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M1A Reloading

Hello all,

I am a strict Highpower and prone slowfire bolt-gun competitor. Recently I have switched from my AR to an M1A purely for the challenge. The M1A has a GI barrel but I can still shoot into the 750's with it. My problem is this. I was using WIN 308 cases because I had so many. that cases gets alot of abuse from the M1A and i do not use them more than 1 or 2 times. I have a large amount of Lake City match brass i'm goign to start using but i'm also planning to rebarrel soon with a Kreiger match SS barrel with a simlar chamber as my bolt gun,168 to mag length seated to the lands) my questions are:

1. if i go ahead and prep all that brass with a Redding full length, s bushing, small base die, it should be good to work in the new barrel or my exisiting or should i go ahead and rebarrel before next season and prevent sizing confusion? it's easy to size for a GI barrel, not so much matching a LC LR case to a new match chamber.

2. is standard Lake City that much different than the match? minus the primer crimp, and what it was fired in. 7.62 lake city is fairly common, but I dont want to buy a lot fired from a machine gun that is not going to be sized.

Any help to this lengthy post would be great. I don't have many local resources to help me out and the M1A is a lot different than my AR.

Thanks.
 
Mike,
I started HP shooting with an M1A. I enjoy the rifle but you are correct, M1A's are much more challenging than a AR. LC brass, whether Match or not is great stuff, no real difference other than crimp on primer. Be sure your smith has experience with M1A's and chambering them. If not done correctly, you run the very real risk of a slamfire as the M1A has a floating firing pin. Full length resize each piece of brass everytime, and don't seat your bullets long.

A friend of mine is a old distinguished shooter, he says the M14/M1A from the best military armorers would at best do 1 MOA after being freshly built and finely tuned. Precision match rifles they are not. They are still much fun and they LOOK like a rifle too.
Good Luck,
Scott
 
Mike,

I have shot thru four krieger bbls on my M14 in competiton and earned 28 of my 30 points with one.

You are correct in assuming that the LC brass is the best for the short line portions of XC shooing. It is rugged and will take many firings. You have to watch how far you push the shoulder back with resizing. For standing and rapid fire, I would push the should back .003"-.004". You don't need more than that.

I would make sure that the smith chambered my rifle with a standard M852 reamer. You don't want a chamber that requires a small base die,just my opinion) as that really overworks the brass. It also makes for exciting times during rapid fire and more than one alibi during a match if you get a few cases that didn't size down properly. Ask me how I know that?

Typically, by watching how much I push the should back, I would get 6-8 loadings from a piece of brass, then relegate it to practice. IMHO, throwing away brass after two-three firings is indicitive of poor loading discipline or bad brass.

You are correct in not using any LC brass that was fired in a machine gun. It is junk and will be nothing but separated cases in your rifle.

For brass prep, I would decap and uniform the primer pockets. You are correct about the high primer and floating firing pin issue. Don't want any surprises there. Once you get your new bbl, then work on determining the amount of shoulder set-back. It would be hard to get that right, not having the bbl there and a couple of fired cases.

10-4 on using a smith familiar with building an M14/M1A type rifle. Putting a bbl on one is not a job for someone doing it for the first time. At least not with my money! I want a know M14 smith who will give me the best, most reliable product available. Here it is experience and skill, somthing that many bolt gun and AR smiths lack on this rifle.

A couple of loading tips for you.

200 yds - you can try the Speer 125 gr TNT bullets and 45 grs of Varget in a LC Match case with CCI 34s. Very accurate and low recoil. Just the thing for rapid sitting.

OR for 200 and 300 yds

155 SMK Palma bullets over the same powder, charge, and primer. Very accurate and again low recoil.

At 600 yds - only push the shoulder back .0015" -.002"

Here you can load long and single load the rifle.

I used Winchested brass and IMR 4064 with a 175 SMK and Fed210M primers. You have to find the load your Rifle likes and that load will be to the upper end to get good results, but good they will be.

