Need advice on choice of small carry pistol for self-defense

[Goofycat]

I am stumped as to which small pistol I should choose for self-defense carry purposes. I recently purchased a magazine listing all the semi-automatics that are available. The choices are many and varied, but reading the magazine left me wondering which is the best choice.

I want something that I can carry in a small fanny-pack,or my back pocket) that is comfortable in my hand, has a safety that is easy to operate, is fairly accurate within 25 feet, is easy to clean, and in a caliber that will stop a perp. A .380 or .32 semi-auto might fill the bill, or if your comments steer me away from such small calibers, I might consider a 9mm or even a .45 ACP, although those calibers would undoubtedly weigh more and come in a larger size.

I am a long-time member of the NRA, and own five pistols,three .22 rimfire and two .357s), all of which are really too large and/or too heavy to carry easily. I don't have a CCW, so I would be a law-breaker if caught using a pistol for self-protection; however, my life is worth more than a fine or short jail sentence.

Any ideas on the 'ideal' carry-weapon?

Thanks,

Barry

 

[riverman]

don't mean to sound like a wise guy, but there's no such thing...
different pistols for different occasions...

start with everywhere, everytime pistol in the pocket... my favorites are seecamp 32 & s&w 38 snubbie...

belt or waistband...baby glock & lightweight officer's model colt 45 auto...

after that, whatever you're in the mood for

 

[tenring]

I just bought a Ruger LCP semi-auto. .380, weighs about 8.5 ounces and I can carry it in any pocket comfortably,I have carried it in a large shirt pocket, don't know its there). I do not like the fact that it has no safety. The .380 may not be a man stopper, but it will do the job when you do yours. And, the price was under $300.

 

[Nodak7mm]

Stop buy your local shoppe and fondle a Springfield XD-SC,SubCompact). Make sure you have Pierce grip extensions on the 10 & 13 rd mags when you do, makes all the difference... Absolutley love mine, comes in 9 & 40. I think it is light and easy to carry. Plus it is very accurate! Nothing but good things to say about this rig.... And relatively inexpensive in its class, can be had for 500...

I want to get the 45 in a Compact to match....

Rod

 

[JLM]

I carry a Bersa .380 all the time in a Galco U.S.A. holster. I like it, it was exactly what I wanted, the feel was perfect for me. The trigger is great and it shoots absolutely great for me.

When I don't care about concealment it's an H&K USP 40.

 

[FBecigneul]

You don't say why you don't have, or wish to apply for, a CCW or CPL in Michigan and so I have to assume you aren't, or weren't, law abiding before. Carry legally or don't carry at all. The streets are full of illegal carries now. What makes you think you're above the law? Get the CCW and than ask that question again. Well, that's the way I feel about it. Individual opinions may vary.

 

[chino1969]

If I were to recommend a single all around carry piece it would be a .38 snub nose. Let me preface this statement by stating that I've had a concealed weapons permit since 1975 in the state of PA. and still hold one. I've carried everything from 10mm. to .45 ACP in everything from ankle holsters to double mag. shoulder rigs to pancake rigs, etc. Let's face reality; the average Joe is not going to get into a prolonged gunfight requiring a change of magazines. If you need to use a handgun to protect yourself, the distance is going to be close. The truth is that carrying a handgun for any length of time can be very uncomfortable, particularly getting into and out of vehicles. I can tuck my S&W Model 60 down the front of my pants and comfortably go into stores, in and out of vehicles, etc. with a low profile signature.

Pistols I've carried: Colt Delta Elite 10mm., S&W 1076 10mm., S&W Model 19 .357 Mag., Sig P226, Sig P220, Sig P228, Springfield Armory Compact Comp. .45 ACP., Browning HP 9mm., Ruger Security Six .357 mag.

Holsters I've used and own: Galco SOB, Galco inside pants holster, Bianchi pistol pocket, Little Feathers auto. shoulder rig, Yaqui belt slide, numerous pancake holsters, Galco ankle holster, etc. Out of all the holsters I've used for the autos, the Yaqui belt slide is my favorite. A very simple well thought out rig that fits my 10mm's., my Sigs and Delta Elite.

Lou Baccino

 

[chillippr]

chino69 +1

 

[Rustystud]

I pretty much agree with Chino69. Having been a LEO for 33 years I have come to the conclusion if you don't have it you can use when you need it. There is nothing better than a 1911 45acp or a S&W model 66 357 mag. But being practical a S&W model 642 or 60 is hard to beat. The 9s and 380s are just not reliable man stoppers. You can bet if I have clothes on I will be packing.
Nat Lambeth

 

[Goofycat]

FBecigneul, I don't have a CCW because in California it is not possible to get one...at least in the city where I live. Also, if one were granted, there is the requirement of taking three days off to take the CCW course. This involves money, time and an additional requirement of getting the CCW renewed every couple of years, which means having to go through all the red tape again. In other words, it is VERY difficult to obtain a CCW unless one can show that one's life is in danger from a specific person, etc.

