New Berger .224 Bullet

[JAlfred]

Eagerly awaiting more results.

 

[skiutah02]

Did some work today, also. Chose N140 because that what was next to the scale. Reassembled rifle just for this test. Issf reamer, 4groove, Bartlein heavy palma, 1:7, setback at 1800 rounds now with 200 more on it. Probably 28.5inches. Only took 29 total shots which was a crude powder test and seating depth test which I do with unknown stuff. And needed to zero scope at same time. Shot over labradar. Was about 52oF with light winds of 3-5 mph. My groups are too low round count and on Shotmarker single target so they are confusing to look at, but I am able to get some insight into them. Shot virgin unmolested brass. Just jammed a bullet in there (see what I mean about crude test), but I've test so many barrels and so many TR loads, it's enough for me to get calibrated. Here's the synopsis.
N140, F205M, 0.020 off
23.80 2795fps
24.00 2815fps
24.20 2835fps
24.40 2842fps
24.60 2869fps

All "groups" were sub 0.5 moa at 200y including seating 0.010 in, 0.010 off, 0.020 off and 0.040 off. There's definitely a node around 2800, and one either at 2840 or 2870 (or both). I shot my seating depth test (17 shots) at 2795 node with SD of 6 for the 17 shots. More investigation warranted at higher nodes and around 0.015 off(ish).

Drew

 

[skiutah02]

I should also mention that the metplats are very tiny, so I'm guessing that Jeremy's catch about that they might be "pointed" is true.

 

[MikeMcCasland]

This has been driving me crazy since yesterday; I pulled the GE off my .223, and put a Razor Gen 2 on there that was running 200.20xs very tight consistent groups at 200 yesterday.

I'm probably going to go test again this afternoon or tomorrow. I'll post up data when I get back.

 

[Jdne5b]

My current barrel is throated out too far (throated for 88 and 95s), unless I want to jump these .80-100, so I'll have to get another one broken in and then test them.

 

[garandman]

My current barrel is throated out too far (for 88 and 95s), unless I want to jump these .80-100, so I'll have to get another one broken in and then test them.

That was my biggest decision in my 224V build - whether or not to ream in more freebore. Its being shipped to me now....we'll see how it measures out.

 

[memilanuk]

My current barrel is throated out too far (for 88 and 95s), unless I want to jump these .80-100, so I'll have to get another one broken in and then test them.

What the heck was it throated *for*, then?!?

 

[Jdne5b]

Edited that post for clarity. My best guess is about .250-.280fb. Throated for 95s, works for 88s, tolerable for 90vld. The 85.5 is only in the case by .040 at touch.. Based on another barrel I have, .190 is about the longest freebore I would want to go with and try to use these bullets.

Pick of touch for barrel throated for 95s.

 

[Shootin25]

I’ll be at .080 FB, standard 22 Creed reamer.. been told to expect some growth early on.

 

[brshtr]

I should also mention that the metplats are very tiny, so I'm guessing that Jeremy's catch about that they might be "pointed" is true.

I'm wondering whether pointing these will be worthwhile. How do the meplats compare to 90VLDs that have been pointed?

 

[raptor1ronin]

I'm wondering whether pointing these will be worthwhile. How do the meplats compare to 90VLDs that have been pointed?

Looking at mine there is no need to point they are already closed, Almost looks like a FMJ. I will post pictures tonight.

 

[XTR]

Berger is closing the points. They are for all practical purposes “pointed” from the factory.

 

[skiutah02]

I point the 90s. I will not be pointing these.

 

[skiutah02]

Another small update. I took my now 1x fired brass up to see the max. At 24.80 gr of N140, 100% of the primer pockets failed the pin gauge test after firing. Did not get to Chrono as I went indoors and the reverb makes to LR go haywire. Guessing a shade over 2900fps. 24.70 lost 40% of the primer pockets and less than 24.60 all survived.

