Recommendation for great target/tactical scope

[finnaddict]

I purchased a Remington M-700 SPS Tactical HB 26" in .308 and I am looking for some advice on making an optics purchase. This rifle will be used for target and tactical purposes so a Mildot reticle is for sure. However, which scope and which mounts???

Max range 800 yds. Maybe more.
Paper and Steel targets.
I handload.
Must be reliable and repeatable.
Budget... no more than $400.

Thanks
Mark

 

[NateHaler]

Budget... no more than $400.

Mark, you're asking a question that's been asked/answered thousands of times, in probably every shooting forum there is, except maybe archery.

Do a Google search, or search the optics forum at snipershide.com. Then start reading. As to your subject line and your budget, um, are you serious? "Great" means the best. In which case, set your budget to $3k or more. What you want is the best bang for your $400, and maybe you'll fee great about that. 8)

Were I in your shoes now, I'd look at Sightron, Weaver, and possibly Vortex.

 

[finnaddict]

Geez. I apologize that I do not meet your standards. I have read, for weeks, and just about everywhere before I posted here. You shouldn't assume what I may have not done. What is "Great" for you may mean the "Best" but for me it means "Good enough for my purposes". If I had a budget at "3k" then I would have stated so, but for that money, I would have gotten a professionals advice. Surely not looking to shoot 3" 10 shoot groups at 1000 yds. More like 20"x40" for me and if I get a report back/visual, then I got what I wanted out of it. Thanks for your input. It was very welcoming.

 

[Toolbreaker]

I currently have a Vortex on my M700, and I'm pretty satisfied with it.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/928807/vortex-viper-rifle-scope-30mm-tube-65-20x-44mm-side-focus-mil-dot-reticle-matte

It's the smaller objective (44mm), but they do have one in a 50 mm also for a little bit more. I'm pretty happy with it...clear as a bell & click values are spot-on. It's right at your budget, too. I mounted it with a Warne steel pic. base & Burris Xtreme 30mm rings. The base fit & worked fine (I did bed it, though). The rings took quite a bit of lapping to make them right...if I did it again, I'd probably opt for different rings. I still may, later.

 

[Cigarcop]

I agree with Toolbreaker, those little Vortex scopes are pretty nice for the money and you can usually find them used in excellent condition for 325-350.
My son has shot midrange F Class with them and he shoots High Master, pretty nice glass in my opinion, they do have removable caps to get to the turrets.... I have a few of these on some hunting rifles as well. Just my 2cts!

 

[NateHaler]

Geez. I apologize that I do not meet your standards. I have read, for weeks, and just about everywhere before I posted here.

Easy now, you need to keep your feelings in check to make sure your heart rate is calm for those long shots. :

Now you need to spend your money and take a chance that you made the right decision. Analysis paralysis will get you nowhere; if you want somebody to tell you what to do, then you'll get as many different opinions as people you ask.

 

[queen_stick]

The SWFA SS scopes fit your requirements. Mine tracks perfectly, and has for years. I'd recommend the fixed 10 power with side focus. $399

http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-10x42M-Tactical-Riflescope-P53713.aspx

Also, the SS rings are nice for the money. If you order a 30mm scope from swfa, I'd recommend throwing a set of their rings into the order.

 

[finnaddict]

I currently have a Vortex on my M700, and I'm pretty satisfied with it.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/928807/vortex-viper-rifle-scope-30mm-tube-65-20x-44mm-side-focus-mil-dot-reticle-matte

It's the smaller objective (44mm), but they do have one in a 50 mm also for a little bit more. I'm pretty happy with it...clear as a bell & click values are spot-on. It's right at your budget, too. I mounted it with a Warne steel pic. base & Burris Xtreme 30mm rings. The base fit & worked fine (I did bed it, though). The rings took quite a bit of lapping to make them right...if I did it again, I'd probably opt for different rings. I still may, later.

Which rings and mount are you using for yours??

 

[Toolbreaker]

This mount...

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/992681/warne-1-piece-tactical-picatinny-style-scope-base-remington-700-short-action-matte

...and these rings...

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/148716/burris-30mm-xtreme-tactical-picatinny-style-rings-matte-low-package-of-2

I bought the mount used on this site, and ordered the rings through Midway. With this setup, I have about .080" (iirc) clearance above the barrel to the scope objective. This is on a factory varmint contour barrel.

Edit: Remember though, that this clearance will change depending on how you set up your scope fore/aft to the barrel's contour.

 

[finnaddict]

This mount...

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/992681/warne-1-piece-tactical-picatinny-style-scope-base-remington-700-short-action-matte

...and these rings...

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/148716/burris-30mm-xtreme-tactical-picatinny-style-rings-matte-low-package-of-2

I bought the mount used on this site, and ordered the rings through Midway. With this setup, I have about .080" (iirc) clearance above the barrel to the scope objective. This is on a factory varmint contour barrel.

Edit: Remember though, that this clearance will change depending on how you set up your scope fore/aft to the barrel's contour.

Which reticle are you using? MilDot or Dead-Hold BDC? Which would you suggest?

 

[Toolbreaker]

Which reticle are you using? MilDot or Dead-Hold BDC? Which would you suggest?

