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more .45-70 Q&A

Hey fellas,thanx for the replies,I was wondering if my posts were getting through there for a while. These are valid points and I will look into his twist rate.A bit of history,he just picked up the rifle and his first loads were Hornady 325 FTX factory.I then loaded him a box of 300 gr TSX (I was surprised at the "openness" of that particular tip an am amazed that they fly at all). But he loved them and recovered some bullets,they REALLY expand.He is one of those guys who will not be satisfied till he shoots the biggest bullet possible from that rifle. So we are working our way up to the 535 handcast bullets.So , all that said,he has provided me with brass and a box of these 450gr TSX,but data,(charge,powder and coal) is elusive. I am not actually a fan of pushing these Barnes multiple canellure bullets.I shoot them in my .308 Norma mag and find that you really have to lean on the press to seat them,and with the .45-70 they even want to bulge the case a bit.The 300gr loads (IMR 3031) are a compressed load,found that out right away.But,long story short,they all chambered and fired well,he was happy.As for different bullets,I do appreciate the options you have provided me and will inquire,but out here in the sticks we are at the mercy of our local gun shop and basically take what we can get off his shelves,usually quite paltry pickins.If you guys have access to some data for the 450gr I would love to give them a try and see what they do,not to mention that he is chomping at the bit too.lol. Well,I have long day of high elevation Mule deer hunting tomorrow,so lots of prep today.Thans guys,cheers.........Paul.
 
I have an article about the 45-70 at 1 mile. It was a military trial and after several attempts the guy hit the 2 inch pine backer with it and it supposedly went through it. A 535 grain bullet out of a 45-70 in a modern gun with higher pressure can do it but 535 is too heavy without a lot of holdover. I would think a 350 bullet would be much wiser in my opinion. Jacketed of course or cast I suppose but you cant drive cast bullets too fast without heavy bore leading.
 
I'm not familiar with the 450gr TSX bullet; it may be a 458 WM bullet and if it is it will not work well in a 45-70. You won't be able to get the velocities that it wants to operate. Bullets designed for the 458WM are not good for the 45-70. Get a Lyman 49th edition, there are three sections in there on 45-70s. If you are loading for a lever gun it's more limiting than for a Ruger #1 or a Highwall. They aren't as strong. Get the manual.



There is an auditorium of extra capacity in a 45-70 case when shooting smokeless. It was designed for 70gr of "Holy Black" and typically a 405 cast bullet, that got velocities in the 1200 to 1400FPS range, and over 2 feet of drop at 200 yards from a 100 yard zero. You are probably lucky to get much over 75% fill with Ruger #1 max loads with smokeless. Oh, and by the way, if you load up a batch of 350s at 2400FPS in that light weight gun he'll get over that wanting more, at least while the bruises heal. Ask me how I know?





(regarding the long range comment above, depending on the bullet design it takes 175 to 225 MOA from a 100 yard zero to get a cast 535 to 1000 yards.
 
If I may humbly suggest, you are not at the mercy of local bullet choices as long as there is an internet connection for you to use. Shipping cost is off-set by finding the best deal (always lower than full retail).
 
A 405 hard cast should be all you need for anything on this continent.
A couple weeks ago I was shooting my buddy's #3 in 45-70 with 405's and it kicked like a beast. Granted that's a very lite rifle but out to 200yrds. I wouldn't hesitate to take a shot on anything walking.
 
jonbearman said:
I have an article about the 45-70 at 1 mile. It was a military trial and after several attempts the guy hit the 2 inch pine backer with it and it supposedly went through it. A 535 grain bullet out of a 45-70 in a modern gun with higher pressure can do it but 535 is too heavy without a lot of holdover. I would think a 350 bullet would be much wiser in my opinion. Jacketed of course or cast I suppose but you cant drive cast bullets too fast without heavy bore leading.


http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/843705/posts
 
Cheap870 said:
A 405 hard cast should be all you need for anything on this continent.
A couple weeks ago I was shooting my buddy's #3 in 45-70 with 405's and it kicked like a beast. Granted that's a very lite rifle but out to 200yrds. I wouldn't hesitate to take a shot on anything walking.

The #3 may be the worst idea in history in a 45-70. That stock profile and the recoil of a big bore is just plain bad for your shooing and your shoulder. On the other hand, they can be picked up pretty cheap and the idea of re-barreling the action and dropping it into a stock from Treebone haunts me regularly.
 
FWIW. I cast my own bullets for my 45/70 Marlin 1895 Guide Gun. 310 grn. bullet. That's all the abuse my shoulder wants. The 5 deer and 1 bear didn't know if they were hit with a 300 grn bullet or a 400 grn. bullet. DRT
 
I gave up on the 405's and just about anything heavier than 300 gr. in my guide gun--I am too old to take the abuse and the bruising takes a week to go away.
Like others have said, the deer I shot with the 300's never took another step.

Find a 300 gr load moving around 1800 fps and enjoy it, I promise you just about anything in N. America will never know the difference.

Gary
 
I have two molds...a Lyman 405fb and an old ideal 413?? Semi spritzer mold...wheel weight lead slugs will work...I know longer care to go above trapdoor loads...since I have vintage and a Browning. Never shot a marlin...and if I was to buy one it would be the long barrel.
 

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