have a very good load and can hold vertical, reading the conditions is all that is required....not that its simple ! The Chou have invested a lot of time in practice and deserve all the honor that come with their outstanding performance.
As for myself in F-Open, to be at the top i simply need to be....better !
Believe me i understand your point. At last year Nationals, i was squadded with a beginner that started with a bunch of misses, was not able to keep score and once on target, was using all of it making it hard for the pullers. Did it affect my score, yes. Do i blame the shooter or target puller, no. Its up to me to become stronger and not get affected by distractions.
Once a shooter have a very good load and can hold vertical, reading the conditions is all that is required....not that its simple ! The Chou have invested a lot of time in practice and deserve all the honor that come with their outstanding performance.
As for myself in F-Open, to be at the top i simply need to be....better !
Well said Jonathan been there had it happen to me as well its part of the game we play.
Darin
Darin
Shoot LR long enough and you will see the proverbial bunny relays, the relays from Hades and everything in between. It boils down to how you deal with the cards you're dealt and if the individual feels they did well in the conditions presented. If you felt that you performed as best you could, how did you rate compared to others on that specific relay? For some (realists in particular), that is enough satisfaction, knowing that you "won your relay".
It's why Camp Perry has shoot-offs for LR events, taking the top shooter from each relay, from each division and it makes sense if you like fair play.
In long aggs (like the Nat'l LR Championship or the World's), a single relay normally won't be the death of a good score because things tend to even out over time. That is unless bad luck follows you around. Then, there's golf and you can drink doing that.
It's why Camp Perry has shoot-offs for LR events, taking the top shooter from each relay, from each division and it makes sense if you like fair play.
In long aggs (like the Nat'l LR Championship or the World's), a single relay normally won't be the death of a good score because things tend to even out over time. That is unless bad luck follows you around. Then, there's golf and you can drink doing that.
If you shoot long enough, those things happen. The Chou's put in a lot of trigger/coaching time at that particular range, which probably helps too
I agree Monte, for sure it help. This range require extreme hability in wind reading skills. I guess it can be compared to a US FTR shooter that have a couple US National record at the same range....shot at 6800ft altitude.....and leave within 2 hours from the range. The talent is still undeniable but....
Ned Ludd
Silver $$ Contributor
Even the very best shooters can sometimes have a mediocre performance...unfamiliar conditions resulting in sub-optimal wind calls, load issues, relay selection, etc. Even a few dropped points here and there will add up over the course of a match. None of which takes away from the outstanding accomplishments made by the Chou brothers in F-TR. In fact, these issues further underscore how well they really performed.
Camp Perry shoot-offs don't go quite far enough! Surely, it is reasonably fair to determine first place. But, what about second place and third place...a shoot off is not used to determine those two placings, those go to the luck of the relay draw! If Camp Perry were really to be concerned about "fairness for every competitor", they would squad the first day based on competitors' classifications, and then "seed squad" after the first day's competition, and daily thereafter. Don't you think.
That is why the F-Class Nationals will probably never be held at Camp Perry.
Dan
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Down South
FTR Junkie
Congrats to the winners, great shooting guys!
XTR
F-TR obssessed shooting junkie
What I write below takes nothing from Will and Kevin, their scores speak for themselves.
It's pretty obvious looking at the scores in down the list in F-TR that there were some very relay dependent results, and it was not seeded, I wasn't there, but I know enough of the shooters and know how they shoot. There are too many odd placings for this to be good day/bad day results. There are people in the bottom half I would expect to see in the top 10, and more than one of them.
It's pretty obvious looking at the scores in down the list in F-TR that there were some very relay dependent results, and it was not seeded, I wasn't there, but I know enough of the shooters and know how they shoot. There are too many odd placings for this to be good day/bad day results. There are people in the bottom half I would expect to see in the top 10, and more than one of them.
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Shiraz
Site $$ Sponsor
The way it went down was as follows for F-Open, and I suspect similarly for F-T/R:
First day - most of the top shooters were squadded on relay 1, except for some that were in relay 2. We shot first, as well as last, I believe. The wind was not heavy the first day, but a little tricky.
Second day - the same group was squadded in relay 3. The wind picked up for most of the day (with deceiving flags and mirage) and there were musical chairs. I shot on one relay where my first shot for record was a 3 and I shot another 3 a few minutes later! The whole group of us dropped many points. Some of the guys tumbled in the standings and some moved up.
Final day - 20 round shoot off. Shooters were squadded by order of overall standing. The top place and the second place shooter shot side by side, the third and fourth side by side - all the way down the line. All the top shooters shot together in the same conditions.
First day - most of the top shooters were squadded on relay 1, except for some that were in relay 2. We shot first, as well as last, I believe. The wind was not heavy the first day, but a little tricky.
Second day - the same group was squadded in relay 3. The wind picked up for most of the day (with deceiving flags and mirage) and there were musical chairs. I shot on one relay where my first shot for record was a 3 and I shot another 3 a few minutes later! The whole group of us dropped many points. Some of the guys tumbled in the standings and some moved up.
Final day - 20 round shoot off. Shooters were squadded by order of overall standing. The top place and the second place shooter shot side by side, the third and fourth side by side - all the way down the line. All the top shooters shot together in the same conditions.
At the Berger SWN's a couple of times back, about 100 F-Class competitors met with an NRA representative at Ben Avery re having the FCNC at Camp Perry. In so many words, to a man, those competitors made it know that they would not attend any FCNC at Camp Perry unless seed squad was employed. I'd say they are very well are on notice how the F-Class community feels about shoot-offs! Possibly they may cross over to seed squad one day?
Dan
Don't think high power competitors feel any different.
There's several reasons why attendance numbers have been declining now for several years; you can count this one among them.
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