Meplat trimming and Bullet pointing

[Rock Knocker]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

Great info.

I am saving up for a scale and have to do more load testing, ive got my 260 shooting ok with Noslers and R19. But i really have to do some more shooting before i get too caught up in this.

I am intrigued by the idea of just trying A-Maxs first. Im shooting a 6.5mm in a 8 twist and the 140g Amaxs recomend a 7.5 twist or better, but ive heard different.

 

[mikecr]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

Latigo, None of your shown tools are Wilson.
They're Hoover

 

[zfk55]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

Thanks Mike. That was pretty dumb. :-\ I had my trimmer on my mind because the pictures in my photobucket reminded me I need to order a new caseholder for the Wilson from Grafs.

I'm a big fan of both Hoover and Wilson. Never vary, never fail.

 

[TonyR]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

Great info.

I am saving up for a scale and have to do more load testing, ive got my 260 shooting ok with Noslers and R19. But i really have to do some more shooting before i get too caught up in this.

I am intrigued by the idea of just trying A-Maxs first. Im shooting a 6.5mm in a 8 twist and the 140g Amaxs recomend a 7.5 twist or better, but ive heard different.

A friend shared the results of some bullet testing research he did a number of years ago. His testing showed that the A-Max bullets had the most uniform BCs of any manufacturer of bullets in every class of bullets tested. They tested every caliber where the A-Max was available against most other bullets available in a similar weight class and the A-Max came out on top for uniformity every time. Not the highest BCs but the most consistent BCs. I will be interested to see if Hornady's new process to make more uniform jackets works out. I just wish that they made a 180 grain 7mm A-Max VLD. I can shoot the 162 but it has to go some much faster and use so much more powder to match the performance of the Berger 180s that I haven't done much more than test them. The 6mm 105 A-Max seems like a viable alternative now that Berger has enlarged the meplats on the VLDs. I'm sure that the 6.5mm 140 A-Max will shoot well.

 

[DennisH]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

You didn't state what sort of shooting you are doing. The results will vary with your application.

If you are a short range benchrester or casual varmint hunter, don't waste your time. If your shooting is 400 yds or less, I think you will not get the benefit of the money and time spent to perform these tasks.

At 600 yds, the results of bullet pointing and trimming are beginning to show up. You can actually see your groups getting more round. Wind drift is worth about half the vertical gain when pointing ( a generalization as caliber will affect the result, bigger bullets benefit less from pointing than small ones).

Once you pass 600 yds, the effect is quantifiable. Just shoot unpointed vs pointed and see how your POI is affected.

I guess a bit more info is needed about your application, caliber and such.

Bob

First, I thank everyone who took the time to give their input into this thread. Second, I have learned more from this thread on this subject (and many more) than anywhere else. This is usually the case and why I posted the question! Again, thanks for your time!

Above Bob stated I needed to post a little more info. I am shooting 600 yds. It's pretty windy when we shoot.

I am shooting my 308 with Berger 155.5's and sometimes 190's!!

I am also shooting my 6.5x47L with 130 Bergers and sometimes 120SMK's.

And 3rd, I am shooting my 6.0x47L with 105 and 108 Bergers, and sometimes 105 Lapua's.

It sounds like a lot, but I have two sons who also shoot with me!

 

[ridgeway]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

One thing nice with the newest version of the Hoover trimmer is the body has a slot milled into the end so it can attach to a pair of calipers and be used as a bullet comparator.

Latigo, does your hoover trimmer have the milled slot? Hard to tell from the picture.

 

[zfk55]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

Yes it does. I'll take another shot when I get time.

Latigo

 

[ridgeway]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

Also, I see the top body of your Hoover die bottoms out on the locking ring. I have the same problem with my press setup as well. I picked up a RCBS Partner press just for pointing and it appears I won't have that problem with this press. Hoover said a revised bullet RAM is in the works to prevent the top half of the die to bottom on the locking ring. Still works fine though.