A couple of loads show promise, but even the best candidates suffered from one out of the group to be really noteworthy. Could be load or me, and there are many factors left to play with.

 

[MikeMcCasland]

Groups shot at 200.

I pulled a scope off another rifle, re-torqued my bases, confirmed 40in lbs on the action, and tried a depth test today. I can't get them to shoot like I think they should, but I've also had a hell of a time getting the 90s to work too... I'm just a high master on the internet, so take this for what it's worth.

Tried 24gr @ ~2770FPS of N140:
.005 off
.010 off
.015 off
.020 off
.025 off
.030 off

Tried 24.3gr @ ~2840FPS of Varget:
.005 off
.010 off
.015 off
.020 off
.025 off
.030 off
.035 off
.040 off

Brought another 'known' rifle/load to shoot, and was shooting quarter size groups at 200.

 

[Walt Krafft]

Got mine today. Nice looking bullets. Can't wait to give them a go.

 

[McStocks]

Great, Walt! Anxious to hear how they shoot!
This is the last of the ones folks have ordered from us. If you don't get an email with tracking tomorrow, please let us know!
S&S

 

[brshtr]

I point the 90s. I will not be pointing these.

Further to my question about the meplats:

I received my 85.5s today. Looking at the side of the tip, it has the same kind of shiny, triangular area that I get when I point bullets in a Whidden die. See the first photo below.

In the second photo below, the bottom bullet is an 85.5 straight out of the box, and the top one is a 90 VLD that I pointed. After comparing a number of the bullets, I'd say that the 85.5s have a slightly smaller meplat than what I get when I point the 90s. As @skiutah02 said, I see no reason to point the 85.5s.

Dave Rabin

 

[memilanuk]

Prelim results with Varget...

Rifle is Savage 12 Palma action, 28" Krieger Heavy Palma 1-7 tw, ISSF .223 match chamber (0.169" FB), Cortina tuner, McM XIT stock
Brass is once-fired Lapua .223, neck turned to 12.5 thou. Neck tension of 3 thou (.221 ID before seating), Federal 205M primers.

Ambient conditions were 38-42F each morning, between 80-95% humidity.

100yd seating depth test



Felt there was promise both at 11-14 thou, and the 23 thou group was nice but I didn't care for the groups on either side. So when I did the powder charge test, I seated everything long, and brought the arbor press and die to the range. Shot one group @ ~13 thou (based on previous experience with hybrids), and another @ 22 thou. 13 thou won.




Powder charge... obviously tight group @ 24.2, no discernable 'plateau' as far as velocities, OCW 'node' based on vert POI was around 24.6-ish, and calculated OCW/OBT node per QL would be around 24.5, based on ambient conditions. That may change considerably based on temperature. It appears the sweet spot for velocity (in this gun) is around 2800-2820, which jives pretty closely with QL.

Loaded up some more @ 13 thou jump, 24.5 gn Varget for tuner testing (fired round-robin, adjusting the tuner between each shot, then resetting to '0' and repeating the test). The group @ setting 14 was one hole... but the second shot wasn't a good break. Had one extra round, so at the end I re-set the tuner to '14' and tried sticking it in with the other two. No bueno. Fliers work both ways



Overall, I'd say it's looking promising for further testing. The velocity was a fuzz higher than I'd expected; may back it down to 24.4 gn. The bad news is that I'm about out of Varget... but it should be pretty easy to load to the 'target' velocity and work from there with another powder.

 

[Herzo]

Trying to get my 24" AR (.223) ready for my first F-TR shoot this weekend (though it looks like a rainout). 200 Berger 85.5's showed up on Tuesday, loaded 5 each Varget 22.5 gr, 23.0 gr, 23.3 gr & 23.6 gr in new Nosler brass 0.010" off the lands.
Found a sweet spot @ 23.3 gr 2778 FPS ave, ES 17, SD 7, group <0.70" @ 100 yds. First round @23.6 showed pressure indications @ 2840 FPS - decided to quit there. This is probably a good place to start.