Savage ftr .308

[josebd]

this is going to be my first .308,it's going to weigh around 14-15lbs,with 150 bthp bullets what can I expect with recoil?
I've shot,.270,30-06,just curious what to expect?
A little more than .243?

 

[jonbearman]

Due to the weight(I have one) it is quite manageable. It is more than .243 and less than 30-06 for sure. If you use a rest and a bag to steady it ,I can shoot mine all day without discomfort. Eventually you will probably experience copper fouling as savage barrels are standard production barrels that are a bit rough so break in takes quite a bit. After 200 rounds it will likely shoot better but search our index about cleaning barrels the right way to keep heavy fouling at bay. There are many companys offering way better barrels when you get sick of finicky accuracy. They are not all like that but some are not so great. I would look at criterion, mcgowen, brux, kreiger,x-caliber, etc for replacement drop in barrels. Mine shot the 168 grain match hpbt's. For longer than 200 yards the heavier bullets work better like 180 grains plus to 200 grains. Berger,sierra,hornady make real decent bullets with berger being one of the very best production bullets out there.

 

[Alexander-M]

You won't have any problem.
My 5'2", 72-yr old wife enjoyed shooting my Savage-12 F-T/R prone and from the bench. She even won a mini match (200 yd) with it. I always loaded 168-gr SMK with 45-gr Varget.

Nando

 

[memilanuk]

Take a look at the various .30 cal 155-155.5 gn target bullet offerings from Sierra and Berger (haven't kept track of the other brands), running @ 2950-3050fps. Stick a bipod on that gun, and a good (large) scope and you'll be knocking on 17 lbs +. It really is a pussy-cat when you get it loaded up like that... and very easy to shoot well. The heavier bullets that are currently in favor in formal competition are a bit harder to drive well with that stock.

 

[josebd]

nando thats quite a bit over max published load?

 

[memilanuk]

@josebd it depends on a number of things... the lot of powder, the length of the throat, etc. Loading manuals are one-size-fits-all, and as such usually tend towards the conservative side of things.

45gn isn't especially hot, or even really warm. As long as the person reading takes the basic precaution of working up the load in *their* gun. I've ran more powder than that behind 185 Juggernauts in one gun... but it had its own particular set of quirks that allowed that to work.

 

[Alexander-M]

(Milanuk) Well said.

Josebd, I started with 43 gr, worked up to 46 gr, and 45 worked best for my rifle with 168 SMK's. I tried 155 and 175's, but could not get them to shoot as well as the 168's; however, that was me and this rifle, and results will differ. I sold the rifle last year, and the happy buyer called me to thank me for letting him have such a 'tack driver'. The rifle was great.

Good luck!

Alex

 

[Wjesswheel]

@josebd it depends on a number of things... the lot of powder, the length of the throat, etc. Loading manuals are one-size-fits-all, and as such usually tend towards the conservative side of things.

45gn isn't especially hot, or even really warm. As long as the person reading takes the basic precaution of working up the load in *their* gun. I've ran more powder than that behind 185 Juggernauts in one gun... but it had its own particular set of quirks that allowed that to work.

Was wondering what your trim to length was on your 45 and 46 gn loads and how much they grow when fired and what brass your using,

 

[Wjesswheel]

(Milanuk) Well said.

Josebd, I started with 43 gr, worked up to 46 gr, and 45 worked best for my rifle with 168 SMK's. I tried 155 and 175's, but could not get them to shoot as well as the 168's; however, that was me and this rifle, and results will differ. I sold the rifle last year, and the happy buyer called me to thank me for letting him have such a 'tack driver'. The rifle was great.

Good luck!

Alex

Was wondering what your trim to length on your 46 and 45 grain load is and how much they grow when fired and what brass you use

 

[Alexander-M]

Lapua Brass, trimmed 2.005, and they seemed to grow about 0.005" after FL sizing with a Forster die. The 168 SMK's were seated 2.220 CBTO. Also, the new Sierra's 168 TMK's worked well, but I did not do as much testing with them. (I won 500 of these bullets at a match.) For the match my wife won, I used the 168 TMK's with 44.10 gr Varget and seated 2.190 CBTO. IIRC, jump was 0.015 - 0.020.

Hope this helps.

Alex

 

[Wjesswheel]

Lapua Brass, trimmed 2.005, and they seemed to grow about 0.005" after FL sizing with a Forster die. The 168 SMK's were seated 2.220 CBTO. Also, the new Sierra's 168 TMK's worked well, but I did not do as much testing with them. (I won 500 of these bullets at a match.) For the match my wife won, I used the 168 TMK's with 44.10 gr Varget and seated 2.190 CBTO. IIRC, jump was 0.015 - 0.020.

Hope this helps.

