Redding FL Bushing or Collet/Body: Undecided...

[Phil3]

I am shooting 223 Remington in an AR15 chambered in 223 and also in a factory Howa action/barrel. From some highly respected advice I received here, it looks like the Lee Collet/Redding body die approach is preferred, especially if not neck turning. I don't think I would mind neck turning, but not sure. After all, I am new and everything looks fun right now.

I am kind of thinking of a modest cost neck turn setup, and the Redding FL Bushing die, because I can then easily adjust for higher bullet tension in the AR15 vs the bolt action, with the neck turning assuring the bullet has as little runout as the exterior case neck. With the Lee collet, I have heard of 223 bullet tension of 001", which makes me nervous in an AR.

Opinions?

Phil

 

[dboyles]

I load a lot of .223, although I don't load "precision" for the AR. I recently sold my Redding bushings and dies. I use a collet + body die for my bolt gun and a Forster FL die for my AR. The Forster has the expander polished down by a couple of thousandths to give me the desired neck tension, and honestly I'm pretty amazed at how concentric the necks are. This is with LC brass and my Co-Ax press.

I'd say skip the Redding and try both the collet + body die setup as well as a Forster FL die. Chuck the expander ball in a drill and use some Flitz + steel wool on it. Maybe have Forster hone the neck out to your specs to keep the necks from being overworked. See what works for you and your brass.

 

[jb27]

If you go with the Lee Collet die, you can always purchase extra mandrels and polish them down to create whatever size you want giving you the ability to achieve your desired neck tension. The LCD's are very easy to assemble/re-assemble and switching out mandrels would take same time as changing a bushing on another die. You could also purchase two LCD's and have one set up for a tighter neck tension for your AR and one set up a little looser for bolt guns. The cost of two LCD's would probably be less than 1 bushing die let alone the cost of the bushings.

 

[gilream]

Phil…I got my hands on 500 once fired LC 5.56 NATO cases and sorted them according to neck consistency, then by weight. 97 cases out of 500 had moderately deformed case necks and required special attention before they could be measured and the Lee collet die was very handy in bringing the necks back to a round and smooth condition. (At first I ran these problem necks over an expander mandrel but the collet die worked just as well)

I began the resizing process using a FL .223 die with expander button which works... but I do not like working the brass so much so I polished down the mandrel on the Lee Collet Die using 320 grit sandpaper to give me .002 neck tension and I use a Redding body die to bump the shoulder. For what it’s worth the Redding body die bumps the shoulder to the correct dimension while working the body of the case less than the old Pacific FL die and the cases function perfectly in my ARs.

I use a Redding FL/Bushing die for another caliber (7 Rem. Mag) and they are terrific with neck turned brass. But I chose not to turn the necks for the 5.56 NATO chamber and I believe the collet die does a better job in this instance, plus it’s much less expensive and you don’t have to lube the case necks. I suggest that you size your necks first and then the body if you decide to go that route. In one of his excellent articles on case preparation, German Salizar demonstrated that performing the operations in this order yielded better concentricity. I’ve become a real fan of the AR. Just my 2 cents.

 

[GSPV]

In factory chambers, you would be wasting your time turning necks.

You are also talking about two entirely different realms of shooting. Bolt action vs slush-a-matic.

Spend your money on tuning up the rifles and good reloading components. Spend your time in load development. Save the neck turning, etc. for benchrest rifles with custom chambers, should you ever go that route.

If you do, a used PPC boltface LV with a 220 Beggs, 6 Beggs/6 PPC and 30 Major barrels will cover a bunch of different formats.

 

[FroggyOne2]

With an AR, your neck tension should be around .003

 

[Barlow]

I recommend a Forster full length sizing die. Bump the shoulder back .002-.003, have them hone the neck to give you .002-.003 neck tension, that will get rid of the expander ball, or it may just kiss the neck depending on how much material is removed. I have used the LCD and liked it, but I prefer the Forster setup. Forster mic seater is flawless. Barlow

 

[243winxb]

For both rifles, the Redding FL sizing Type S Bushing die will work. Its possible to use or not use the expander with the die. Remove the decapping pin & you have a "Body Die" Then if you want, you can also try the Lee Collet later.

 

[jlow]

One thing you have to know about not using the expander with a FL sizing die is that using the die that way will give you consistent external dimensions at the neck but unless you turn your neck to close tolerance, the internal dimensions will be off as much as the neck thickness are off i.e. it is all transferred internally. This is why an expander is needed if you size the neck with a FL sizing die.

Now if you size the brass with a Redding Type S busing die without the bushing, the neck will not size and you can come back and size it with the Lee Collet die. This IMHO is the best method.

Another thing is if anyone wants to hone the mandrel to give you greater neck tension, it’s generally a bad idea because unless you can hone it completely evenly, you are going to have uneven dimensions transferred to the brass when you use it with the Lee Collet die. Best to buy the smaller mandrels.

 

[BoydAllen]

I have done it both ways. When I reduced the diameter myself, I chucked the mandrel in a 3/8" electric drill and folded a piece of 320 grit wet or dry around it, applying pressure with thumb and fingers, stoppling to check after brief intervals. It did not take long. I do not claim that the result was of entirely uniform diameter along its length, but fail to understand how the result could be uneven in its symmetry around the axis of rotation. The results were exactly as I wanted. There are things that we can actually do ourselves, that work, and some that are better left to those with the proper equipment. My little experiment was a success, and the potential cost of failure was one that I could easily afford to risk. On the other hand, I know fellows that should never try anything of the sort. They would probably manage to get hurt or ruin the part. I think that the answer is to know your limitations.

 

[jlow]

LOL! Exactly! Been there and done exactly that.