Need help with a sizing die.

[Mr Underbridge]

Hey guys maybe I am missing something basic or I am having a problem.
I have a redding FL bushing die for in 308 winchester, I use it on a co-ax press.
I just took a hornady headspace case gauge to measure some brass fired from a remington factory barrel and some from my palama 95 chambered barrel. Cases from both measured about 1.6295 from palma 95 and 1.6230 from remington.
Now I adjusted my die ALL the way down to the shell holder and sized cases from both batches. Necks gets sized but the shoulders do not budge at all. I measured about 20 or so cases, checked and rechecked my adjustments, the shoulders are not getting bumped back.
What the heck is going on?

 

[Eddie Harren]

Go to your previous thread on "Type S full length sizing die and shoulder bump" and read Brian's comment. Third reply to your original question.

 

[Mr Underbridge]

Go to your previous thread on "Type S full length sizing die and shoulder bump" and read Brian's comment. Third reply to your original question.

I am using a forster co-ax I cant use the competition shell holders..

 

['Freak]

According to your case base to shoulder datum measurements, the fired cases from your ‘custom’ built Palma chamber rifle are being blown out enough so for the case body to end up .0065” longer than the body of those fired in a rifle that was chambered at the Remington factory…???

Are you positive that’s a “Type S Full Length Bushing Die” and not the “Type S Neck Bushing Die”?

Can you feel the die squishing on the case body and then the neck, or only on the neck?

 

[mshelton]

Talk real nice to your local gunsmith and ask him to put your die in the lathe and trim 50-100 thou or so off the bottom, problem solved.

If you don't have a local gunsmith or can't be nice enough to get him trim the the die, you can use a grinder and smooth out the edge with some files and sandpaper. Problem still solved.

 

['Freak]

Based on the reported case base to datum measurements, he has brass fire formed in a ‘smith reamed Palma 95 chamber that evidently got reamed deep enough to end up with .0065” greater headspace than what’s indicated by the measurement of brass coming from a Remington factory reamed chamber. On top of that, it seems both chambers are fire forming brass still too short from case base to shoulder datum for a Redding Type S Full Length Bushing Die to even begin bumping back the shoulders. I’m thinkin’ there’s a lot more going on here than can be blamed solely on Redding’s die.

 

[bigedp51]

How far down do you have your die adjusted, the die can be turned 1/8 to 1/4 past contact with the shell holder. There is also a Co-Ax adapter for standard shell holders and these can be lapped for more shoulder bump.


Forster Co-Ax press full length resizing die instructions.

CASE SIZING PROCEDURE
1. Install the Die into any standard 7/8-14 thread reloading
press or Forster’s Co-Ax® Reloading Press so that it
makes contact with the shell holder when the ram is at its
uppermost position.
2. Turn the Die another 1/8 to ¼ turn against the shell holder to
remove all play from the linkage system of the press.
3. Tighten the Cross Bolt Die Lock Ring (DIE-G-10) by using a
7/64 short arm hex key on the Die Lock Ring Screw
(6-32 X ½ ").
4. Insert a case into the reloading press.
5. Size the case by actuating the reloading press. (Ensure the
bottom of the Die makes complete contact with the shell
holder.) This operation reduces the outside case diameter,
removes the spent primer, and expands the case neck inside
diameter. It also may stretch the case neck, so check the
overall case length and trim if necessary.
6. Remove the sized case from the Die.
7. The case is now ready for priming and powder charge.

http://www.forsterproducts.com/client_images/catalog19938/pages/files/Full_Length_Sizing_Die_Instructions.pdf

 

[hogan]

Redding heat treats their type S sizers to very hard spec.

When I enlarged the neck on the .243win AI die, in order to make a .308win AI S sizer, I had to heat the die to cherry red to remove the heat treatment. Once cooled the carbide could take a bite. Suspect shaving the lower of the die would be about the same. Not gonna be any file you will find to impact Redding's heat treatment. It is some tough stuff.

Why they go to such extremes with heat treatment? Not like reducing fired brass .001" is going to wear on any decent grade of steel over a lifetime to make appreciable wear? Not like brass don't have to be lubed to begin with, eh? Does brass lubed with Imperial die wax produce wear on a sizing die? How could it?


Once again, I think our friend needs to concentrate on shooting not getting that last .0045" of neck sized. It means NOTHING in the scope of things. Try neck sizing only halfway. Bet your groups get tighter!

 

[barefooter56]

Mr Underbridge,
One of three things is happening here. If this is once fired brass it MAY not have expanded far enough up the chamber for the shoulder area of the die to make contact. The other if the brass is more than once fired the chamber of the die is longer than the chamber in your rifle ( it may also be real close in inside diameter to your chamber also because the brass didn't "grow" longer after you sized it so its not making much contact with the side walls of the die either which could work in your favor). OR the brass has been fired many times and the die is not sizing the shoulder down past the point to where when it "springs back" it doesn't remain sized shorter. The first issue MAY not be a problem and will go away in the next couple firings. If it doesn't then the die will have to be shortened ( which will solve all 3 issues). Suggest you only do this in .002-.003 increments using a carbide cutter on a lathe by a gunsmith or machinest friend. OR you can contact Redding and see what they can do for you with another die if you return that one. Just buying another die MAY not solve your problem. With more and more people having their rifles custom made this seems to have become more of an issue than before. The die companies know this and will help.

 

[243winxb]

Neck size only, till bolt is hard to close. (Bolt Actions only)

It may take at least 3 firings for the brass to fully expand to the chamber, head to datum measurements. It varies using starting load to full pressure loads.