Neck sizing only......after annealing

[LHSmith]

You can have & use custom body dies just the same.
Then use separate neck bushing followed by expander mandrel to push thickness variance outward. And with this, you can avoid FL sizing of necks, which IMO should always be avoided.

With most factory hunting cartridges, FL sizing needs are well established as needed.
For more modern/improved cartridges, FL sizing is often not needed.
Some would suggest that you might as well go ahead and FL size then.

Ideally I would prefer zero sizing -ever. Otherwise, I prefer minimal sizing. So I choose my cartridges and chambers with this as part of a plan, and am successful with minimal sizing. I do not FL size.
The closest I get to zero sizing right now is with a fitted chamber in 26wssm Imp. I'm on my 3rd barrel with this, same 50 cases, no neck sizing or body sizing needed. Only a shoulder bumps every other reloading due to 35deg shoulders. Had I gone to 40 or 45deg, I would be at zero sizing. The advantages; no need for trimming, so my matched H20 capacities remain so, no dimensional changes, so no pockets opening, so these cases will last beyond my lifetime. No neck sizing means no hardening and no need to anneal or manage otherwise for exact same neck tension.
My load with this cartridge, which holds same capacity as a 260AI, is right at SAAMI max(per QL), giving me 3025fps w/139Laps, from 28" barrels. That's 47.4gr IMR4350.

With my next barrel I am going to pull shoulder back a bit and go to 45deg (for same capacity) and see if I can achieve zero sizing.
Outta be fun

I don't think you can equate sizing WSSM brass with "normal" brass......WSSM's are a different animal.......hopefully headed for extinction.
Again, if one loads light to medium pressures, NS will work OK. If you venture into the high pressure loads ( where the best accuracy lies IMO) then the results will be NFG. I am not into plinking, so it's FL sizing only for me.

 

[searcher]

lhsmith stated an important note; whether loading mild or hot. I got pretty tired of always doing something to maintain the brass on my target rifles when neck sizing. If one loads on the light side, one can go a long time without having to run through a body or sizing die though. Getting semi-custom full-length sizing dies has worked really well for me - and I'm not going back. That said, I have no issues with neck sizing in general and still do so in most of my hunting rifles. I readily neck-size in half of my bolt hunting rifles. If I had semi-custom full-length dies on hand for all of them - I'd retire the neck dies for sure. It is using factory full-length sizing dies that irks my being. They oversize, overwork and dramatically cut the life of the brass. But for the casual hunting rifle, that gets used a few times a year plus a few practice sessions - who cares?

 

[grovey]

Neck sizing after the 1st firing probably wouldn't be such a bad thing if the brass grows more after 2 firings. My concern is what happens to that consistent neck sized load when you finally bump the shoulder back after 4 or 5 firings? Seems like that lot would be sub par .

 

[Richard Coody]

to each

Neck sizing after the 1st firing probably wouldn't be such a bad thing if the brass grows more after 2 firings. My concern is what happens to that consistent neck sized load when you finally bump the shoulder back after 4 or 5 firings? Seems like that lot would be sub par .

to each his own
what i have found in the accuracy game is consistency is the key to everything. personally i want that brass the same every time i load it.

 

[mikecr]

Well you're going to be bumping shoulders, and neck sizing, with every FL sizing. Right?
And typically, you would size even more than that(if FL sizing). Right?
In what way is it that more & more sizing equates to consistency?
Trimming away at cases, and replacing those with loosening pockets.. Is that consistency?
You think FL sizing of necks, bringing donut/shoulder into neck tension, gets you consistent tension?

I agree that the best potentials are very high in pressure, with many well designed cartridges(not something like a 30-06).
After all, diminished returns in pressure peak also means diminished variances of it.
This is fastest powder that fills the case, while still producing low muzzle pressures(like any underbore does).

My prior point is that it is completely possible to plan a chamber with minimal sizing needs. IMO is completely possible to do it with any rational pressure, including those at competitive 6PPC levels(~75-80Kpsi),(with a tiny little case like that).
Key word is PLAN.
If you can't manage minimal sizing, as partial neck & 1thou bumping represents, then you just didn't plan to do that.

To do this with best brass -lasting forever, you need:
-Enough barrel steel around the chamber area to support the objective. Could mean a magnum diameter tenon.
-You need extended breach support provided by a cone.
-You need a well 'improved' case design with low body taper high shoulder angle(like a Dasher or AI)
-You need to measure a big lot of new brass on hand and fill out the reamer print fitted to it. No more sloppy clearances to cause currently accepted case yielding near webs, because once that happens, even once, you failed to meet this objective.

