New lot of H4350

[DLT]

I have a savage, all factory rifle in 6 creedmooor that I did a course load development on. It has shot numerous small groups (to me) at 200yds and recreational hits on steel at 800 yds. The rifle has 140 rounds down the pipe. I have 9 rounds left that I have never chrono’d. I have access to 3 more single pounders all are different lots though and the one group I shot was horrendous a big triangle. Do I need to check the speed on the remaining known load and adjust the new lot to that velocity and see what happens or will I have to go up/down in the charge and HOPE it comes back. Never had a rifle that shot like this one does to notice much difference between different powder lots Thanks in advance

 

[SKWERLZ]

I’d absolutely check it, burned a lot of H4350 and lots can vary a good bit and humidity changes from manufacture to your your current powder at home can make a difference as well.

 

[DGP4]

Good idea to test and adjust the new lots. Save yourself having to do it more than once and mix the three new lots together now.

 

[DLT]

Good idea to test and adjust the new lots. Save yourself having to do it more than once and mix the three new lots together now.

If I go that route, Will it be fine to mix even if there is a couple years difference in the lots ? Will my load come back or even close

 

[DGP4]

As long as the powder is in good condition, there is no problem mixing different lots even if they are a few years apart. As to whether the accuracy can come back, I would think so if you can repeat the velocity of the original loads. But with reloading, you never know!

 

[DLT]

As long as the powder is in good condition, there is no problem mixing different lots even if they are a few years apart. As to whether the accuracy can come back, I would think so if you can repeat the velocity of the original loads. But with reloading, you never know!

It’s all in good shape it’s been stored in a controlled enviro, I have no idea what speed I’m running but can find out, I do know it’s 17.25 minutes to 780 yards pretty consistently

 

[TSFineGuns]

Good idea to test and adjust the new lots. Save yourself having to do it more than once and mix the three new lots together now.

That had never crossed my mind before! Thanks for that advice! I have a few lots of IMR7828SCC and the current lot I'm using is excellent in my .280AI w/ 162GR ELD-X. Was dreading getting into the next lot of powder....

 

[Ned Ludd]

I mix different Lot#s of powder all the time. It works just fine. The key is to be sure the powders are really mixed well. I use a 5 gallon white paint bucket I bought at Lowes with a snap-on lid that has a rubber O-ring. I layer the powder into the bucket, one pound at a time from each successive Lot # that is going into the mix. So the "mixing" process actually starts as the powder is added into the bucket. Once all the powder has been added, I tape the lid down securely (i.e. packing tape going all the way around the bucket). Then I shake the bucket back and forth (left and right) about ten times, then roll it about ten times. I repeat this process multiple times during a day, usually whenever I walk by the bucket sitting on the floor. At the end of the day, I call the "mixing" process good, and distribute the powder mix into empty 8 lb jugs.

I would suggest recording the velocity for the current load as a starting point for load development with a new Lot# of powder (or mix). In my hands, reproducing the original velocity will usually get me close. Nonetheless, this approach by itself does not allow one to know where they are in relation to an optimal window. In other words, you may end up inside the optimal window simply by reproducing the original velocity, but you really don't know where the load is within the window. Is it right next to one edge, just waiting to go out of tune when the conditions change? Or is it smack in the middle where you'd like it to be? Without further testing, there is no way to know. Likewise, re-doing a seating depth test is not that big of a deal. It is unlikely that one would have to cover the same wide seating depth test range they may have covered when the rifle was brand new, as the seating depth optimum shouldn't change a great deal with a new Lot# of powder and a load adjusted to similar velocity using it. But it might change a bit, so testing two or three .003" increments to either side of the old seating depth is really not that painful and then you know with certainty. So when you have an established load, re-producing the original velocity may be a large part of re-producing that load with a new Lot# of powder, but a modest amount of further testing will really allow you to optimize it without a lot of guessing.

 

[DLT]

Current load just got speed checked. 2974fps avg.
New lot number ran 3032fps avg. near 60fps faster. Guess than means I need to drop down in charge for sure.

 

[D-4297]

Just a Wild Ass Guess , but a six tenths drop should get you close , or just under your old velocity that works . I shoot a lot of 4350 in a Mosin , and pretty familiar with it . Just not that fast .

 

[Eagle Six]

I mix different Lot#s of powder all the time. It works just fine. The key is to be sure the powders are really mixed well. I use a 5 gallon white paint bucket I bought at Lowes with a snap-on lid that has a rubber O-ring. I layer the powder into the bucket, one pound at a time from each successive Lot # that is going into the mix. So the "mixing" process actually starts as the powder is added into the bucket. Once all the powder has been added, I tape the lid down securely (i.e. packing tape going all the way around the bucket). Then I shake the bucket back and forth (left and right) about ten times, then roll it about ten times. I repeat this process multiple times during a day, usually whenever I walk by the bucket sitting on the floor. At the end of the day, I call the "mixing" process good, and distribute the powder mix into empty 8 lb jugs.

