Neck tension vs Concentricity

[Sixgun]

Hey all...What do you guys value more..consistent neck tension or good concentricity?

I have another question but I'm not gonna ask it now because these discussions go the rails quick.

 

[tuttlefarm]

Consistent neck tension, at the top of the chart for accuracy.

 

[ngb1787]

Nothing more important than neck tension,

 

[Dusty Stevens]

Unless you got a lot of eccentricity dont worry about it. Once you get good dies and prove them your concentricity checker will gather dust

 

[BenPerfected]

Nothing more important than neck tension,

I agree that neck tension is important. How are you measuring your neck tension? Do you use expander mandrels to get the target neck tension? How many and what tension groups do you sort? Do you shoot at 500+ yds? Always looking for ways to improve.
Sprague

 

[Sixgun]

I agree that neck tension is important. How are you measuring your neck tension? Do you use expander mandrels to get the target neck tension? How many and what tension groups do you sort? Do you shoot at 500+ yds? Always looking for ways to improve.
Sprague

Sinclair Mandrel and Sinclair con.gauge with a Starret dial. I don't sort anything. FL Forster die reamed to .336 (.308).. my last batch 10-12 were .001 or less 10-25 or so .003- .004..the rest plus. 004. Out of 50. Wilson is my seater. Although I do have a Forster mic seater too.

The ones plus .004 I've been 'correcting' them with a hole in a piece of wood by tweeking them just a bit. So my other question I didn't want to ask right now is by doing that..will that have if an effect on neck tension?

 

[Sixgun]

Sinclair Mandrel and Sinclair con.gauge with a Starret dial. I don't sort anything. FL Forster die reamed to .336 (.308).. my last batch 10-12 were .001 or less 10-25 or so .003- .004..the rest plus. 004. Out of 50. Wilson is my seater. Although I do have a Forster mic seater too.

The ones plus .004 I've been 'correcting' them with a hole in a piece of wood by tweeking them just a bit. So my other question I didn't want to ask right now is by doing that..will that have if an effect on neck tension?

Also..the correction is minimal. One little tweak in one direction that's it. Gets it to within .0015.

 

[dkhunt14]

Maybe Dusty can answer this,
Without body support how likely is a Sinclair Mandrel Die to cause more concentricity problems that it solves?

Concentricity is over rated. Neck tension is more important. I never saw a mandrel cause concentricity problems. It usually will help correct it amd make tensions more consistent. Matt

 

[Sixgun]

^^^

Are you saying don't worry about concentricity unless it's bad as long as neck tension is consistent?

 

[Sixgun]

Are you saying don't worry about concentricity unless it's bad as long as neck tension is consistent?

How bad is bad...more than .002-.003?

 

[Puzzaz01]

Neck tension consistently is just as important as a powder charge. A tighter than avg neck tension causes higher pressures, minimal but very noticeable on paper.

Darrin

 

[270WinDude]

Neck tension consistently is just as important as a powder charge. A tighter than avg neck tension causes higher pressures, minimal but very noticeable on paper.

Darrin

One more variable.... I don’t think that there is a secret tension across the board for all guns or loads. I could be wrong but I View it more in a catagory below seating depth and charge. Hard to directly test for it as a primary variable though especially considering the results could range from no change to being the difference maker. As stated on here many times if I remember short range they go loose and let the lands push back on the bullet and long range shooters go with something more tight yet very consistent. I’ve had luck with both almost tight and very loose in the same gun with different loads.

 

[Richard Coody]

One more variable.... I don’t think that there is a secret tension across the board for all guns or loads. I could be wrong but I View it more in a catagory below seating depth and charge. Hard to directly test for it as a primary variable though especially considering the results could range from no change to being the difference maker. As stated on here many times if I remember short range they go loose and let the lands push back on the bullet and long range shooters go with something more tight yet very consistent. I’ve had luck with both almost tight and very loose in the same gun with different loads.

i would say like most things in shooting consistent neck tension is a key variable. consistent neck tension is hard to measure. most would be surprised how much variation they have. closest way i have found to measure it is with the 21st century hydro press and in line seating dies. consistent seating pressure correlates to consistent neck tension. of course there are many other variables effecting that seating effort that have to be controlled. condition of the inside of the neck, carbon in neck, lubed, clean/new brass, times fired since annealing. but when you get it right and consistently hit the same seating effort numbers you will see it on the target.

as for concentricity, i use that as an indicator as to how well my reloading process is working. if i see a problem, several over .003, i start looking for the cause and fix it. never would attempt to straighten a loaded round.

 

[johara1]

Trying to bend them to get concentricity you loose neck tension because you only have .0005 spring back. You lost everything..... jim

 

[denobravo]

NECK TENSION !!! sweat the details !!
clean necks, NO CARBON, turned necks and annealed every time, then with a competition seating die concentricity is almost non existent
yes neck tension is huge and how much is the question. Ive tried .004 and went back to .002 and lighhter seems better, but all barrels talk and will tell you.
I believe John Whiddon soft seats with about.001 or less I forget

 

[dkhunt14]

One more variable.... I don’t think that there is a secret tension across the board for all guns or loads. I could be wrong but I View it more in a catagory below seating depth and charge. Hard to directly test for it as a primary variable though especially considering the results could range from no change to being the difference maker. As stated on here many times if I remember short range they go loose and let the lands push back on the bullet and long range shooters go with something more tight yet very consistent. I’ve had luck with both almost tight and very loose in the same gun with different loads.

Yes different neck tensions can make a gun more accurate or less. The thing is they need to be the same from case to case. Matt

 

[natdscott]

Unless you got a lot of eccentricity dont worry about it. Once you get good dies and prove them your concentricity checker will gather dust

I know it's not my thread, but if you don't mind, what do you consider "a lot" of eccentricity?

 

[ngb1787]

I agree that neck tension is important. How are you measuring your neck tension? Do you use expander mandrels to get the target neck tension? How many and what tension groups do you sort? Do you shoot at 500+ yds? Always looking for ways to improve.
Sprague

Yes i use mandrels everytime and i also anneal. Also use a hydro press. Shooting generally 600-1000yds. It seems annealing very much help keep elasticity of brass more consistent and of course mandrels are a must. I know this sounds redundant but learning how to read the wind means everything also, none of this matters if you cant read the wind.

 

[Milo 2.0]

Neck tension consistently is just as important as a powder charge. A tighter than avg neck tension causes higher pressures, minimal but very noticeable on paper.

Darrin

I bring a good share of loads in by adding neck tension. If for no reason other than now seating force becomes more consistent. I have no way of measuring the pressure aspect other than telltale signs, but I can measure group size and it works for me.
I have the 21st Century gauge, I keep it for friends curiosity, because guys like to blame things non existent.

 

[dkhunt14]

I bring a good share of loads in by adding neck tension. If for no reason other than now seating force becomes more consistent. I have no way of measuring the pressure aspect other than telltale signs, but I can measure group size and it works for me.
I have the 21st Century gauge, I keep it for friends curiosity, because guys like to blame things non existent.

I agree, the paper never lies. Matt