I had a CCW about 30 years ago, having been recommended for one by a member of the Grand Jury, no less, but it was valid only for carrying office receipts to the bank. I had to take it or leave it. I took it, but the limited CCW really did not permit me to carry a weapon anywhere, other than to the bank and back to the office, so by-and-large it was mostly useless. This is the way they think out here in liberal California, and there is nothing I can do about it. No, I am no felon and have never had any scrapes with the law, other than getting parking tickets and a few stops for speeding. It does not matter how law-abiding a person is on the left coast; law enforcement has been brainwashed into thinking that our right to self-defense is wrong, and this thinking extends into their refusal to grant CCWs to anyone who has no political power. It is interesting that judges can carry; off-duty officers can carry, but plain old citizens like me are out of luck. I guess my life is not worth as much as theirs.

Nathaniel, I keep two .357s,S&W model 66 with 2 1/2' bbl and a model 19 with 6' bbl) in the house for home defense. I feel they are really too heavy for a carry weapon, but with 185 grain HPs they are deadly enough. My only concern is that I have neighbors whose houses might not provide for their protection should I happen to mess up my usually good aim at some perp in the middle of the night, or if the bullet happened to travel through the perp and the walls of both my home and my neighbors' homes.

As for the other suggestions regarding pistol choice, I am leaning toward the .40 or the .45 ACP. I am not familiar with the .40, but have shot the .45 and know that it has good kinetic energy at the ranges I would imagine would be used in a self-defense situation. Are the ballistics similar with these two calibers, or would a .40 be a better choice merely because more .40 cartridges can be stored in the handle? Naturally, I will check out the suggestions all of you have given me before I plunk down my money at the local gun store,there is only ONE in Santa Rosa, California---a town of almost 160,000 people). The private gun brokers with licenses have dwindled away due to the onerous government regulations. I hate to say it, but with Obama at the helm, God help us.

 

[tomj44]

Goofycat, I suggest you ask that question at Warrior Talk.
http://www.warriortalk.com/index.php . I have had handgun training from Gabe Suarez before he started Suarez International. Gabe is very good at what he does. Gabe and his group are true warriors and will be able to give you options that work in the real world.

Tom

 

[Goofycat]

Thanks, Tom. Will do.

 

[effendude]

Barry,
I'm very sorry to hear that you live in such a restrictive state. But, I have to agree with FBecigneul on this. You have posted a statement on a forum on the WWW stating you intend to violate a law regarding firearms. As a life member of the NRA, I fully support your rights, but if you decide you must violate the laws of your area to do it, please don't state your intentions publicly. This type of attitude, especially displayed publicly, not only hurts the CCW movement, but also all firearms owners everywhere. The 80% of the public who doesn't hunt or owns guns does not need anymore negative examples to be used against us law abiding gun owners.

If you believe the laws in your state are too restrictive, work on changing the laws. It was done here in MN, the state where nothing is allowed, and it can be done in CA too. It may take some time, but nothing is impossible.
I wish you luck,
Scott

 

[cliffy]

9mm Luger is minimal for any practical purpose: i.e. self-defense. It cannot be compared to a .45 ACP in any manner. A .357 Magnum load is slightly stronger than a .45 ACP at close-up confrontations. Whilst a 9mm Luger is slightly less strong than a .38 Special with a proper load, a .380 AUTO is anemic at best. A .380 AUTO is best left for drastic, last effort hopefulness. cliffy

 

[Goofycat]

Effendude, I understand your concerns, but let me try to answer them:

,1) My life is far more important than my worrying about breaking a law that we both know is wrong and is not designed to allow for self-defense of law-abiding citizens, but to bow to those in the anti-gun movement.

,2) My statement is not exactly 'public.' I.e., I doubt that any member of the so-called 'public' will be reading comments on this particular forum. I would never make such a statement in the national or local media, but feel safe to do so here.

I am actively working on getting the laws changed in California, using the fairly recent Arizona carry-law as a model. Whether or not California will follow suit is always a concern, but until those politicians in our government become educated enough to care more about the safety of us citizens,who are possible victims at any time) who pay their salaries than they do about punishment of career criminals and gangbangers who have no fear of prosecution for their outrageous crimes, I will do what I have to do to protect my life.