 

[DaveWhite]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

Correct me if I am wrong, but that appears to be a Hoover point die.

 

[zfk55]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

You're not wrong.

Latigo

 

[PHINPAD]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

If I recall correctly Bryan Litz confirms that the gains are so small that only the top shooters will notice a gain.
I don't doubt that, but to say that only a 1.5 inch gain will be seen suggests that everyone is hand loading to the same high level, which is of course not true.

If I was to turn the theory up side down, would that mean that if I did nothing to my brass between loads, used a powder thrower that was not consistent, used heads in any order and paid scant regard to my COAL, that the size of my groups would only grow by 1.5 inches? I would imagine that it would be much more.

I am definitely not a top shot, but I am prepared to give this a go in an effort to achieve more consistent ammunition, I am thankful for the original post and the time taken by those who replied,

Dave

 

[queen_stick]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

here' something for you to think about...

In 6mm... If you're currently shooting the Berger 105 Target VLD's unpointed, you can get approximately 8 - 10 % BC increase by changing over to the 105 Hunting VLD and trimming/pointing. So, you'll have a significantly increased BC, AND it's uniform.

on the subject of meplat trimming/pointing, here's a good thread on it - http://forum.accurateshooter.com/index.php/topic,3755092.0.html

TonyR and johara1 both offer a wealth of information on the subject, and are more than willing to share their experiences.
Bluto65 saw some negative results when pointing bullets (see the thread link above)

It's an interesting subject, and from what I've gathered, you simply have to try it for your self to determine if it's worth the time/effort. If you don't like it, you can sell the equipment for almost full value.

I had to decide between a scope or the pointing setup... I went with the scope
One of my near-future purchases will be a trimming/pointing setup.... I think I've decided on the Hoover.

 

[nhm16]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

If I recall correctly Bryan Litz confirms that the gains are so small that only the top shooters will notice a gain.

Except for the 7mm 180gr Hybrid, apparently: http://www.appliedballisticsllc.com/index_files/B_7mm_180Hyb.html

 

[DennisH]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

Again, Thanks for all the replies!

It seems many are having sucess with 6mm bullets!

I have read all replies and check the links out in the posts!

One last question: Is it worth trimming and pointing 30cal bullets? 168, 175, and 190 Bergers?

 

[queen_stick]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

zfk55:

did I read your post on the first page correctly? Are you re-cutting the hollow point after timming the meplat? Basically, drilling a new hollow into the meplat prior to pointing?

 

[ridgeway]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

I see about 8-10" of vertical at 1K with trimmed and pointed 107SMK's

 

[Erik Cortina]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

1.5" improvement if I trim and point? In that case I'll trim and point four times to shrink my verticle by 6 inches! ;D

 

[TonyR]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

1.5" improvement if I trim and point? In that case I'll trim and point four times to shrink my verticle by 6 inches! ;D

Better hurry!

 

[TonyR]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

Again, Thanks for all the replies!

It seems many are having sucess with 6mm bullets!

I have read all replies and check the links out in the posts!

One last question: Is it worth trimming and pointing 30cal bullets? 168, 175, and 190 Bergers?

I am still not sure with the 30 cal. I have a friend that has set national records with a 30 using unpointed Bergers but he has decided to try pointing. I am putting a 308 barrel on one of my guns and will do some testing myself. Bryan Litz has said that it helps more with smaller calibers and my experience with 7mms versus 6mms but I would be happy if it just got rid of the occasional flier.

 

[GerryM]

Meplat and Bullet pointing

Heres something else that may interest you. Some people say that Neck turning the brass is not as important in the 30 cal as it is in the smaller cases.
I found this to be false. Neck turning and other small things can and do effect
the 30 cal, I neck turn , neck size the minimum and full size the body,
I use a straight Line seater die by wilson to seat the bullets and keep the run out
under control The 308 shoots way better this way, at least for me.
The bonanza Co ax die with a sleeve works as with others that have the same features. I hope this also helps. Try a few cases and see if it helps your rifle shoot better.