neck turn before or after expanding?

[holstil]

I decided to put a clean up pass on my Lapua brass and give a little more room in the neck on my 284.
I have 6.5x284 brass and need to expand to 284 improved. I have 6.5 expanding and turning mandrels from when I ran a 6.5x284 tight neck. Should I turn with the equipment I have first or expand, fireform then turn?
My concern is that if I turn then expand and fire form, I might induce irregularities in the brass.


Input welcome, Jim

 

[Catfish]

Definately after you form they. The necks will get thinner when you expand them and depending how tight your neck is you may not have to turn them.

 

[artbosco]

I decided to put a clean up pass on my Lapua brass and give a little more room in the neck on my 284. I have 6.5x284 brass and need to expand to 284 improved. I have 6.5 expanding and turning mandrels from when I ran a 6.5x284 tight neck. Should I turn with the equipment I have first or expand, fireform then turn?
My concern is that if I turn then expand and fire form, I might induce irregularities in the brass.

ALWAYS AFTER EXPANDING. When preparing new brass for either my 6PPC or 30BR I: 1st: Expand with a K&M Expandiron. 2nd: Turn with a K&M Turner. 3rd: Fire Form in my Fire Forming Barrel. After I've Fire Formed 2 or 3 times, I Trim and then I may turn again, before taking it to the line.

 

[holstil]

Thanks for the heads up.

 

[necchi]

ALWAYS AFTER EXPANDING.

I don't git it??
I'm not sayin you two guys are wrong, but I can't grasp why turning (removing irregularities) prior too expanding is a bad thing.

What am I missing? ???

 

[holstil]

I don't think they are saying it's bad to remove irregularities before expanding. It's making sure that the finished brass has no thinned spots after expanding. I wasn't sure if it matters. I can understand how the brass might not expand evenly.

Jim

 

[P1ZombieKiller]

ALWAYS AFTER EXPANDING.

I don't git it??
I'm not sayin you two guys are wrong, but I can't grasp why turning (removing irregularities) prior too expanding is a bad thing.

What am I missing? ???

2 reasons come to mind.
1. When you expand, you change the point where the neck becomes the shoulder, and the shoulder becomes the neck. If you turned it before you expanded it, then you still have part of the neck (the part that used t be the shoulder) that hasn't been turned.
2. The thickness of the neck will change depending on how far you expand it to.

 

[artbosco]

ALWAYS AFTER EXPANDING.

I don't get it? I can't grasp why turning (removing irregularities) prior too expanding is a bad thing. What am I missing?

Grab your Caliper and your Micrometer.

Prior to doing anything, measure the thickness of a case neck and then, the overall length of that case.

Expand a case neck. Now, measure both dimensions again. What happened?

That's why I prefer to do my Turning after expanding ... after both dimensions have been mechanically altered by the Expandiron.

My personal preference, and those of a lot of short-range BR shooters, is to alter the case: neck and overall length first, and then turn. I like to get the alterations out of the way first, and then cleanup what's left.

 

[lrgoodger]

My personal preference, and those of a lot of short-range BR shooters, is to alter the case: neck and overall length first, and then turn. I like to get the alterations out of the way first, and then cleanup what's left.

In addition to that, new brass is usually too tight on the turner mandrel. That greatly increases the chance of galling the inside of the neck. The expander gets it to exactly the right size for the turner.

Also, I never could understand the folks who fireform before neck turning. If the neck is thicker on one side, the center of the case neck will not be the same as the center of the chamber neck after firing. If you turn it then, the mis-alignment will still exist and your bullet will not be pointing down the center of the bore until you fire and load that case the second time.

 

[bozo699]

My personal preference, and those of a lot of short-range BR shooters, is to alter the case: neck and overall length first, and then turn. I like to get the alterations out of the way first, and then cleanup what's left.

In addition to that, new brass is usually too tight on the turner mandrel. That greatly increases the chance of galling the inside of the neck. The expander gets it to exactly the right size for the turner.

Also, I never could understand the folks who fireform before neck turning. If the neck is thicker on one side, the center of the case neck will not be the same as the center of the chamber neck after firing. If you turn it then, the mis-alignment will still exist and your bullet will not be pointing down the center of the bore until you fire and load that case the second time.

If you turned the neck on say a 6br prior to fireforming to the 6brx then you better be very good with a micrometer because .100 of the shoulder used to be neck. Wes and Outdoorsman are spot on for proper procedure. I have been very careful and turned the neck to create a so called false shoulder but did not care for it and went back to jamming the bullet, fireforming, then neck turned. As far as the miss aligned statement, that is why many of us buy the expensive Lapua brass, brass thickness is very consistent, it may be off a little but nothing like remington, .015 on one side and .011 on the other??
Wayne.

 

[tenring]

Prior to his retirement several years ago, Ken Markle told me to expand before turning ALWAYS. And dedicate that turner to the rifle in which it is intended, so that when you turn the next batch, the necks will be identical.

I have tried turning necks to clean them up after 3 or 4 firings, but this really is not necessary. Mostly, it removes a few thou near the neck-shoulder junction.

 

[necchi]

Thank You for further explanation Gent's.
The light bulb has come on,

 

[P1ZombieKiller]

Thank You for further explanation Gent's.
The light bulb has come on,

Feels real good when you figure it out. I hate looking at something and it confuses me.

 

[bozo699]

Thank You for further explanation Gent's.
The light bulb has come on,

Feels real good when you figure it out. I hate looking at something and it confuses me.

That must be why I never feel REAL good, I am always confused ;D
Wayne.

 

[P1ZombieKiller]

Well.... You are a bozo!!!

 

[bozo699]

Well.... You are a bozo!!!