NEWBIE AND 17 HORNET

[oneshot 66]

Greetings,
I am a new old timer. Have reloaded since the 70's, but am having trouble with consistent accuracy with the 17 hornet. I have worked with 4 powders, 4 projectiles, 3 primers and only 1 case(hornady).
I have many .5 inch to .225 inch groups at 100 yds., but can't get consistent groups that small.
I weighed 10 random cases and found that 5 were around 60 grains and the other 5 were around 55 grains. Big difference! Thinking this may affect the case capacity, I used A1680 to fill one of the 55 grain cases. I tapped it to be sure it was full and poured in the 4 light cases using a funnel. They all held the same amount, but the 60 grain cases held about .66 grain less. Could this be part of my inconsistency? I have not turned the necks on any of my 17 hornet. I have trimmed, full sized, neck sized, bumped and done everything I can think of.
Scott

 

[dstoenner]

Welcome to the forum.

My 17 Hornet is a CZ-527. I had a lot of trouble also. I found another wrinkle is the first round stripped from a full mag doesn't go in the group so I started doing single load. I have found 1680 and CFE-BLK are the only 2 powders that work in my gun. Berger 25 HPFB is the best bullet for accuracy. I also tried loading the bullets out towards the lands and it didn't work. Measured the factory ammo that was doing so well and it is jumping a mile. So I started loading mine that short and bingo now I have good groups. Like you I have been loading for about 15 years and this is the hardest cartridge to get to work I have ever found. I actually picked up a 221FB take off barrel because I was going to change it if I couldn't get the 17 hornet to work. It is such a cute round.

HTH

David

 

[TheOtherZilla]

I love my 17 Hornet. CZ also here.. I tried many powders and bullets. I finally tried A2200, and got the best group of all with one of my test loads.. I had tried Lil Gun and a few others. I also am using 25 grain bullets. 20's aren't as accurate in my testing and my gun.. Bullets I am using now are from Mid South, Varmint Nightmare Extreme's In Bulk.. Cases are Hornaday

 

[oneshot 66]

I love my 17 Hornet. CZ also here.. I tried many powders and bullets. I finally tried A2200, and got the best group of all with one of my test loads.. I had tried Lil Gun and a few others. I also am using 25 grain bullets. 20's aren't as accurate in my testing and my gun.. Bullets I am using now are from Mid South, Varmint Nightmare Extreme's In Bulk.. Cases are Hornaday

 

[oneshot 66]

Thanks for the replys. I haven't tried A2200 and will try 25 grain again.

 

[Bojo]

Kind of same here but I shoot 22 hornet.
Casee size makes it extremely sensitive.
I shoot h110 out of mine. With standard cci 400 primers. Slight variations in powder charge and or case capacity do create larger groups very quickly.
I am running a model 43 winchester that belonged to my uncle.

 

[JSH]

Pure accuracy I am with H4198. It is a compressed load.
I started with this powder, but ran around and tried others. I keep going back to 4198 and feel for my purpose it is as good as it's going to get.

I am running several different 20 grain bullets,no customs. If I get MOA at 100 I am happy.

 

[oneshot 66]

Pure accuracy I am with H4198. It is a compressed load.
I started with this powder, but ran around and tried others. I keep going back to 4198 and feel for my purpose it is as good as it's going to get.

I am running several different 20 grain bullets,no customs. If I get MOA at 100 I am happy.

My best groups have been with H4198. I have used A1680, lil gun and cfe black. The problem when weighing loads to .00 the powder is hard to control ( 1 cylinder is .01 ).

 

[oneshot 66]

Thanks for the replys. I haven't tried A2200 and will try 25 grain again.

I ordered 100 rds. of new brass (hornady). I will weigh each, sort and check the volume of each before I load. Maybe that will improve consistency.

 

[Bojo]

I had 150 pieces of new hornady 243 win brass 2 bags of 50 were same lot. Highest to lowest reading was over 10 grains difference. That was the last hornady brass I bought.

 

[JSH]

My best groups have been with H4198. I have used A1680, lil gun and cfe black. The problem when weighing loads to .00 the powder is hard to control ( 1 cylinder is .01 ).