You will have to "Get Hard" in sitting and rapid prone. The rifle "Ain't no AR" and requires tight positions. Think "Woodpecker Lips" when building any of the rapid fire positions.

Good luck. I really enjoyed shooting my M14 rifle and earning my DR badge,1749) while whipping up on a bunch of AR shooters.

RGDS

Bob
 
Glenn Zediker has an excellent article on loading for the M14 :

http://www.zediker.com/downloads/14_loading.pdf.

It is conservative and errs on the side of safety.
Not everyone will agree with all he has to offer but it is an excellent starting point.

He has another article about the risks of once fired brass here:

http://www.zediker.com/downloads/oncefired.pdf
 
Thanks for the responses guys. Luckily my smith has experience building AR and M1A service rifles for the military.

I have experienced a slam fire on the line,unpleasant) and use only the hardest primers and haven't had one since.

Basically should I assume that Lake City match or LR brass that is once fired has been fired in a match chamber? I'm seriously considering investing the in the Redding full length s bushing small base sizing die to do the first round of sizing on once fired LC match cases I have. I have competition dies, but find it hard to be able to control shoulder bump. The best I can get is about .001 or .002 on my bolt gun and around .003-.004 on my current M1A cases. I use die shims to quickly change from one gun to another. Perhaps having one setup sizing die per rifle is the best way to go. I really hate setting up dies, I usually go through 3-5 pieces of brass doing so.

My smith is a wealth of knowledge at High Master with plenty of Highpower, and Palma shooting, but he is about an hour away and not always available. I wanted the M1A purely for the challenge compared to my Kreiger barreled AR that will easily clean rapids and get me in the 770s. Thanks for the help.
 
Check with your smith about setting your bolt up with a mod that removes the free floating from the firing pin.

Clint Fowler built my rifle and he installed a spring that holds the back of the firing pin tab in place. No slamfires.

Ziedkers article on checking the amount of stretch on a fired case compared to a fired case from your rifle is a good idea. That way you can compare the degree of brass stretch and determine if the LC Match brass is worth having.

Assume nothing!

Call your smith and see what reamer he is using on the bbl. Does he recommend a small base die? Just a personal prefference, I don't like small chambers on service rifles.
To me, there are an alabi looking for a rapid fire string to happen.

Bob
 
When i was still in the navy i used to shoot at the Pac-Fleet Matches with a M-14 that was rebarreled for the M852 match ammo. It was LC-91 match cases with a Sierra 168 matchking, still have 200rnds left. I use IMR-4064 with a 168 SMK in all of my M1A's and have had no problems with it. Granted there not match rifles but they can hold there own. I'd check into that spring for the slam fires. The last thing you'want to do is spend all that money and have it blow up.
 
I kind of like to re-size in a small base die for everything that goes through my M1A'S. I also like to uniform the primer pocket of all my brass for them. I also use CCI #34 primers when I can get them, then CCI 200's, then the older Winchester WLR,the ones that are chrome plated)
When I shoot shorter ranges or reduced targets I shoot 155SMK's with 42.5 gr. IMR 4895.
For 600 and 1000 I shoot 42.5 gr. IMR 4064, Winnie brass and the 175 SMK...this load turns my M1A's into drills... ;-)
 
Mark,

I too like the CCI34 for short line. They are dead reliable, and like you said, a tough cup so no slamfires.

At 600yds, I used commercial brass,Winchester and Lapua) along with Fed 210M or Russian LRM primers. They turn in some good ES and SD number across a chrono.

I found IMR 4064 to be the best for LR shooting. You have to work up to the max side on powder and pressure but that is where the powder really works. 175 SMKs or Bergers are the way to go for 600 yds. The old 2155 Sierra Palma bullet really liked my 10 twist Krieger bbls but you needed more attention to the wind with the lighter bullets.

You are on the right track with your 600 yd loads. Now it is just a case of working on your shooting skills. The rifle will do the rest.

Bob
 

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