Does this mean I plan to carry a weapon at all times for self-defense? Certainly not. If I feel that I may be forced into an area where my life or the life of a loved one might well be compromised, rest assured that I will be taking a pro-active approach, keeping in mind that the police will not be there to guarantee my protection.

I would certainly bet that there are many gun-owners who share my concerns, but don't exactly advertise that they pack a weapon for self-defense. That's fine, too. I, however, have no qualms about expressing my thoughts on a rather private forum such as this and do not feel that those thoughts as expressed on this forum will have any negative effect on future legislation, keeping in mind that California politicians by-and-large do not spy on forums of this type. If they did, they might learn that the concerns we gun-owners have are valid and well worth their support.

 

[chino1969]

Just one more point to add to this discussion.

There is a whole market of handguns, holsters, tactical gear, etc. that are designed to appeal to people who feel they need superior firepower and force to withstand a gunfight they are likely to never be in. Do yourself a favor and take a course that covers the justification and laws regarding the use of deadly force. This would be money speny wisely and may prevent you from getting into a legal place you hadn't counted on.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a strong proponent of the right to carry and defend oneself. I see too many people who really haven't cultivated the mindset necessary to deal with a life or death situation involving the use of a firearm. Decent responsible training and knowledge of the laws are as valuable as the sidearm you'll be carrying.

Lou Baccino

 

[Goofycat]

Lou, I absolutely agree. I have taken such a course and found it extremely valuable, especially from the standpoint that if I ever am unfortunate enough to find myself in a compromised situation, I want to make sure that I am not the one who ends up behind bars for not following the laws now in place that cover when NOT to use deadly force. I also have several books on the subject and am well familiar with the hurdles that can result.

The last thing I want to do is shoot anyone, and I certainly do not take the responsibility of using deadly force lightly. We both realize,at least I do) that an attorney in a court situation can bend the truth like a pretzel in front of a jury to the point where he can make the good guy appear far worse than the perpetrator.

 

[Brodie]

I have to commend you guys......on our canadian gun forum this thread would be deleted and the original poster would likely be banned, or at least be given an infraction. Here you get 3 pages with the majority of the posts beig helpful. We are definately doing things worng up here in the north.

 

[Goofycat]

Well, Brodie, this is what America is all about, and the right to express our beliefs and opinions is one of the things for which we fought the Revolutionary War. It is sad that people have been and would still be executed for saying the 'wrong' thing.

If you get tired of being in Canada and want to move down, you would be welcomed. It doesn't take much to live here. You don't even have to be a citizen.

 

[chino1969]

Lou, I absolutely agree. I have taken such a course and found it extremely valuable, especially from the standpoint that if I ever am unfortunate enough to find myself in a compromised situation, I want to make sure that I am not the one who ends up behind bars for not following the laws now in place that cover when NOT to use deadly force. I also have several books on the subject and am well familiar with the hurdles that can result.

The last thing I want to do is shoot anyone, and I certainly do not take the responsibility of using deadly force lightly. We both realize,at least I do) that an attorney in a court situation can bend the truth like a pretzel in front of a jury to the point where he can make the good guy appear far worse than the perpetrator.

I hope more people read these threads and understand what we are saying. In 1975 I was a correctional officer working from 4p.m. to midnight. I received my training from the Dept. of Justice Bureau of Prisons at The State Correctional Facility at Dallas, PA. We received a very thorough and extensive amount of training with a fair amount covering the legalities regarding the use of deadly force. Our instructor was a man by the name of Frank Patts who trained all of the PA. State Police, Correctional Officers, etc. I still carry key points that he emphasized in my head to this very day.

I had a cell block of approx. 80 inmates. One of the inmates threatened my life, told me he knew where I lived and would see me when he got released. Several weeks later I came face to face with this inmate as I opened the full length wooden gate leading to my backyard. When I opened the door, this inmate was on the other side and we were three feet apart. Within seconds, I had my .357 Ruger Security Six cleared of gunleather and pointing directly at his mouth. The training I received prevented me from killing this unarmed piece of scum. This is the point I am trying to make; get some training, know the laws and don't listen to gun mag writers or para-military wanna bees. Those kind of people can get you into big trouble.

If you shoot an unarmed man, unless he's in your house, you had better have solid justification. The arriving police don't care that you used a Les Baer tricked .45 ACP in a Milt Sparks Summer Special holster loaded with Glaser Safety Slugs; your ass is going to be arrested. Do your homework, know your state laws, develop the necessary mindset and be prepared. Realize that many situations can be readily defused by the mere brandishing of a sidearm. Don't think you are a SWAT team member or an elite warrior and you'll not be on the other side of the bars looking out.

Lou Baccino