Lost some respect for a gun builder today

[Samdweezel05]

So I read these posts of extremely long lead times year over year on stocks, barrels and other items. Why don't these companies expand to meet the demand? Yes additional equipment and training of new employees would be timely and expensive, but the end result would be worth it. Seems to me they are loosing business from cancelled orders or failure to sell because of the long wait. The customer that cancels his order, is a lost customer for life and will tell all his friends who will not buy from them either.

My only guess there is that they are as big as they want to be. I can understand that and to have to wait for something, for me, isn't a problem either. You have pretty much proven my entire point with your post. The company is as big as they want to be, with X number of employees working X number of hours. If they were going to grow any more and put on more people and work more hours than this super fast service that they charge for would not be needed. But because they don't want to have more people or time they are forced to push back paid customers for the new guy that just agreed to pay more.

 

[Samdweezel05]

It's called priority processing and is common among service and manufacturing companies. Plus 1 on your comment Clowdis. Individuals and compainies have been paying more for this type of service for years. UPS offers the same options. To bad you cant get overnight service for the same price as ground.

If you had read more than the first post you would have seen that the UPS and Fed Ex thing has been used already. I don't want the super deluxe service for the normal service price, I want to have my order treated like it meant something and not pushed to the back of the line for others that are willing to pay more.

 

[in2deep]

The government loves when the folks lower their value systems as it in turn allows them to drop theirs even lower. They are learning from us and not the other way around so you can't really blame them for what happens next.
A promise is no longer a promise and money is most important.
While waiting a year for a rifle promised 8 months earlier lots of other folks were being put in front of the line as I was being pimped out for a little cash. Not sure how anybody could side with that kind of behavior but we are living in a different time now and the younger generation must have been tainted by the liberal teachers and media where anything goes and "it's all good". Kalifornia is coming to your town sooner than you think.
If Kevin was honest and upfront and told me about the pimping out part and that dozens of people would be put in front of me and his promise of delivery time would be continually extended so he could make extra money then of course I would have chosen someone else and saved myself lots of grief.

 

[wapiti25]

There is a lot of difference between a service company and a manufacturing company. The stockmaker is a manufacturing co. and UPS/Fed EX are service co. It is unethical to push one order back for someone else's. I have worked on a part strickly on over time so they could get it sooner but the regular work was done on the straight shift.

 

[dtucker]

SPILL the BEANS ;D

 

[jo191145]

in2deep

Your PO'd. I can understand that. If this smith is intentionally "pushing back" normal orders to give preference to expedited orders thats a very poor, dishonest business decision on his part. Still, this fee based level of service is not liberalism, media problems, Kalifornia or low morality issues. Just the opposite.
Its pure Capatilism.

You need a product faster than a company can normally supply? Its only correct the buyer pick up the required overtime charges for the companies employee to produce that product outside of normal business hours.
This expedited order should not effect normal business...hopefully. So far theres no evidence that has taken place.
If in fact promises are being broken on a wide scale word will get out, business will suffer and expedited manufacturing will cease to be an issue anyway.
The laws of supply and demand live on. Still JMO.

 

[in2deep]

Sorry to disagree jo but we were obviously raised different. My Daddy woulda beat my arse for lying, cheating, stealing, not being prompt , not fulfilling an obligation whether verbal written or otherwise, being disrespectful in any way or just for not telling the whole truth when asked a question. That was sorta the rule of the day amongst anybody I knew till the dope-smokin hippies took over the school system and dumbed down future generations starting the moral decay by banning corporal punishment cuz it might make somebody feel bad, grading papers on a curve so everybody passes, give everybody stars even if you loose a game so nobody gets their self-esteem harmed, and teaching that everything is fine as long as you feel good. Forget about getting rid of bibles and taking the constitution down since it's too restraining for modern society.

Too bad they got to so many people.

If your not a man of your word what are you?

Why do you think Obama got elected?

 

[40X Guy]

Sorry to disagree jo but we were obviously raised different. My Daddy woulda beat my arse for lying, cheating, stealing, not being prompt , not fulfilling an obligation whether verbal written or otherwise, being disrespectful in any way or just for not telling the whole truth when asked a question. That was sorta the rule of the day amongst anybody I knew till the dope-smokin hippies took over the school system and dumbed down future generations starting the moral decay by banning corporal punishment cuz it might make somebody feel bad, grading papers on a curve so everybody passes, give everybody stars even if you loose a game so nobody gets their self-esteem harmed, and teaching that everything is fine as long as you feel good. Forget about getting rid of bibles and taking the constitution down since it's too restraining for modern society.

Too bad they got to so many people.

If your not a man of your word what are you?

Why do you think Obama got elected?

Excellent post in2deep! I was lied to, put on hold on the phone, no return on numerous emails, and had my ass chewed by his wife calling me a liar! Multiple broken promises and just very poor business acumen. I absolutely hate, abhor and disdain liars, cheats, thiefs and people that are not true to their word. Very simple fact of life. If you can't honor your word, then what or who are you going to honor?!

Frank

 

[jo191145]

I think we were raised quite the same by our Fathers.
I usually don't take kindly to anyone denegrating my father.
Reread my post SLOWLY. Never once did I say it was OK to conduct ones self dishonestly.

