Question for someone with quickload

[dantiff2]

I've looked all over the web for a posted load using CFE 223 in a 7.62x39 under a hornady 123 gr bullet with no luck. I've seen countless recipes using both faster and slower powders. Can someone please verify for me that 28 gr is a safe starting point? Thank you in advance.

Dan

 

[Sheldon N]

A rough run of the numbers suggests that yes, it is a safe starting point... perhaps too low if anything. With a light 123g bullet you are unlikely to be able to get enough powder in the case to cause problems. PMax seems up in the 35-36g range at which point it would be a very compressed load.

This is 7.62x39 (M43) Russian, Hornady .310 123g FMJ, COAL 2.190 and Hodgdon CFE223.

 

[jepp2]

Is this your cartridge? Hornady bullet not in my data, so I picked one that was close.

Cartridge          : 7.62 x 39 (.308) Russ.
Bullet             : .308, 125, Sierra SP 2120
Useable Case Capaci: 31.553 grain H2O = 2.049 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.190 inch = 55.63 mm
Barrel Length      : 24.0 inch = 609.6 mm
Powder             : Hodgdon CFE223

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 1.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step    Fill. Charge   Vel.  Energy   Pmax   Pmuz  Prop.Burnt B_Time
 %       %    Grains   fps   ft.lbs    psi    psi      %        ms

-10.0   78    25.20   1774     874   17392   2844     64.6    1.766
-09.0   79    25.48   1794     893   17847   2900     65.3    1.747
-08.0   79    25.76   1813     912   18316   2956     66.0    1.728
-07.0   80    26.04   1833     932   18800   3013     66.7    1.709
-06.0   81    26.32   1853     953   19298   3070     67.3    1.691
-05.0   82    26.60   1873     973   19810   3126     68.0    1.673
-04.0   83    26.88   1893     994   20339   3183     68.7    1.654
-03.0   84    27.16   1913    1016   20884   3241     69.4    1.636
-02.0   85    27.44   1933    1038   21444   3298     70.0    1.618
-01.0   86    27.72   1954    1060   22022   3355     70.7    1.601
+00.0   86    28.00   1975    1082   22618   3413     71.4    1.583
+01.0   87    28.28   1996    1106   23229   3470     72.1    1.566
+02.0   88    28.56   2017    1129   23866   3528     72.7    1.548
+03.0   89    28.84   2038    1153   24518   3585     73.4    1.531
+04.0   90    29.12   2059    1177   25193   3642     74.1    1.514
+05.0   91    29.40   2081    1202   25889   3699     74.8    1.498

Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba     86    28.00   2137    1267   26629   3842     81.5    1.471
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba     86    28.00   1805     905   19032   2881     60.1    1.715

 

[Davey Boy]

QL shows 22323 psi for 28.o grns CFE223 and Hornady VMAX #3142 .310 diam. bullet. That is approx 86% full. There are 2 other Hornady 123's .310 dia. as well. QL states max press for that calibre at 51488 psi. You should be OK to start at 28 and work up slowly.

Anyone else please pipe in if you don't agree.

Dave

 

[dantiff2]

Thank you, I appreciate ya'll taking the time to check into this for me

I'm wondering now if that load will even cycle in an AR upper.... It seems to be too mild in my opinion. I will try cautiously when the components come in but with the given velocities stated, I will most likely be disappointed.

Dan

 

[jepp2]

I'm wondering now if that load will even cycle in an AR upper

I never load that low of pressure. Even around 35K PSI case exteriors can be sooty. I don't know what pressure the outside of the case can collapse due to the external pressure, since the case isn't sealing against the chamber wall.

In AR, maybe if you have an adjustable gas block, you can choke it down to get it to cycle. But the % propellent burnt is really low. So expect it to be really dirty.

 

[Larryh128]

Thank you, I appreciate ya'll taking the time to check into this for me

I'm wondering now if that load will even cycle in an AR upper.... It seems to be too mild in my opinion. I will try cautiously when the components come in but with the given velocities stated, I will most likely be disappointed.

Dan

I've got a good AR load but for 110 gr bullets. I'm using either 110 vmax or Nosler did a limited run of 110 gr (.310) tipped bullets. I'll look up the powder & charge weight tonight but it's not CFE223.

 

[Zero333]

In no particular order, I would pick these over CFE-223.

Norma 200
Ramshot X-terminator
RL-7
RL-10
H-4198
H-4227
H-335
Accurate 5744
Accurate 1680
Accurate 2200
IMR-4198
IMR-4227
Vihtavouri N-120

 

[Larryh128]

You have a PM Dantiff.

 

[Webster]

I've looked all over the web for a posted load using CFE 223 in a 7.62x39 under a hornady 123 gr bullet with no luck. I've seen countless recipes using both faster and slower powders. Can someone please verify for me that 28 gr is a safe starting point? Thank you in advance.

Dan

Why not pick a powder with published data?

 

[dantiff2]

Why not pick a powder with published data?

Ultimately, I will. That's the fastest powder I have on hand and was really hoping to pull double duty with it. I was a bit confused while cross referencing the burn rates to see that the given data skipped over the cfe223 choice but now I understand why

 

[gunsmithatwork]

I've looked all over the web for a posted load using CFE 223 in a 7.62x39 under a hornady 123 gr bullet with no luck. I've seen countless recipes using both faster and slower powders. Can someone please verify for me that 28 gr is a safe starting point? Thank you in advance.

Dan

Dan, I started straight out with the CFE223 at 31gr with no pressure sign on the primers, other then a very light ejector mark and this is seated with an Hornady 123gr SST bullet; although not bad accuracy for this caliber around the 1” mark, it’s no way near as accurate as any of my 6.5 Grendel loads with a 120gr/130gr bullets and a compressed loads of 33gr & 32.5gr of CFE223, so I’m going to try increasing it by 0.5 gr increments and hopefully hit the accuracy node in the higher end, without increased pressure signs! If not, then I’ll have to go the opposite way, down from 31gr and see what happens!

 

[gunsmithatwork]

Dan, I’m already at 31gr with no pressure sign with an 123gr SST bullet, but not that accurate as my 6.5Grendel loads with a 120gr bullet and a compressed load of 33gr of CFE223, so I’m going to increase the loads by 0.5 gr increments and go from there!

On another note: I bought a bunch of commercial PPU ammo last year, but not great accuracy, so I pulled the projectiles from the factory boxed PPU loads (PSP 123gr l 8gr), which had powder weight variations of 25.8gr to 26.2! I recharged the cases with 26.1gr of the same factory powder, topped with a 123gr Hornady SST bullet @ 59.15mm/2.328”OAL and got pretty good 3 shot accuracy groups of between .350” to 0.650” out of my Howa Mini 1500!

 

[NZ_Fclass]

CFE224 is far too slow for the x39. Better to use Win 296/H110 or CFE Black.

 

[dantiff2]

Wow, it's been a while for this thread but I'll happily report that I have a great load for the little x39 with 308 diameter 125 tnts over 27 gn of Benchmark powder. Shoots sub 3/4 moa out of a palmetto upper ar. Fun little toy. It might be worth noting that this run of barrels had a .3095 bore and shoots wolf steel junk right at moa too