I'm using the mil-dot version, same as the link. As far as me suggesting one or the other, that's completely subjective, depending upon what your preference is & what you intend to do with it. I prefer the mil-dot because it gives me incremental hold-off points for both windage & elevation. A couple of my shooting buddies have BDC's (Nikons) and they love them for their less cluttered view with known impact points (to their rifles) at the reticle's witness marks. If you're going to be shooting at unknown distances (competition, prairie dogs, ect), I'd suggest some sort of mil-dot or it's derivative for ranging. If you're going to be shooting at known distances for the most part, or you're using a range-finder of some sort, then it's a toss-up....I'd say whichever one your eye prefers.

 

[brian427cobra]

Fixed Super Sniper 10x with MRAD knobs, MOA is for static fixed position shooting, MRAD(MilDots with matching .1MRAD knobs) tactical side of scopes, a super easy system designed for fast shooting at variable distances.

 

[Unclered]

SWFA & bear basin propably have the best prices for new scopes. Sometimes they have "special" deals too.

Consider a used Leupold. Lifetime guarantee, hard to beat. Keep your eyes pealed on greedbay. I have purchased 2 6.5 x 20 1/8 min, used for $400 ea. I have also bought a used springfield armory 4-14 x 50 w/ 308 retical for $330.00.(it is on my LR-308)

If you are going to shoot FAR then you will need some more MOA to the base or you will run out of adj r to l.

 

[Marfaprecision]

I too run the vortex viper 6.5-20x44 with the fine crosshair. Have it mounted on a savage precision carbine in .223 and use it mainly for coyote hunting. I used the EGW heavy duty pic rail and vortex (seekins) low precision matched rings. The rings needed no lapping and are made very well. It's a solid setup and I have nothing bad to say about the scope with over 2000 rounds and 4 years of what I would call pretty heavy use. Can't go wrong for the money.

Cody R.

 

[finnaddict]

I made a decision and purchased a Vortex Viper 6.5-20x44 mildot. It sits on a Leupold STD single base and med Leupold STD 30m/m rings which came with the rifle. Only issue I have is not enough elevation beyond 650 yds. With this base I am only getting 20 MOA out of the scope itself. But for now it works and the scope is great. Only thing I recommend could use some improvement is the turrets. On a scope like this, they should have target turrets instead of tall capped turrets. Next purchase is a Leupold STD LR Base for some extra MOA.

Thanks to everyone with their input. It was very helpful in making a decision.

 

[NateHaler]

I wouldn't use those rings or that style of base, regardless of whether it's available with a bit of forward cant. Use a Picatinny setup with Weaver style (instead of Redfield style) rings. An excellent economical choice would be Burris XTR rings and an EGW base.

 

[finnaddict]

Could you please explain why not to use leupold base and rings?

 

[NateHaler]

If I recall correctly, the Leupold 'STD' rings are their version of the original Redfield design. Meaning, the front base and its corresponding ring features a dovetail fastening system, with the base having the mortise and the ring the tenon. The ring tenon is set into the mortise, and then the ring is twisted into position (never using the scope to do this, which unfortunately happens all too often). The rear base features "ears" onto which the rear ring grabs, and is held in place with opposing windage screws.

Don't get me wrong; this design has served well enough for likely hundreds of thousands of hunting rifles, and I've used it myself with good success. But the rings go only into these provisions; you cannot move the rings forward and back like you can with a Picatinny (slotted) mounting rail.

And if you're inclined (no pun intended) to use a tapered scope base for long range, or to change scopes, or rings (say the scopes have different objective bells and need to sit higher or lower accordingly above the barrel) -- then a Picatinny (aka Weaver, sort of, style) base and compatible rings is way more convenient in my experience and you'll have way more options to choose from.

Removing a scope from a Picatinny base is simply a matter of loosening two crossbolts, and the scope/rings come off as a unit.

I doubt that I'm in the minority in preferring the Picatinny (slotted) type base and rings. If all you can easily find is the STD, then so be it. In fact, I think Leupold used to make a tapered base for this system, and I might even have one in my pile of stuff from 10+ years ago. But it's not my favorite setup. 8)

 

[finnaddict]

Ok cool. That is kind of what I expected you to say and I am fully aware of that. I also thought maybe the setup may be too weak or some other severe issue I didn't know about. Thanks for the advice on the more convenient setup. I will eventually go that route.

 

[NateHaler]

The STD (aka Redfield) style setup is plenty strong. And, if you're careful, you'll be able to properly align the front (turn-in) ring with the rear ring. I used a 1" dowel -- as the stand-in for a 1" scope -- to align my setup and to then twist the front ring into position. When I thought I had it close, I would very gently set my scope across the ring bottoms, to see whether it would settle in with no interference, or if the ring bottoms needed to be tweaked just a little bit more.

Another alternative might be the Burris Signature rings. I know they make them in a 'Zee' (Weaver) style, but perhaps they also make them in this Redfield config. If so, then the plastic inserts will help eliminate some alignment issues, and can help you gain elevation in your scope -- by using the inserts to tilt the scope up in the rear and down in the front.

Lastly, if your scope's reticle has intermediate aiming points (ala mildots, whatever), then you can use these well enough to gain all kinds of elevation even after the internal adjustment runs out. You just have to know/understand what the increments between the "holdover" points means at distance. I did this very thing, using the Leupold STD rings even, on a rifle I used at matches for years (and even won a few times, but don't tell anybody!). It's not as precise as dialing in the adjustment you want, but it can and will work for you if your reticle isn't just a duplex/dot/crosshair type, and you figure out the math.