new die advice for f class starter

[burn]

Hi all I will soon be reloading for 2 6br norma rifles for f class and varmints. I need to buy dies but I am confused over what I need. One rifle is a 2nd hand rifle that has been rebarreled and the other will be brand new built on a bernard action.
I recieved a standard set of redding dies ( fl nk seater) with the 2nd hand rifle.
I ordered a redding s bushing nk die for the old rifle and for the new one im considering getting a whidden seater/ fl set.
Should I get the whidden fl bushing die and fl size every shot or the fl non bushing die for when I need to fl size?
I was going to get a 2nd bushing die so that I didnt have to change bushings for each rifle.

Whatever I do I think I need a good seater, a good fl die and for ease of set up 2 bushing dies if the necks are different. Im just not sure about bumping the necks back.
If I got a redding competition bushing die seater set with the fl body would that cover what I need?

 

[savageshooter86]

The Whidden FL Bushing die will resize the brass and bump the shoulder back and you chose a bushing size to your needs based on how much neck tension you want. If you are not turning the necks then the Whidden FL Non Bushing set is what you want. I would get the Whidden set personally. You get quality and if you have any issues they will take care of it. His seater die is the best I have used.

Do some searching on here. Seems most believe neck sizing is the best, but most believe FL sizing and bumping shoulder back 001-003 is better for life of the brass and accuracy. It is personal preference unless you have both set ups and can test this yourself

 

[Lapua40X]

The Whidden FL Bushing die will resize the brass and bump the shoulder back and you chose a bushing size to your needs based on how much neck tension you want....

IMO, that pretty much says it all. Can't come up with what I'd consider better options. I use a Wilson seater but your expressed preference is equally fine IMO. Wilson offers both a secant and a tangent radius seater stem that I like for the heavier 6BR bullets.

 

[burn]

The Whidden FL Bushing die will resize the brass and bump the shoulder back and you chose a bushing size to your needs based on how much neck tension you want. If you are not turning the necks then the Whidden FL Non Bushing set is what you want. I would get the Whidden set personally. You get quality and if you have any issues they will take care of it. His seater die is the best I have used.

Do some searching on here. Seems most believe neck sizing is the best, but most believe FL sizing and bumping shoulder back 001-003 is better for life of the brass and accuracy. It is personal preference unless you have both set ups and can test this yourself

The chamber for my new rifle is a no turn neck chamber, why do I not get bushings for that chamber? Are the whidden fl non bushing dies made for no turn chambers?

 

[savageshooter86]

Have you read the articles on neck tension?

His non bushing AND bushing dies will work for you. Bushings used on turned brass give more consistent results vs non turned brass necks. Bushings also allow you to try different neck tension by getting several bushings. Again this is better if using turned brass. You can use bushing dies even if your changer is no turn

Other option is to get a custom FL die with the neck opened to whatever neck size you want. But then that is sort of limiting that die to an extent to that type of brass. Then again he can make different size expander ball to get the tension you want.

Whidden dies are made to resize brass close to the specs of PTG reamers. As the vast majority are Dave's reamers. So if you have standard spec chamber, then the dies will size properly

Give Whidden a call in about 1 week(he will be returning from Perry and I'm sure catching up on a few things) and he will tell you what you need

 

[Glenn Powell]

I have been using the Widden FL dies for just a short time, and I like them. The only issue I have with them is the expander ball is too low. I prefer to have the expander to do its job as soon as the neck is leaving the case. It makes for a smoother more consistent operation. I deprime in a separate step to combat this. As to seating die, I am sold on the Wilson seating die. Hands down the best I have used. They take a learning curve to get the get of em, they are not as fast, but my runout has nearly disappeared.

 

[burn]

Ive read some articles on neck tension, to get more consistant tension a bushing die is used is the jist of it I think.
I rang my smith and he uses a ptg reamer so I think ill go with the whiden bushing die and seater

 

[savageshooter86]

And consistent tension is also associated with turned necks. If one side is 15 thous and the other side is 14, you are not consistent on tension. Same if some necks on a piece are 14, another piece is 16, and another is 15, then the bidding is boot going to size consistent.

That is my take on it. Be sure to tell Whidden what you have and he will tell you what you need. I an thinking regular die unless you sort your brass by neck thickness or plan on turning them

Good luck

 

[burn]

I agree that with turning it will get the necks near spot on, im just confused over the bushing die bit. I thought that using a normal die would usually give to much neck tension while the point of a bushing die was to cut that tension down to .002-.003 or an amount that the loader wants. Given the good reputation and quality of lapua brass even unturned with a bushing die would be better as there would be less tension then a non bushing full length die? Sure its not as consistent as turned brass but it still wont have to much tension?

Consistency is the most important thing I know. I just don't know if needing a bushing die down the track is where I want to be if I start neck turning on future barrels. I could get differnt size bushings later if I start turning and it would be cheaper.

 

[savageshooter86]

that is why I suggested calling John. Tell him what you want to do with your rifle and give him your loaded round's neck diameter using a mic. Then you can get a die made to the neck tension you want and he can make custom size expander balls to fine tune neck tension. No bushings just different size expander. Might be cheaper this way vs having to buy bushings?

Even Lapua brass isn't perfect, although it is more consistent vs Winchester

If you are just getting into reloading and shooting I would go with standard die and master it and then get bushing. Just my 2 cents

Either way you go, you will not be disappointed with a Whidden Die set

 

[burn]

Ahh now I get you. Sounds like a plan cheers for the advice

 

[stubbicatt]

The Whidden FL Bushing die will resize the brass and bump the shoulder back and you chose a bushing size to your needs based on how much neck tension you want. If you are not turning the necks then the Whidden FL Non Bushing set is what you want. I would get the Whidden set personally. You get quality and if you have any issues they will take care of it. His seater die is the best I have used.

Do some searching on here. Seems most believe neck sizing is the best, but most believe FL sizing and bumping shoulder back 001-003 is better for life of the brass and accuracy. It is personal preference unless you have both set ups and can test this yourself

+1 on Whidden. I am with you in this new adventure. I am today sending my barreled action to have a stock built. The way I see it is, do your best to simplify, and the Whidden dies are a sure thing, they are excellent, and one less thing to worry about. I have a theory about these dies, and I would choose the complete set, whether FL or FL bushing (I chose the latter) and the seater die. Don't mix and match these dies IMO.

Good luck to you and maybe we will meet one day on the firing line and share a few laughs.

Regards,
Stubbicatt

 

[GSPV]

If it was me, I'd start with a Redding Type S bushing Full Length die. Most of the PT&G reamers are cut to work with the Redding dies.

Take the expander ball OUT and just use the decapping pin retaining nut. If you ding a case neck, either just throw it away or get a friend that turns necks to iron it out with his expanding mandrel.

I suggest starting with 2 thou of neck tension in your 6 BR. It's a nice compromise.

Then, there is nothing to it. You'll adjust how far you have the die screwed into your press to set your shoulder bump, use a neck bushing 2 thou smaller than a measured loaded round and have fun. No fuss, no muss.

Later, if you want to do something else, you'll have a good foundation for going forward. The real value of the custom dies comes in being made from cases fired in your chamber, ideally combined with the reamer print. That's how John Whidden made my 30 BR die which I think is GREAT.

I, personally, use Wilson inline dies for seating. I have them cut with my reamer. That way, there is no guessing about it fitting my rounds. YMMV.

 

[burn]

I could see about getting a wilson blank and have it cut with my chamber. I live in australia so I dont think I can send cartridge cases internationally. I needed a import permit for hornady oal cartridge cases I dont know what I would need to export cartridges and then get them into america