I would suggest recording the velocity for the current load as a starting point for load development with a new Lot# of powder (or mix). In my hands, reproducing the original velocity will usually get me close. Nonetheless, this approach by itself does not allow one to know where they are in relation to an optimal window. In other words, you may end up inside the optimal window simpl;y by reproducing the original velocity, but you really don't know where the load is within the window. Is it right next to one edge, just waiting to go out of tune when the conditions change? Or is it smack in the middle where you'd like it to be? Without further testing, there is no way to know. Likewise, re-doing a seating depth test is not that big of a deal. It is unlikely that one would have to cover the same wide seating depth test range they may have covered when the rifle was brand new, as the seating depth optimum shouldn't change a great deal with a new Lot# of powder and a load adjusted to similar velocity using it. But it might change a bit, so testing two or three .003" increments to either side of the old seating depth is really not that painful and then you know with certainty. So when you have an established load, re-producing the original velocity may be a large part of re-producing that load with a new Lot# of powder, but a modest amount of further testing will really allow you to optimize it without a lot of guessing.

These are golden words in two precise paragraphs.

 

[spudgun]

This is the first time I have read so many different shooter in favor of mixing batches of powder. About 2 years ago I brought this up when I mixed a old batch of 8lb, H4350 with a new 8lb and caught all kinds of negative posts.

The important thing is making sure it is mixed good. Also crono your load after mixing, and adjust the load to get the FPS your looking for.

Now I got 2 new jugs to mix since I used up the 16 lb's.

I was kinda worried about using a plastic container due to static build up, But it didn't go boom during the mixing.

 

[DLT]

I got the H4350 mixed both what I had at the house and a couple pounds worth from the lgs. I adjusted the charge to get back where I was fps wise 2975. A little above it and below it with no signs of grouping what so ever. The hammer I had seems to be gone. I also had to open a new box of 105 match at the same time and the ogive is .005 longer I have played with my seating still no luck. The rifle has 75 rounds on it since last cleaning and I know is coppered up, the barrel looks like a zipper through the borescope so it don’t take but a few shots to get copper throughout the bore. Hopefully once I strip it maybe then it will come back.

 

[SeabeeKen]

This is the first time I have read so many different shooter in favor of mixing batches of powder. About 2 years ago I brought this up when I mixed a old batch of 8lb, H4350 with a new 8lb and caught all kinds of negative posts.

I also recall folks losing their minds when people talked about mixing lots in past years. Been doing it for 50 yrs with no issues.

 

[spudgun]

I got the H4350 mixed both what I had at the house and a couple pounds worth from the lgs. I adjusted the charge to get back where I was fps wise 2975. A little above it and below it with no signs of grouping what so ever. The hammer I had seems to be gone. I also had to open a new box of 105 match at the same time and the ogive is .005 longer I have played with my seating still no luck. The rifle has 75 rounds on it since last cleaning and I know is coppered up, the barrel looks like a zipper through the borescope so it don’t take but a few shots to get copper throughout the bore. Hopefully once I strip it maybe then it will come back.

You may wish to try a barrel node testing to see if the FPS is what your barrel likes now.

I just cleaned my 6.5 Cm Brux barrel after 300 rounds down it. Cleaned out the copper and carbon. Went to the range and it took about 18 rounds before I could hit a 12x12" steel plate at 600 yds.

The more I shot the better the groups got.

 

[DLT]

You may wish to try a barrel node testing to see if the FPS is what your barrel likes now.

I just cleaned my 6.5 Cm Brux barrel after 300 rounds down it. Cleaned out the copper and carbon. Went to the range and it took about 18 rounds before I could hit a 12x12" steel plate at 600 yds.

The more I shot the better the groups got.

That’s my experience too. Especially with a factory rifle. If I completely strip them it takes a lot more to come back in versus a custom barrel.

 

[spudgun]

That’s my experience too. Especially with a factory rifle. If I completely strip them it takes a lot more to come back in versus a custom barrel.

My factory savage needed more rounds to get the groups back.

 

[bks22345]

hammer I had seems to be gone. I also had to open a new box of 105 match

What bullet?

 

[209jones]

I've mixed pounds acquired at different times and different lots many times, always seemed to be the only logical way to do things when you can't afford big jugs. Generally won't do it with less than 3 lbs, prefer 5lbs if I can wait that long. Depends on what you are doing with it, as to how much adjustment it may take, usually is +/- .5 gr though.

 

[DLT]

What bullet?

New 105 match. The ogive is longer and they look pointed like the new sierra 107