Mid range AR tactical, who's tried it ?

[memilanuk]

The rifle in which I shoot the 80.5 mentioned above also happens to shoot extremely well with the FGMM 77 commercial load. Having shot both loads many times at 300-600 yd, I can tell you there is a night and day difference in wind deflection just by moving up to the 80.5 bullet. When the wind comes up, shooting the 77s at 600 yd is more like shooting a precision shotgun.

But... will seating the 80.5 short to feed from a magazine eat up enough case volume to where it loses that edge?

 

[Ned Ludd]

The load I developed with the 80.5s was for a 26" barreled F-TR bolt rifle I really had setup as a "trainer". At the time I initially ordered the build, I wasn't reloading, and so didn't specify a specific chamber or buy a specific reamer. The end result was that the rifle had zero, repeat zero, freebore. It shoots FGMM77s like nobody's business, as I mentioned. But at the 600 yd practice ranges I frequented in CA, 10-15 mph winds were the norm and the 77s just weren't cutting it at 600 yd. In order to get the 80.5s moving in the [relatively] short barrel and with the nonexistent freebore, I ended up using H322, which is a slightly faster powder than I would normally choose for the 80.5s. As you might imagine, the bullets are sunk pretty far down in the neck, but the load runs at ~2860 fps from the 26" barrel and is sickeningly accurate/precise. I have at least 5 firings on the brass and it is still going strong. So even though the reloading approach I used is far from what I would consider "optimal", in this particular case it has worked very well. I can easily imagine some adaptation of it would be effective for loading the 80.5 to feed from a mag for use in this competition class. I have a Sig556 DMR that I've considered for use for this purpose, but haven't actually gotten around to doing any load development as yet.

 

[WindSurgeon]

Rule 3.3.3 G reads as follows...

Magazine – Standard 10-, 20-, or 30-round magazines must be used. Reduced capacity magazines and “sleds” are prohibited. Magazine may not be used for support and may not touch the ground during firing or recoil.

So, that would not allow your single loading of your 90 grain ammo (unless you can keep it magazine length). This configuration of competition is to simulate tactical firing as stated in rule 3.3.3 K:

Interpretive Intent – It is the intent of this rule that this semi-automatic rifle and the equipment used therewith most closely resemble the semi-automatic tactical rifles and equipment issued to and sometimes used by U.S. Military and U.S. Law Enforcement in tactical situations at the distances utilized in standard NRA Mid-Range Prone competition. This is not meant to be another form of F-Class competition. Rifles and equipment designed specifically for competitive shooting applications are generally outside the spirit and intent of this rule.

Thanks!

 

[DR1586]

I love it when folks talk about how bad the 75/77 he Bullets are at 600yds. For those looking to try your hand at highpower through this mid-range tactical class do yourself a favor and load up a good 75/77gr load at mag length and spend your time practicing rather than messing with loads.

Do the 80s buck the wind better? Sure. Do the 75/77's move 3 targets over in a 3mph wind? Hell no. Learn to read the wind and you'll be fine. No reason not to clean the 600yd target with a bipod and 12x scope.

 

[Berger.Fan222]

I love it when folks talk about how bad the 75/77 he Bullets are at 600yds. For those looking to try your hand at highpower through this mid-range tactical class do yourself a favor and load up a good 75/77gr load at mag length and spend your time practicing rather than messing with loads.

Do the 80s buck the wind better? Sure. Do the 75/77's move 3 targets over in a 3mph wind? Hell no. Learn to read the wind and you'll be fine. No reason not to clean the 600yd target with a bipod and 12x scope.

The benefits of the 80+ grain bullets are more needed with the 3" X ring and the 6" 10 ring on the F-Class target.

Less wind drift is not as important with the 6" X ring and the 12" 10 ring on the AR Tactical (standard high power) target.

 

[Ned Ludd]

Exactly, it works both ways. I love it when folks that get to use a 1 MOA ring X-ring tell me how great the 75s/77s are at 600 yd. I simply have a slightly different perspective. Regardless of the discipline or the size of the target rings, the fact is that anyone that can manage to get an 80.5 load working is going to have a huge advantage over someone shooting 75s/77s, it's that simple. That means someone is certainly going to try doing exactly that for this AR Tactical Class.

When feelers were initially put out at this forum to get feedback on this new Class of competition, I was an advocate for a rule specifying the use of factory loads, but that apparently wasn't favored by those in charge. It's my thought that in a Class such as this that is specifically targeted toward getting a new and more diverse group of shooters involved in competition, anything that prevents or minimizes attempts to "game" the system and thus gain an advantage should be discouraged specifically in the rules. However, sooner or later someone will always try to find a way around the limitations. The advantage usually doesn't last for long as others figure out what was done and copy it, but that will typically lead to the kind of "arms race" we see in other disciplines. I have a setup that would be well-suited for this type of match, but as far as I know, it has not yet caught on in my area. If it does, I will likely use the Hornady 75 gr BTHP Superformance commercial load, as it seems to shoot very well in this rifle.

 

[Erud]

Unless I'm mistaken, I don't think this class is limited to .223. If someone wants the maximum possible advantage, they won't even worry about the 75/77 vs 80/80.5 decision. A 6mm Fat Rat or Turbo 40° will get 105 hybrids going 2800, and still fit in a magazine just fine.

 

[Ned Ludd]

It's not limited to .223, and you're right, those with better ballistic caliber rifles will enjoy a significant advantage. Although I'm sure the numbers have increased in recent years, as a guess there are probably still a LOT more people already having .223s that fit the requirements, possibly even more than all the other calibers combined. Plus, not everyone will modify or purchase a completely new setup in order to switch caliber. It may be that the rules for this discipline are modified as time goes on to reflect these issues, who knows?