• This Forum is for adults 18 years of age or over. By continuing to use this Forum you are confirming that you are 18 or older. No content shall be viewed by any person under 18 in California.

Opening meplat on Berger 90 vld UPDATE

AndyA

Gold $$ Contributor
I have both a 22 Nosler and 224 Valkyrie uppers and want to use heavier bullets for hunting. Has anyone tried opening the hollow point on a 90 vld to make it expand more? Not so much concerned about BC as the shooting will be 300yds or less. I would like a more accurate option than the MSR offering from Federal.
 
Open-tipped match bullets are not designed like hollow-points. Merely opening up the meplat may not do exactly what you want. Check out the cross-sectional images of several Hornady .224 bullets below (at left, 70 gr GMX; center, 60 gr V-MAX; at right 80 gr ELD-M). The two hunting bullets are clearly designed with a longitudinal internal channel in order to promote expansion, whereas the match bullet is not. Merely opening the meplat of the ELD-M bullet is not going to ensure consistent expansion. Your best bet is to use a purpose-designed hunting bullet. Otherwise, the other choice is to use the 90s and accept the fact that they may not expand consistently.
 

Attachments

  • Bullets 2.jpg
    Bullets 2.jpg
    19.5 KB · Views: 94
Probably just a terminology glitch on my end ("Opening me'plat"): I'd recommend that you use a me'plat trimmer and "cut" the noses back, as opposed to expanding them. Please, let us know your results - that is, if you collect enough DATA to show a tendency/trend - it's an interesting concept.

After several hundred white-tail deer (cull harvest by pals), and thirty years of empirical personal results, making a lighter bullet, using the same jacket, thus increasing the frontal area of the core face, results in notably faster expansion. On up to deer sized game, neither I, nor, my cullers have experienced either a failure to open, or, a splash, in that time frame.:eek: RG
 
Andy, I had a buddy in Tennessee about ten years ago ask me for some 115 DTAC's. He shot deer on his property. He took those DTAC's trimmed the meplat down, put them in a .243 AI. and commenced to wreck some good size deer. He sent me pictures of the deer skinned down, a lot of destruction, several were shot standing by his target board, 750 yards.....
 
I have both a 22 Nosler and 224 Valkyrie uppers and want to use heavier bullets for hunting. Has anyone tried opening the hollow point on a 90 vld to make it expand more? Not so much concerned about BC as the shooting will be 300yds or less. I would like a more accurate option than the MSR offering from Federal.
This can be done but involves a little work
I have both a 22 Nosler and 224 Valkyrie uppers and want to use heavier bullets for hunting. Has anyone tried opening the hollow point on a 90 vld to make it expand more? Not so much concerned about BC as the shooting will be 300yds or less. I would like a more accurate option than the MSR offering from Federal.
This can be done but involves a little work. How I did this: I hunt ghogs and varmint bullets usually have large meplats and therefore low BCs. I wanted a high BC bullet that came apart after impact. Vmax and other tipped bullets had higher BCs, but I preferred non tipped ones. I would chuck a target bullet with a high BC in a B&D drill mounted upside down in a vise. Spin it slowly as you run a metal file back and forth over the tip until enough is gone to allow insertion of a drill (1/16" usually) and slowly remove jacket material as the bullet spins. Drills with a hexagonal shank could be hand held and appropriate pressure applied. A good bit of material is removed. File the tip to remove burrs, then spin while holding 4-0 steel wool on tip to polish it as well as thinning a bit more. Range testing confirmed high BC retained and terminal ballistics was perfect...common not to have an exit wound. On large game you do not want bullet opening too soon, so a 1/16" meplat might be ideal. Some work but I kill less than 90 ghogs a year, so i made these during winter.2015-05-08 20.18.30.jpg
 
I’ve shot quite a few pronghorn and a couple deer with Berger and Sierra match bullets and not had any issues. All but one at reasonable distances.

The one long shot was a pronghorn at 530 yards. 80gr SMK worked perfect. Exited about the size of a baseball. Animal went about 10 yards.
 
Looks like trimming the meplat back to increase frontal area might be the direction to go. What got me thinking was reading about turned solid copper bullets and the experiences with different diameter openings in the front of the bullet to drive expansion. Nobody makes a .224 caliber heavy bullet for hunting. They all seem to stop at 65 gr. and I would like to try a little more. I know that there are other calibers but I want to use a .224 dia.
 