Alex

I am fairly new to reloading (2.5 years) and was trimming to 2.015 ( trying to keep my length long to protect the throat, seems I read it somewhere) shooting 168smk working up loads with varget. I started with 41.5 gn .020 off and worked up and found good loads at 42.3 and 42.6 and continued up from 42.6 up to 44 in .3 gn spreads the groups kept getting bigger from 42.6 up. At 44 I noticed a considerable more amount of recoil, when I ejected the shell I noticed a small sliver of brass in the chamber area think i shot 4 at 44 grains same thing small sliver of brass and no noticeable pressure signs on my primers. So I stopped. Thinking from the recoil something wasn't right When I got home I noticed the case mouths were beveled in. So I have been shooting the 42.6 and they shoot great out to 600 not so great out to 1000. I keep hearing guys talk of the high node up around 2850 but been Leary of trying to reach it due to the above. I have been trimming now to 2.005 and thinking the pressure I was feeling in recoil was from my necks growing to 2.020 and that was causing the pressure spike and the big groups. Is it possible at 2.020 I am hitting the end of my throat. And now that iam trimming to 2.005 I could try to reach the higher node in say .3 increment from 42.6 till I see pressure signs on my primers?

 

[memilanuk]

At 44 I noticed a considerable more amount of recoil, when I ejected the shell I noticed a small sliver of brass in the chamber area think i shot 4 at 44 grains same thing small sliver of brass and no noticeable pressure signs on my primers. So I stopped. Thinking from the recoil something wasn't right

Probably a good thing that you stopped. The primer may not have had any marks, but what about shiny spots on the case head? Typically you see the little brass slivers (depends on what size, could be something else entirely) from brass that gets extruded under pressure into the ejector hole in the bolt face, then sheared off when you open (rotate) the bolt. Not good, as a general rule.

When I got home I noticed the case mouths were beveled in.

No idea what you're talking about here. Aren't you chamfering the case mouths?

So I have been shooting the 42.6 and they shoot great out to 600 not so great out to 1000.

...and now you know why 168s in general aren't all that popular for LR shooting (in .30 cal, with the notable exception of the Berger 168 VLD).

I keep hearing guys talk of the high node up around 2850 but been Leary of trying to reach it due to the above.

I've seen guys shooting at or near that upper node with S168MKs... the bullet is still a flying brick... throwing it faster doesn't really help all that much.

I have been trimming now to 2.005 and thinking the pressure I was feeling in recoil was from my necks growing to 2.020 and that was causing the pressure spike and the big groups. Is it possible at 2.020 I am hitting the end of my throat. And now that iam trimming to 2.005 I could try to reach the higher node in say .3 increment from 42.6 till I see pressure signs on my primers?

I normally trim to 2.005" or 2.010". I was going to say that I didn't think there was any way you were close to the end of the chamber neck area @ 2.020", but going back and looking at a few chamber prints changed my mind. Some - like the print I have for the 2013 USFTR reamer - shows a minimum chamber length of 2.045", tapering down to the freebore diameter by 2.062". Another (a custom reamer print someone sent me) shows a minimum of 2.020" and a max of 2.046". So it is possible - but I'd still say unlikely, as I don't think Savage put *that* tight of a chamber in those guns. Sinclair Int'l sells tools for determining your actual chamber length if you really really want to know. Not that expensive overall, but something I've never really worried about to be honest. A .308 isn't really a barrel burner, so a lot of that hoopla about saving the throat... is over rated in this case.

Personally I'd just trim them back to SAAMI trim-to length @ 2.005", trim them every 2-3 firings (or every firing if you have a Giraud or something that makes the whole trim-chamfer-deburr process fairly painless) and call it a day.

I *don't* think you're going to magically be able to work up to a hotter load just because you trimmed the case neck a little shorter.

 

[Wjesswheel]

Probably a good thing that you stopped. The primer may not have had any marks, but what about shiny spots on the case head? Typically you see the little brass slivers (depends on what size, could be something else entirely) from brass that gets extruded under pressure into the ejector hole in the bolt face, then sheared off when you open (rotate) the bolt. Not good, as a general rule.



No idea what you are talking about here are you chamfering the case mouths

Yes iam prepping the inside and outside, As far as the case mouth being beveled in here is a pic on the left is one shot at 42.6 gn of varget and the one on the right 44 grains, it also has a black carbon ring maybe? Ring around it. It's has a sharper edge and definitely feels like it has slid inside of something smaller then my throat. Again iam newbie and don't know that much, so I appreciate the time you took for the detailed answer.. About 95percent of my reloading has been learned my the guys on here. Will this possibly spike my pressure

 

[Lbart]

Joe, I sent you a PM.

 

[josebd]

Shot 5 rounds through it this morning,not bad at all.
The last 3 shots were all touching at 75 yards with hornady superformance 150 set,first 2 were getting scope set.