I had a digital scale,even used a lab scale for a while. I never found a difference I could say was from the kernal to make a difference in groups. I went back to my beam scale.
I use a B&M to measure 4198. I still weigh, but that old measure sure throws well enough that I have not found it to be of any gain for the few kernels I may drop in the pan to make a difference in accuracy or speed with my rigs.
Measuring ball powder with my BR measure I find it a waste of time to measure and weigh all of them. I weigh every third or fourth.
Jeff

 

[B23]

I see you mentioned you've necked sized, what bushing were you using and how much neck tension did you have? I have two CZ 527 varmint 17 Hornets and its been my experience these little bullets don't really like a whole lot of neck tension. Also, I dip the necks in Imperial dry graphite before a fill them with powder and seat a bullet.

 

[ridgeway]

Consistent 2's at 100 yards with a 17?

 

[oneshot 66]

Consistent 2's at 100 yards with a 17?

Ridgeway,
I didn't say I wanted consistent .2 groups with the 17. I just want consistent groups.

 

[oneshot 66]

B23,
I have been using a RCBS neck sizer I haven't used graphite, but will try. It's hard to find a calm day so I can test, but I will post when I do.

 

[oneshot 66]

I had a digital scale,even used a lab scale for a while. I never found a difference I could say was from the kernal to make a difference in groups. I went back to my beam scale.
I use a B&M to measure 4198. I still weigh, but that old measure sure throws well enough that I have not found it to be of any gain for the few kernels I may drop in the pan to make a difference in accuracy or speed with my rigs.
Measuring ball powder with my BR measure I find it a waste of time to measure and weigh all of them. I weigh every third or fourth.
Jeff

JSH,
What kind of groups are you shooting at 100? How much powder? What projectile?
Scott

 

[B23]

B23,
I have been using a RCBS neck sizer I haven't used graphite, but will try. It's hard to find a calm day so I can test, but I will post when I do.

My apologizes but I'm not that familiar with RCBS dies, is this a bushing die or just some type of die from RCBS that only sizes the neck but to whatever specific fix diameter spec the die was made to from the factory?

 

[JSH]

Scott, brass is Hornady, 20 grain bullets Hornady and Nosler. H4198 is a half grain under listed max as per Hodgdon data. I have no idea how they got another half grain in the case. I used a 12" drop tube and still couldn't get any more in there.
Perusing through my Ackley book, funny he as much said for the 17 Hornet to just scope up a case full of 4198 and stuff a bullet on top, gave his best accuracy.
I will say my CZ527 will do 1" easily at 100 everyday, wind or not. That is for a 10 shot group, five will usually stay well under that around a 1/2".
The CZ is a good rig and lots of folks swear by them. I will say most of the spreads vertical. The light recoil I find subject to how much pressure you put on the butt. Much like I found in rimfire,a little to much shoulder pressure and you will see it high, not enough and it is low.
I am now fooling with a 17 Fireball savage action. Have the rig weighed down and I would guess it is over 20 pounds. I am seeing excellent groups with fireforming loads and am looking forward to even better as cases get cleaned up. 20 grain bullets here as well, a dose of 8208 is the fuel.

I am running the 20's as I want splat factor. I have a 17 Remington coming to run heavier bullets, 25 and over.

 

[oneshot 66]

My apologizes but I'm not that familiar with RCBS dies, is this a bushing die or just some type of die from RCBS that only sizes the neck but to whatever specific fix diameter spec the die was made to from the factory?

It's not a bushing die, just a neck sizer. Doesn't touch the case sides.

 

[oneshot 66]

Scott, brass is Hornady, 20 grain bullets Hornady and Nosler. H4198 is a half grain under listed max as per Hodgdon data. I have no idea how they got another half grain in the case. I used a 12" drop tube and still couldn't get any more in there.
Perusing through my Ackley book, funny he as much said for the 17 Hornet to just scope up a case full of 4198 and stuff a bullet on top, gave his best accuracy.
I will say my CZ527 will do 1" easily at 100 everyday, wind or not. That is for a 10 shot group, five will usually stay well under that around a 1/2".
The CZ is a good rig and lots of folks swear by them. I will say most of the spreads vertical. The light recoil I find subject to how much pressure you put on the butt. Much like I found in rimfire,a little to much shoulder pressure and you will see it high, not enough and it is low.
I am now fooling with a 17 Fireball savage action. Have the rig weighed down and I would guess it is over 20 pounds. I am seeing excellent groups with fireforming loads and am looking forward to even better as cases get cleaned up. 20 grain bullets here as well, a dose of 8208 is the fuel.


I am running the 20's as I want splat factor. I have a 17 Remington coming to run heavier bullets, 25 and over.

JSH
I failed to say I use a CZ. I appreciate the input and will try your method. I will still weigh and volume all my brass.
Thanks,
Scott