need some quick load data

[eric32]

I don't need a whole lot of info I know how much the program cost, and I am just looking for pressure figures

Caliber 308 win
Brass: winchester 56.6 h2o cap
trimmed to 2.005
Bullet:Hornady 178 bthp MOLY
Oal from o-give 2.225
Powder: imr 4064 44 grs
Primer CCI br2/ #200

Load jumped .020

 

[eric32]

Btt

 

[Keith Glasscock]

A couple of things....

QL has to be tuned to your rifle and load. I can tell you that you are somewhere between clean burning and somewhat over max. In either case, the rifle needs to tell you how much pressure there is or isn't.

In my 308 hunting rifle, 175 SMK (naked, mag length) and 44.7 of Varget is right about MAX. It also shoots there. QL estimates a lower pressure and velocity than I'm getting without significant adjustment to the burn rate.

 

[heymarine1833]

howdy. im really new here but happened to see your post. trying to help you. like the busdriver said, ql is tailored to your rifle/bullet. i do not have a length to ogive here but do have a standard coal of 2.800. what is your coal?? this is very critical because with the data provided and figured on a piezo CIP pressure measuring method, your load is 2275psi over max. meaning the rated pressure is 60191 psi and your load is 62466psi even with moly. um, i would not use this load according to the data i have in front of me. if your coal is longer...then of course your pressure will decrease. i wonder how much more decrease in pressure you would get if you swabed your bore with moly?? do you have to use this powder? because we may be able to find something more suitable for your load.

 

[eric32]

Base of case to the ogive of the bullet is 2.225 inches


Barrel is a 30" 1/11 twist


With moly coated bullets I always prime the bore with paste before use

 

[heymarine1833]

hi eric. i do not have length to ogive on QL. all i really need is exact length of your bullet because lengths seem to change and your cartridge overall length meaning base to tip. however, im afraid your 44 gr of 4064 is still going to be over max pressure even with moly and swabbed with moly.

if i input 2.225 oal into the program, your pressure is over 135000psi!

 

[eric32]

It would be somewhere around COAL of 2.85 I don't have the numbers in front of me right now on vacation.

 

[Road_Clam]

I never loaded up to 44 grs, as that's getting too hot for my liking, but I shot 175 Nosler CC's up to 43.5 gr of 4064 and here's my numbers :

low = 2654 fps
high = 2681
avg = 2664
es = 26
sd = 12

shot a .811" 4 shot group @ 200 meters.

This was a GREAT load shot through my R700 Varmint w/26" barrel. I'm pretty sure this will be the load I will use for my 1000 yd instructional class this spring. I plan on some more testing to further confirm my data.

 

[heymarine1833]

eric? when you get back from vacation, please measure your cartridge and get back with me. normal is 2.800. just guessing, but i still think you are way too dangerous on pressure. once i get all the info i need, i'll toss around some other powder variations if you want.

 

[eric32]

So it's 2.895 COAL

The bullet is the new 178 bthp .530 BC

 

[Keith Glasscock]

You'll have to give us a little bit of chrono data to make sure, but QL is guessing just under 59Kpsi.

What is your velocity?

Does it shoot good with the 30" barrel? I'm showing you in the general area of the OBT node.

 

[eric32]

That's awesome I'll get the chrono data this week

 

[heymarine1833]

do you have quick load also busdriver? @2.895 coal, QL reads 59045 psi with a MAX pressure of 60191psi

estimated velocity with the friction proofed modifier is 2770 fps
ballistic efficiency is 37.2%
barrel time is 1.360

 

[918v]

Winchester brass has a water capacity over 58 grains in most chambers. So your 56.5 number is throwing things off.

 

[Keith Glasscock]

do you have quick load also busdriver? @2.895 coal, QL reads 59045 psi with a MAX pressure of 60191psi

estimated velocity with the friction proofed modifier is 2770 fps
ballistic efficiency is 37.2%
barrel time is 1.360

Yup, V3.6 ... I am, however, showing both slower and less pressure than you are. For the moly, I'm using 0.66 because I haven't experimented with moly to determine how it really affects velocities.

Which bullet are you basing your numbers on? I have both PN 30715 and 30631 in the database.

I am using the OP's capacity number - 56.6 despite the fact that my Win brass is something over 57 grains in a tight match chamber.

All of that said, the OP still needs to read the brass and chrono the load to determine if the load is safe in his rifle.

 

[heymarine1833]

but he will be ok with the cases as they currently are as long as he does not go over 44 grains. shoot it and see

 

[heymarine1833]

same version as yours busdriver. using #30715 except i made a slight error. i entered the 56.6 water capacity incorrectly as 56.0. measured this on the CIP scale because i was not sure which of the three

correction is :2758 estimated velocity
57454 psi
36.8% efficiency
1.375 bullet time

 

[eric32]

Winchester brass has a water capacity over 58 grains in most chambers. So your 56.5 number is throwing things off.

Other than using water with a medicine dropper from a just fired case.I don't know of any other method.

Scale is a gem pro 250 and the scale reads zero before I start. Using 5 fired cases for each measurement then averaging them.

I think my measurements are spot on for what my brass is and what my chamber is. Maybe you have much lighter brass then I do. My brass also weighs 158-159gr per batch. The bullet is 30715 B

 

[heymarine1833]

WHAT I HAVE SEEN SO FAR IS THAT THE QUICK LOAD IS GOOD AND VERY CLOSE TO THE ACTUAL. FROM MY CHRONO TESTS COMPARED TO QUICK LOAD, MY VELOCITY WAS LOWER THAN GUESTIMATED USING HBN OR MOLY(BORE SWABBED WITH MOLY AND OR HBN SOLUTION DEPENDING ON WHAT THE BULLET WAS COATED WITH)
I DO BELIEVE YOU WILL BE OK. THE "SCALE" I WAS DISCUSSING TO WITH BUSDRIVER WAS THE WAY PRESSURE IS CALCULATED ON THE PROGRAM, NOT YOUR SCALE.

HOW ABOUT JUST NOT GOING OVER 44 GRAINS?? NOT EVEN .1 GRAIN BECAUSE YOU ARE REAL CLOSE ON GOING OVER MAX PRESSURE!! IF YOU WANTED TO TRY A DIFFERENT POWDER EITHER OF US WOULD WORK UP SOMETHING ELSE UNLESS YOU HAVE YOUR LITTLE HEART SET ON THIS PARTICULAR POWDER. BUSDRIVER COULD WORK UP A LOAD WITH ONE POWDER AND I COULD THE OTHER. GUESS WE NEED TO TAKE A PICTURE OF THE DATA AND SEND?? THAT MIGHT HELP YOU A LOT AS WELL.

 

[Keith Glasscock]

I disagree about the room you have to make it into the center of the node. I think you can make it *if* you have enough room in the case (it doesn't look promising). We have been using different pressure maximum settings between our calculations. I'm using the SAAMI version with a max pressure setting of 62Kpsi. The center of the OBT node (not a guarantee of accuracy, but a good spot to look) will run your pressure up to 60Kpsi. Should be doable with 4064.

I have a more accurate profile for Varget than is provided by QL. Mine accurately predicts velocities in the 308 far better than the QL version for powder produced 2-3 years ago.

I would suggest looking at what you are currently shooting - Is it accurate? Does it need to be better? If the accuracy is adequate I'd say just shoot what you have assuming it is not showing pressure signs or tearing up brass.

If you would like some pointers on Varget, let me know.