Looks like trimming the meplat back to increase frontal area might be the direction to go. What got me thinking was reading about turned solid copper bullets and the experiences with different diameter openings in the front of the bullet to drive expansion. Nobody makes a .224 caliber heavy bullet for hunting. They all seem to stop at 65 gr. and I would like to try a little more. I know that there are other calibers but I want to use a .224 dia.

Swift makes a 75 Scirroco and I think Barnes does a 70 grain X bullet.

Might have a couple options there.
 
Any non tipped bullet can be opened as i described. I used a 6x284 shooting Berger 105 VLDs for long range ghogs but got pass thru and they made it to their den. Grinding the tip of these bullets took some time but after drilling and spinning in 4-0 steel wool, their tips were thin and terminal ballistics were explosive, to say the least.
 
Any non tipped bullet can be opened as i described. I used a 6x284 shooting Berger 105 VLDs for long range ghogs but got pass thru and they made it to their den. Grinding the tip of these bullets took some time but after drilling and spinning in 4-0 steel wool, their tips were thin and terminal ballistics were explosive, to say the least.

There's a big difference between merely "opening up the meplat" and actually drilling into the lead core of a bullet to turn it into a hollowpoint. You clearly put a significant effort into the process, and own the equipment to carry it out successfully. The results you posted above are quite beautiful. Nonetheless, I rather suspect most people would find it far easier to simply buy an appropriate hollowpoint hunting bullet.
 
You can get a cheap set of small drill tips from Amazon. Chuck them in a drill and open the tips up, no need to trim. I've done it with 185 hybrids, it works.
 
Heavy for caliber A-max work great on deer.

I second the idea of using the new 88 gr A-max !

As a side note... I really like the terminal performance of the FUSION hunting bullets in the Federal Fusion Ammo. They shoot small groups too.
 
Heavy for caliber A-max work great on deer.

I second the idea of using the new 88 gr A-max !

As a side note... I really like the terminal performance of the FUSION hunting bullets in the Federal Fusion Ammo. They shoot small groups too.


I looked on Hornady's website and could only find ELD-M in 22 cal 88gr weights. Are these the ones you are using?
Where do you buy Federal FUSION bullets?
 
There's a big difference between merely "opening up the meplat" and actually drilling into the lead core of a bullet to turn it into a hollowpoint. You clearly put a significant effort into the process, and own the equipment to carry it out successfully. The results you posted above are quite beautiful. Nonetheless, I rather suspect most people would find it far easier to simply buy an appropriate hollowpoint hunting bullet.
Drilling the lead core is not necessary to get a bullet to come apart, as in a hollowpoint. Drill the lead core off center just a tiny bit will cause that bullet to fly erratically. Thinning the bullet's tip seems more likely to cause the bullet to come apart as opposed to size of meplat. Closed meplats have a lot of jacket material in the bullet's tip and when this is drilled out, the tip is very thin and collapses immediately after penetration. My main hunting is varmints, so the quicker the bullet opens the more likely all it's energy will be expended inside the varmint. Large game needs some degree of penetration before opening. I believe this was why John Nosler developed his bullets.20180719_175740.jpg
 
I looked on Hornady's website and could only find ELD-M in 22 cal 88gr weights. Are these the ones you are using?
Where do you buy Federal FUSION bullets?

Sorry mate, my mistake. I meant to say ELD-M (which is the same as the A-max, but with a "better" polymer tip )

The Fusion heads are only on the loaded ammo line of Federal Fusion and Fusion MSR. I think Speer used to make (or still does) those Fusion bullets under a different name, but Speer doesn't make them in .224"
 
How about just using the 88g Amax. Amax has always been known to be a good hunting bullet.


^^^^^^This, myself, my brother, his buddy have all shot deer successfully with the Amax.... everyone we have shot either hit the ground where they stood or traveled under 50 yards. Multiple calibers, no .224 stuff but I would not hesitate to use the 88 grainer.
 
so I had a little time today to work on this
lathe1 small.jpg
faced it off to length

lathe1 small.jpg lathe2 small.jpg

Then it was drilled out to .059

compare small.jpg

Did a few for testing

progress small.jpg
 

Upgrades & Donations

This Forum's expenses are primarily paid by member contributions. You can upgrade your Forum membership in seconds. Gold and Silver members get unlimited FREE classifieds for one year. Gold members can upload custom avatars.


Click Upgrade Membership Button ABOVE to get Gold or Silver Status.

You can also donate any amount, large or small, with the button below. Include your Forum Name in the PayPal Notes field.


To DONATE by CHECK, or make a recurring donation, CLICK HERE to learn how.

Forum statistics

Threads
166,239
Messages
2,214,230
Members
79,464
Latest member
Big Fred
Back
Top