My 180gn Hybrids wont shoot jumped into lands

[1KBR]

I have been trying the 180gn Hybrids which work very well jammed .015-.020" into the lands, but cant get them to work jumping at all in my 7RSAUM. (anywhere from .080" jump to touching) I was hoping to get them working jumping as everyone says so that I dont have to worry about pulling a loaded round from the chamber. Has anyone else found their Hybrids prefer to be jammed?
Powder is H1000sc, primers are 215Ms .003" neck tension.What depth are you seating yours to??

 

[rifleman700]

My 180gn Hybrids wont shoot jammed into lands

Keep going in .020 - .030" increments, you will find a sweet spot. Yes, you will take up powder space so you may have to switch powders but they will shoot - jumped. My 7STW jumps .150" if I remember right.

 

[1KBR]

My 180gn Hybrids wont shoot jammed into lands

With any more than about .100" jump, the boattail/shank junction goes down below the neck. Rifleman 700, how fast are you pushing them in the STW? Not sure of what speed they start coming apart.

 

[Erik Cortina]

My 180gn Hybrids wont shoot jammed into lands

I have been trying the 180gn Hybrids which work very well jammed .015-.020" into the lands, but cant get them to work jumping at all in my 7RSAUM. (anywhere from .080" jump to touching) I was hoping to get them working jumping as everyone says so that I dont have to worry about pulling a loaded round from the chamber. Has anyone else found their Hybrids prefer to be jammed?
Powder is H1000sc, primers are 215Ms .003" neck tension.What depth are you seating yours to??

Who cares what "everyone says"?

Here's what you do.

1. Make a dummy round, (no powder or primer) with bullet seated to be .015" - .020" in the lands.
2. Chamber round and close bolt.
3. Open bolt and extract round.
4. If bullet is still in the case measure the round again, if the seating depth is the same as when you chambered it then you are good to go.
5. If bullet is stuck in the lands, then add more neck tension and tune again.

 

[wooger]

My 180gn Hybrids wont shoot jammed into lands

Now thats a no bs reply right there!

 

[fullersson]

My 180gn Hybrids wont shoot jammed into lands

+1 for Erik. IMO you should at least try to extract a shell that has been jammed into the lands to see if the bullet sticks or not. The bullet sticking has a lot to do with the reamer that was used to cut the chamber and neck tension also. I jam the lands and don't have any trouble removing a shell but I have had some chambers that wouldn't allow you to remove the shell. Give it a try and see. Brian Brown.

 

[1KBR]

My 180gn Hybrids wont shoot jammed into lands

Erik, I have only had 1 projectile stick in the case, but prefer them off, so that there is no risk if I decide to pull a round while waiting for a change. Also, trying to keep the pressure down so I can get to the high node.
Also, going up in neck tension doesnt seem to increase bullet grip and I have gone up to .004 and .005 neck tension. I will continue to shoot these bullets jammed as it is what it likes, but I was hoping they would shoot jumping in my particular chamber/barrel/case combination.

 

[pmarauder]

My 180gn Hybrids wont shoot jammed into lands

Your Heading says that the Hybrids wont shoot "jammed", but then your post says that they wont shoot jumped. Either way, I will try and give some input on what i have found works. First, I am shooting Both the 7SAUM (.101FB) and the 7STW (.188FB) w/ the 180 Hybrid. I played around with the H1000 in my SAUM for over 200 rounds trying to get that combo to shoot,. I just couldn't get the accuracy i wanted out of it. and, it was crunching the powder pretty good at 64 to 65 grains. I switched to H4831 sc and Wow, what i difference. From 60.6 to 61.2 I shot (4) 4 shot groups @ 200 and all groups were under .25 MOA Speeds were from 2975 up to 3025 and very low ES. (30" Broughton)
On my STW, I am using H-1000, but just started working up loads on my new 28" Krieger. only 35 rounds down the tube. Seems ok so far @200 yards. around 3140 FPS w/ pretty low ES and just under an .75" CTC (3shot group)
Seating depth on both are at .010 jumped
To determine the seating depth, i use a dummy round and a sharpie pen. I color the bullet where it will index the rifling and chamber and close the bolt. extract it making sure it will clear the action port. Look at the bullet through 10x loops. Look for the rifling marks on the bullet...... if you see them, seat the bullet another .005 and repeat the process. I clean the bullet between each depth change using steel wool and re-color the bullet with fresh ink.

 

[expiper]

My 180gn Hybrids wont shoot jammed into lands

Which ever way they DO work....keep on doin that!!!....ahhahah...These guns talk to us...we gota be smart enuff to "listen".....we WANT a certain bullet-powder-primer-jam-jump to work and MABY the gun doesnt like it!...........Roger

 

[1KBR]

Pmarauder.
Your right, I have changed the header.
I do have a very good H4831sc (60.6gns) load as well, at @ 2950 fps, it too likes the bullets jammed.
I have been playing with H1000 trying to get up to the next node but am getting too much pressure. Like Expiper says, my gun is telling me it loves to be shot jammed at 2950 fps, I,m just trying to convince it that she prefers to be jumped at 3050 fps???????

