New 1886 Winchester .45/90

[Ray123]

Food for thought out of the reloading manual.

45-70 Ruger #1 300 gr jacketed bullet max load 57 gr of RL 7 max load = 38,900 ave max pressure

45-90 ...closest load is 385 gr lead much heavier but longer COAL exact same powder charge 57.0 gr of RL 7 = 24900 psi max average pressure with 85 gr more bullet weight a lot less pressure and 100 fps less velocity for the heavier bullet.

Next the 1886 Win with more modern steel, ..the Model 71 Winchester 348 caliber ...compare with Ruger #1 ...runs the exact same max average pressures of 40,000 psi....and why I run my "modern"1886 45-90 at that pressure level ...I use Ruger #1 45-70 load data in the new 1886 45-90 as a reference...the new 1886 will take the same pressure and the COAL is longer further reducing the pressure with the same exact powder and bullet combination.
Example my 1886 shoots the 500 gr jacketed, loaded in 45-70 cases (45-90 cases too long for crimping) to run this bullet through the 1886 action... I use the exact same powder charge as the Ruger #1 at 2.930" and the 1886 at 2.850" both 45-70 cases...so I'm running the 1886 at slightly higher pressures the the 39,000 ave max pressure of the Ruger #1

Weak cases .... milled the heads of 3 different winchester cases the 44 mag has .010" less metal than the 45 Colt in the head, and the head of the 454 casull has .010 more material than the 45 colt. Making the 44 magnum the thinnest case at the head of the 3 cases milled or slightly weaker...it's the guns design & materials used that limits the pressures.
45 colt brass takes full power 454 Casull loads, when ya get into 405, 400 gr or 500 gr jacketed bullets the 454 cases are too long to crimp the bullet properly...the 500 gr jacketed usually do not stablized in these slow twist...even tried 500 gr single load in 45 Colt Win trapper 94 not as strong as the 1886, but the 94 does good with 350 cast.
The 1886 and 92 in modern form will take excursions into 50,000 psi and 40,000 psi loads continuously. My little 92 454 has many thousands of 65,000 psi or same as the 300 mags
Rumor has it they have a special steel in the 454 model... it is a little thicker in the barrel ...but it's the same 1892 action...those long twin locking bolts in the lever carry more locking area than a bolt gun...an excellent design by Mr. Browning.

 

[Phys86]

I wish that I could remember where I read it, but awhile back I found some information on how the marlin 95 is actually weaker than the modern 1886 due to the thread type used on the barrel tennon. There was a blown up Marlin given as an example... It gave at the barrel threads.

 

[Ray123]

I wish that I could remember where I read it, but awhile back I found some information on how the marlin 95 is actually weaker than the modern 1886 due to the thread type used on the barrel tennon. There was a blown up Marlin given as an example... It gave at the barrel threads.

Yes the Marlin is weaker and thinner at the barrel threaded tenon area... Mic McPherson is probably where you heard it....his major complaint was the thinness of the barrel tenon...He a Marlin lever guy who modified the Marlins to take as large as possible cartridges ...similar to the 457 Wild West Magnum guys in Alaska...but the published data never matched real world gun data over the chronograph...but they were definitely a good improvement. The Winchester 1886 already was made into 50 caliber ...the expensive customized Marlin could not come close to the new 45-90, let alone the 50-110 ... the Marlin is limited to much shorter cartridge OAL ...not so with the 1886.
There is a channel "1886 50-110" if ya wanna see brute power that makes the 458 win mag look under powered...he runs the loads over the chronograph...entertaining,...and he does mention the massive recoil...also shoots some ridiculous 700 plus grain bullets...Can't do that in a Marlin.