Looking at replacing my 223 rifle with a new Savage 12 LPV with a 26 inch barrel and I can choose between 1:7 or 1:9 twist rates. Locally my range is limited to 300 yds. but I may want to go out to 600+ at other places in the future. Which rate should I go with? I'm thinking the 1:7 to be able to shoot the heavier/longer VLD bullets but are those a good choice for 300 and less yardage??
New rifle in .223,... do I want 1:7 twist or 1:9 twist?
- Thread starter Lefty Trigger
- Start date
ballisticdaddy
Silver $$ Contributor
For the heavy offerings a 1:7 twist is the way to go!
Lone Hunter
Silver $$ Contributor
If your looking at the heavies I'd do what the above posters said. 1-7. 1-7 will shoot 55 gr bullets pretty good also.
I was kinda hoping someone would tell me that. I have a lot of 55gr Vmax's left over.
+1 on the 55gr. And spinning that fast, they are even more spectacular on impact!
This is true. Spectacular!!
I'll be, the "odd man out" on this subject ! The 1-9 Twist shoots, ALL the 50's, 65 GK, 69 TMK's/ SMK's up to, the 70 and 73 grain Berger VLD's and a couple of, the Hornady 75's, to boot ! Easily, some "good" bullets, to 600 Yards ! The 1-9 is not as hard on barrel's as the heavier 80's, in the 1-7 ! You best do some reading on the subject. If you need more than a 70-75 grain .224 bullet to kill something, go to a 6mmX47 , 6XC, 6SLR or, .243 win and shoot the 95-107's ! The "in" thing right now is,.. fast twist, heavy bullets and,.. crappy barrel life ! Follow the crowd, IF you can afford, the Barrels !
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17VLD
Gold $$ Contributor
I have a PSS 700 Rem and really like the 9 twist.I really think for targets at 300 yards you will be well served with a 9 twist,lots of nice target bullets in the 68-69-75 weight range available.Of course going all the way to a 7 offers the potential to use all the new 80s and 90s,but if only shooting out at 300 and occasionally 600 yards,I would pick the 9 twist and of course it will work well with all the 55s that you have left also.
Matt
Matt
You are not the only "odd man out".....if arbitrarily using extremely fast 1-in-7 twist across the board to shoot everything was god's gift to the shooting world then that is the only twist barrel anyone would bother to make. It's the old American way...if big, fast and heavy are good then surely more, bigger, faster has to be better.
Accuracy wise, the slowest twist that will positively stabilize the bullet you are using is always the most accurate. I get that a lot of shooters claim lightweight bullets "shoot great" in a 1-in-7, maybe for them it does, but you might not have those same spectacular results. The last person that bragged that to me claimed "one ragged hole", but in fact he shot not one group under one inch that day...I shot several 1/4" groups with 52 grain bullets and a 1-in-14 twist.
I own, and have good results with a 1-in-9. It seems to be ideal for 64 and 69 grain bullets, but over a wide range of bullets it is still a compromise.
As to bullets twisted faster having more impact energy...I don't know, I have never seen it. I was always taught that impact energy had to do with speed and bullet weight, not how fast it was spun.
The bottom line is that if a barrel maker produced and sold 1-in-5 twist barrels he would sell them out overnight and the guys that bought them would get on here and tell everyone that will listen how much better, more accurate and don't forget, how much more violent and devastating the bullet would "explode" on impact....I bet a Ben Franklin that you will still have to try it for yourself.
Ned Ludd
Silver $$ Contributor
The fact is that you don't see nearly the number of slow twist barrels on factory .223 rifles now that you did even 5-10 years ago, 7- and 8- twist having gained significant popularity. That tells you that the manufacturers have payed attention to what customers want, largely the result of unsatisfactorily trying to shoot commonly available 70+ gr bullets/loads in 9-twist (or slower) barrels with mediocre results. The OP has only two choices in twist rate, 1 in 7 or 1 in 9. If you only have the two choices, it is always far better to overspin a bullet than underspin it. I am also on the list of having shot everything from 90 gr down to 40 gr out of 7-twist barrels with excellent results. When lighter bullets don't perform well from a 7-twist barrel, it is not always solely the fault of the barrel twist rate. Too many example exist where lighter can be made to shoot quite well out of faster twist barrels to make any valid blanket statements about poor performance associated with overspinning bullets.
Jimmy James
Silver $$ Contributor
If all you can get is a 7 twist for heavy bullets then that's what I'd do. I had a 223 built for 82gr Bergers and my smith insisted on 7.5 twist Brux. Nothing but X ring at 300yds.
SteveOak
Gold $$ Contributor
I'm with you. There are reasons to go with a faster twist but there are a lot more reasons to go with the right twist for your application.
The 'fast twist rampage' is like what I see in my day job. A proposal goes across someone's desk and they don't really understand the requirements or the science behind it so they just increase the spec 'to be safe'. It makes the project harder and the product more expensive and difficult to design and manufacture and it is done out of ignorance.
If you NEED to shoot bullets much heavier than 68 - 69gr, you need a faster than 9 twist. You probably also NEED a bigger cartridge or at least a larger caliber bullet.
I have a 9 twist barrel on my AR and shoot 68gr Hornady BTHPs to 300 meters. If I really wanted to go further than that I would have a 6X47 and shoot 90 to 95gr or so 6mm bullets.
There are applications where a 7 twist 223/5.56 make sense. Some shooting disciplines restrict the cartridge to 223/5.56 but a heavy bullet is desirable for longer distances. Then a 7 twist is a good choice.
One of the problems you run into is the faster twist will get you to pressure limits faster than you would with the same bullet in a barrel with a slower twist. Physics sucks some times.
Heavier bullets either stick out farther from the case causing OAL/magazine problems or the bullet being seated deeper into the case causes powder limitations or both.
A 7 twist will limit your choices with lighter bullets too. Either they won't shoot or you can't reach the lands to get good accuracy.
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I've never had the need for anything faster than a 9 twist in a 223 Remington because it's mainly a mid-range varmint/target cartridge IMO. As has been stated the heavier bullets are best left to the cartridges with a little more umphh behind them. A 9 twist will stabilize the great variety of .224" diameter 69 grain bullets out there which will work great for the ranges that you mentioned.
Another advantage of a slightly slower twist is a little extra velocity which compliments the fact that the 223 Remington is most at home shooting light, fast bullets.....For civilian use a 9 or 12 twist is the way to go.
Another advantage of a slightly slower twist is a little extra velocity which compliments the fact that the 223 Remington is most at home shooting light, fast bullets.....For civilian use a 9 or 12 twist is the way to go.
@ Lefty Trigger,.. Just below this bunch of posts, in the Similar Treads column is-rifle twist,.. running a 1:9 twist for .223,..Written in 2017. Read it and RE-READ all, the pro's and cons that, we all wrote AND,.. pick YOUR "choice",.. Good luck !
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