 

[pmarauder]

Im not sure on your length of barrel...... but i can easily get 3000 fps w/ 61g of H4831sc and very little pressure signs. I wouldnt obsess over the upper node w/ H1000 and the 3050 mark. I dont think its going to happen anyway. Also, if its Drop and Drift your concerned about at distance..... Just trim the meplats and point them back up. That is where you gain your best consistancy with these bullets. By doing that, It should give you a BC of .700 if not a bit more. 2950 fps and a BC of .7 will beat out the 3050 fps (standard bullet) at distance anyway.
Remember.... they dont give out trophys for highest muzzle velocity.......

 

[sailhertoo]

My barrel seems to like .010 + off the lands. 31-1/2" Bartline. I'm useing the same powder you are.

But I think the chamber reamer has alot to do with where the bullets like to be seated.

 

[dragman]

My 180gn Hybrids wont shoot jammed into lands

I have been trying the 180gn Hybrids which work very well jammed .015-.020" into the lands, but cant get them to work jumping at all in my 7RSAUM. (anywhere from .080" jump to touching) I was hoping to get them working jumping as everyone says so that I dont have to worry about pulling a loaded round from the chamber. Has anyone else found their Hybrids prefer to be jammed?
Powder is H1000sc, primers are 215Ms .003" neck tension.What depth are you seating yours to??

Who cares what "everyone says"?

Here's what you do.

1. Make a dummy round, (no powder or primer) with bullet seated to be .015" - .020" in the lands.
2. Chamber round and close bolt.
3. Open bolt and extract round.
4. If bullet is still in the case measure the round again, if the seating depth is the same as when you chambered it then you are good to go.
5. If bullet is stuck in the lands, then add more neck tension and tune again.

This is what I do and it has worked well in everything for me from a 22-250AI - my .284 WIN.

 

[glo]

WAY NOT ENOUGH INFO, and confusing at best. What Hybrid are you talking about? Is the rifle stock or custom. What work (receiver trued, bolt face trued, lugs lapped, etc...) has been done to the action and or barrel.

No one bullet style has a set seating off or into the lands. Every rifle has its own preference for bullets. Some hybrids work better into the lands some need a jump. Same with a standard 6 to 8 diameter radius ogive. And straight secant ogive bullets are a whole different story.

Give us some specifics: Details , Details , Details!!!

 

[1KBR]

Glo. This barrel is in a Stiller Python, 30.5" barrel, 9" twist 1.20" at muzzle. It is throated so that the boattail/shank junction of the Berger 180gn Hybrids is about .060" infront of the neck/shoulder junction.
Every rifle I used the 180VLDs in (284, 7RSAUM,7mm/300WSM) has prefered the bullets jammed .015" and its seems the Hybrids did in this barrel.
I tried it jumping today with H4831sc, and it did OK, maybe just need to tune the powder weight. Definitley couldnt get it to work jumped with H1000, maybe this powder needs to build pressure first before it will get low ES/SD????

 

[Shynloco]

1KBR,
Sounds like you are on track with the powder adjustment. But something glo says (IMO) is absolutely correct and that is that every rifle likes or dislikes certain bullets. I too have been having a "field day" trying to get one of my rifles to shooting using a specific bullet that others, using the same bullet, have fantastic results with. So far neither jamming the bullet (using several methods suggested above) or seating the bullet to jump (or SAMMI specs) will shoot worth a darn. and that after trying five different powders known to work in other rifles very well. I've got one more session of testing and if the results don't improve (and I doubt they can get any worse), I'm done with these bullets and its time to go back to what works and the bullet I know performs well in this particular rifle. Hope your's work up to your expectations.

 

[1KBR]

and that after trying five different powders known to work in other rifles very well.



5 Different powders, you are more persistant than me. Yep, you are right, some barrels prefer some bullets and thats it. Since I had luck with the slower load of h4831sc (2960 fps) and Hybrids jumped .010", I will work with it. No doubt I will be after another barrel next year, I will see if it works at the high node with H1000?

 

[expiper]

one thing I hav found with the 180 class bullets is that if you get them to work one day and then some time later they dont work,,,I suspect your twist rate.....these bullets are marginaly stabalized with 9 twis (I know-I know) no matter what the charts and tables say....I think the trik to them shooting no matter what the temp/elev/vel/etc is 8 twist....Roger

 

[1KBR]

Expiper, the best barrel I have ever had with 180s has been 8" twist, and the most consistant bullet I have used in 9" twists is the 168gn. Might be the cooler weather (denser air) here. I wouldnt mind getting an 8.5 next.

 

[expiper]

why not go to 8 twist and not worry about any bullet in any weather or alt.....????...I have shot 150 SMK tht I had layin around rustin up at 600...mmmmm .....Roger