You may be angry your rifle is taking longer than promised. I understand.
You can persecute the man for the delay if you wish. That is your right as a consumer.
What you cannot do with any honesty is accuse him or his consumers of causing the delay through nefarious business practises beyond the mere fact there is a delay.
Now, you get proof he took my money for overtime work and bumped someone else let me know. I'll stand up and ring the bell just as loud as you.
Until then you would be accusing him of sins without validity. My Father would whoop me good for accusing someone of wrongdoing without proof.
Seeing as obtaining this proof is next to impossible you can be mad. I'll agree with that.
You can never do business with him again. I'll agree with that.
Therefore the only other logical alternative is let the free market decide the fate of his business by consumer demand or lack thereof.

As for the rest of your political questions, opinions we've already well overstepped our bounds on this forum. Wise to let it go Hope you get your rifle soon. Next time I'll bet you decide to screw the various parts together yourself. Saves much angst.

 

[jo191145]

Frank
I don't know but you may be talking about a different company.

edit
Probably wrong Frank. I went back to your earlier post and it seems we're talking about the same person. Sorry.
I'll agree the world keeps getting screwier. First rant about this smith I've seen.
I still stand by my opinions tho.
Spent 25yrs self employed with only one business policy. 100% honesty and 100% quality on EVERY job. It works everytime its tried.

 

[in2deep]

My friends and other forum members and others that have contacted me over the year have had their stocks 8 months before mine was finished AND MINE WAS ORDERED FIRST. Not sure why folks are obfuscating facts it can't be any more clear. I waited a year and others that paid the extra money were all put months ahead of the line. I was promised 2 to 4 months max and it took a year so look on a calendar and guess what was happening with all those $100's every month it's not rocket science and honestly I am being overly kind in my asessment of the transaction. After talking to so many people after the fact it's actually a commonly known secret just wish I knew it beforehand.

This has nothing to do with capitalism or supply and demand and is purely typical new age thinking to make feel good excuses. How much proof do you need? 6 weeks ain't a year if you put up a c-note.

And to Jo seriously I never meant anything about your father and was thinking more of those hippy teachers in bell bottoms and the folks on CNN.

 

[RJinTexas]

I have no problem paying the listed, stated or advertised price for a item of decent quality work but I'll be damn if I would be willing pay a premium for the same item or work to get a earlier delivery time. I'd simply find someone else to do business with period.

RJ

 

[NorCalMikie]

And all the time everybody was thinking this guy was "God's gift to gun building" while they were getting all over SSS for backlogs? (or whatever) :
Wait long enough and the truth will finally come out.

 

[40X Guy]

Upon finally getting my stock (unannounced and unexpected after requesting track # more than once) the fit and finish is fantastic and I am quite certain he does quality gunsmith work also, but no longer will he do any work for me. Yes, it will catch up to him in the end.

Frank

 

[jo191145]

In2deep

Forget the Father thing. I should'nt have brought it up. Its just my soft spot
You can feel free to poke me with a sharp stick anywhere else ;D ;D
It was not common knowledge to me. I'll admit like Sam I was a little shocked by it.
I had NEVER heard of anyone complaining about long waits missed orders.
If I had I would have gone elsewhere to begin with. The particular stock I needed/wanted is a rare bird. Even with the extra C-note it was much cheaper and 1/16th the wait of going elsewhere.
I say again I had never heard any complaint about delivery. I had no reason to believe his expedited manufacturing was anything but legit.
As you can see by my first post I was'nt thrilled with the quality of the product. And thats me being nice. It was my business decision and those I always stick to.


Nor Cal
He had a chance to do more business with me that day. After a breif conversation it became apparent he's not God He lost the rest. I'll shutup now before I become the forums biggest hypocrit. ;D

 

[boogershooter]

All the controversy this guy is causing reminds me of this hot girl I once dated, Everbody wanted some, but there just wasnt enough to go around. I gotta have one of these stocks! Who is it?

 

[dtucker]

God love you In2deep, I could not agree with you anymore about everything you said and i mean everything.

Sorry to disagree jo but we were obviously raised different. My Daddy woulda beat my arse for lying, cheating, stealing, not being prompt , not fulfilling an obligation whether verbal written or otherwise, being disrespectful in any way or just for not telling the whole truth when asked a question. That was sorta the rule of the day amongst anybody I knew till the dope-smokin hippies took over the school system and dumbed down future generations starting the moral decay by banning corporal punishment cuz it might make somebody feel bad, grading papers on a curve so everybody passes, give everybody stars even if you loose a game so nobody gets their self-esteem harmed, and teaching that everything is fine as long as you feel good. Forget about getting rid of bibles and taking the constitution down since it's too restraining for modern society.

Too bad they got to so many people.

If your not a man of your word what are you?

Why do you think Obama got elected?

 

[rocketron]

All the controversy this guy is causing reminds me of this hot girl I once dated, Everbody wanted some, but there just wasnt enough to go around. I gotta have one of these stocks! Who is it?

if you get this guy to make a hot girl stock for your new rifle and use your mexican blanket ......you'll be the talk of the F-class line.....LOL

Ron

 

[boogershooter]

Yes, and we shall give new meaning to the term "buttstock"