Since you're planning here, it helps to choose the right bullet(the very beginning of it all) and most efficient capacity with available powders for that bullet, that would not give up anything to a competing field of choices.

If you wanted the efficiency of a 26wssm Imp, for example, you could very nearly do it with a 260AI(matching capacity) & Lapua cases, ~140gr bullets, ~65Kpsi load. Just read this post until you understand that you're not going to reach this successfully by doing what most FL sizing reloaders do, which is reacting, instead of pre-acting..

 

[Dusty Stevens]

Well you're going to be bumping shoulders, and neck sizing, with every FL sizing. Right?
And typically, you would size even more than that(if FL sizing). Right?
In what way is it that more & more sizing equates to consistency?
Trimming away at cases, and replacing those with loosening pockets.. Is that consistency?
You think FL sizing of necks, bringing donut/shoulder into neck tension, gets you consistent tension?

I agree that the best potentials are very high in pressure, with many well designed cartridges(not something like a 30-06).
After all, diminished returns in pressure peak also means diminished variances of it.
This is fastest powder that fills the case, while still producing low muzzle pressures(like any underbore does).

My prior point is that it is completely possible to plan a chamber with minimal sizing needs. IMO is completely possible to do it with any rational pressure, including those at competitive 6PPC levels(~75-80Kpsi),(with a tiny little case like that).
Key word is PLAN.
If you can't manage minimal sizing, as partial neck & 1thou bumping represents, then you just didn't plan to do that.

To do this with best brass -lasting forever, you need:
-Enough barrel steel around the chamber area to support the objective. Could mean a magnum diameter tenon.
-You need extended breach support provided by a cone.
-You need a well 'improved' case design with low body taper high shoulder angle(like a Dasher or AI)
-You need to measure a big lot of new brass on hand and fill out the reamer print fitted to it. No more sloppy clearances to cause currently accepted case yielding near webs, because once that happens, even once, you failed to meet this objective.

Since you're planning here, it helps to choose the right bullet(the very beginning of it all) and most efficient capacity with available powders for that bullet, that would not give up anything to a competing field of choices.

If you wanted the efficiency of a 26wssm Imp, for example, you could very nearly do it with a 260AI(matching capacity) & Lapua cases, ~140gr bullets, ~65Kpsi load. Just read this post until you understand that you're not going to reach this successfully by doing what most FL sizing reloaders do, which is reacting, instead of pre-acting..

Sounds like you got it figured out. Wanna share your reamer print?

 

[mikecr]

Sure

 

[Rhed]

I anneal after every firing. Wet tumble, annneal, then FL and neck size with Redding type S FL bushing die.

 

[dcali]

There are two kinds of people who only neck size. Those who have gotten a case stuck in the chamber, and those who will.

FL size and be done with. Save yourself the cost of a die and a future headache.

 

[LHSmith]

There are two kinds of people who only neck size. Those who have gotten a case stuck in the chamber, and those who will.

FL size and be done with. Save yourself the cost of a die and a future headache.

And don't forget needless galling of the cocking cam.

 

[CharlieNC]

For my 223 load work, I neck size only with Lee collet die. Brass does not grow, run out is .0015 or less, and I seldom need to anneal. Group size seems to indicate I'm doing it right.

Also my experience on 223 only. I anneal and measure headspace after each firing, and it does not change until after approx 4 firings. If I were to follow the bump back .002 every time guideline, then the brass would continually get shorter instead of fitting the chamber correctly (I know the "0" chamber headspace dimension as the ultimate reference). After approx 4 firings I will find the brass has grown after LCD sizing only; then I FL size and trim. And then the headspace is not as consistent as when LCD sized only. I have checked accuracy both ways and there is no difference in methods for my 223. My other larger calibers are a different story and are FL sized every time, since they grow after each firing.

 

[LHSmith]

I wonder if the FL die was custom sized to your chamber if the results would be different?

 

[CharlieNC]

I wonder if the FL die was custom sized to your chamber if the results would be different?

It might change a bit. But I tend to think a lot of it is particular to the 223 since the HS measurement on all the fired brass is very consistent and unchanged. That is until around 4 firings when it grows in the manner normal to larger calibers.

 

[Bart B.]

I wonder if the FL die was custom sized to your chamber if the results would be different?

A thrice fired case would be better. Plus your bullet held in its neck.

Then a FL die could be made to minimally sized the case for best accuracy and long case life.