Turbulent Turtle
F-TR competitor
Understood. I was really replying to Nk but could not resist the smile. I'm weak, I know. 
Neck Sizing and Bushings
- Thread starter savageshooter86
- Start date
Also to the other guys viewing this, I am not too concerned with run out as seems it doesn't make a difference on paper as I was told by someone who definitely knows his stuff and how to shoot. He purposely shot rounds with near perfect "zero" run out and then some that had almost 8 thous. He saw no difference on paper on a 1000 yard target. And he shoots a hell of a lot better than I could ever shoot so I don't see a reason to lose sleep over a couple thous run out
BoydAllen
Gold $$ Contributor
With some seating depths, and throat configurations, rounds are straightened quite a bit as they are chambered, I have checked this. Neck tension is also a factor. On the other hand, with others they may not be. The chances are that your friend's rounds straightened quite a lot as they were chambered, but if he did not pull one and check it, we will never know. I think that totally disregarding ammo straightness, without doing some careful testing with the individual rifle is a mistake.
I agree 100% with Boyd on the LEE collett die. Your head will say it don't feel right, but the bullets don't complain!
When I switched to 6BRX, I bought the expensive custom full length sizing die to be used with bushings and the precision bullet seater. I got 3 nitride bushings and away I went. By the way, I use a LEE Classic press with the breech locks.
I couldn't get the 0.001 neck set-back like I wanted to same my life! I tried shims and everything I could think of and ended up doing it open-loop letting the press maximum travel be the determining item. I still had more variation in set back than I wanted! Then I noticed that by turning the breech lock sleeve the allowed range of the spring loaded locating pin, I had a few thou variation! Well, I and my friend/mentor in Australia finally settled on making shims to put on the top of the shell holder to limit engagement... no Problem.
BUT! I am still getting better performance with the cheap old LEE collet die! And it pretty much makes rounds with little or no wobble and the mandrel keeps things aligned as long as your bullet seater does its part.
When I switched to 6BRX, I bought the expensive custom full length sizing die to be used with bushings and the precision bullet seater. I got 3 nitride bushings and away I went. By the way, I use a LEE Classic press with the breech locks.
I couldn't get the 0.001 neck set-back like I wanted to same my life! I tried shims and everything I could think of and ended up doing it open-loop letting the press maximum travel be the determining item. I still had more variation in set back than I wanted! Then I noticed that by turning the breech lock sleeve the allowed range of the spring loaded locating pin, I had a few thou variation! Well, I and my friend/mentor in Australia finally settled on making shims to put on the top of the shell holder to limit engagement... no Problem.
BUT! I am still getting better performance with the cheap old LEE collet die! And it pretty much makes rounds with little or no wobble and the mandrel keeps things aligned as long as your bullet seater does its part.
BoydAllen
Gold $$ Contributor
We all get to do it the way that we want, but for chambers that allow necks to expand quite a bit, floating bushings are probably not going to be as good as a FL die with a honed out neck, or a collet die in combination with a body die (in that order) This is not to say that I am opposed to bushing dies, but with big chambers, and/or unturned necks you may want to try the lee and body route. The good news is that it is inexpensive. For a press seater, either of the Forster versions should work fine. The difference is convenience. One more thing that may interest the bushing dies and unturned crowd is that I believe that John Whidden offers expanders in different diameters, that you can pair with a bushing that only gives a slight feel as the expander passes through the neck, and does not cause an increase in runout. For unturned necks, this gives a rounder more uniform neck ID and bullet pull.
too bad can't get any bushings now!!!!l! Only one I see that I would need is the 339 size 
savageshooter86 said:too bad can't get any bushings now!!!!l! Only one I see that I would need is the 339 size
Have you tried Gunstop? I buy most of my dies and stuff from them and they don't charge you an arm and a leg for shipping. I always pick Priority Mail and have my order within two or three days max.
Boyd I am in search of a 334 and 333
I checked there. Out of stock until like November is what the expected arrival date was. Looking for the TN bushings
I sized my brass tonight with the std collet die mandrel and then bumped shoulder back 2 thous using Redding body die. Will see how it shoots.
But was going to get the bushings to try them out to to see which I feel is better
I sized my brass tonight with the std collet die mandrel and then bumped shoulder back 2 thous using Redding body die. Will see how it shoots.
But was going to get the bushings to try them out to to see which I feel is better
BoydAllen
Gold $$ Contributor
I am not all that impressed with TN. I mostly use Wilson. Recently I was given some coated RCBS to test and they work fine. I would imagine that their uncoated ones would be OK as well. Midway has a lot of those. Once I had a Wilson that was rough. I rigged up a way to polish it and it was fine from that point on. For my most serious work I have a carbide bushing that is head and shoulders above the rest but you would have to have a very good ppc to see the difference on paper, and maybe then not.
I can't remember, I know Redding for sure, what bushings need to be used in Whidden FL bushing dies. That is what I have. IIRC it is Wilson
I've found 0 differences in run out by doing body die first then lee collet or vice versa. Decided to test it anyway to see if the differences would show on paper. Loaded 44 bullets bullets for the last match with collet die first then body die and 22 body die first then collet. Shot my highest score of the match on the last string ( in the worst wind) with the bullets that were body die then collet. Salazar's testing was done with fl and neck bushing dies which operate nothing like a collet die.
BoydAllen said:
308
BoydAllen
Gold $$ Contributor
I don't know if it was a difference in case shape or dies, but when I did the test doing the collet die first showed a slight advantage in runout, but I think that the smart move it to test for your situation (as you have done) and be guided strictly by the results.
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