Load development techniques for bad shots?
- Thread starter _Raining
- Start date
just like that...
Lousy BC
Robs rambles, hope they help someone....
My 223 taught me to shoot again after years of flinching after learning to shoot a 308 when I was too young.
Dad was partly to blame as he used nothing but 180's after previous decades of 303 use on red deer.
I got to shoot my varmint loads pretty well but there was a couple of things holding me back from getting the bug holes we all strive for.
Recoil management had always troubled me and I sissy padded up to endeavor to lessen its effects as I knew recoil would always effect the last few shots in a group. Add to that, after some decades of getting eardrums bashed from trap and field shooting, don't underestimate the effect shot report can have on your shooting ! In an effort to address this I had cans added to my 308 and 223 and then by chance discovered the subconscious effect shot report has on groups.
The day was perfect and targets and ammo the same as had been used before for near bug hole results but I was dammed if I could get under that 1/2"......until I put earmuffs on !
But results were never as good as they could be.
Next thing I addressed was optics and groups dropped more but there was always that flyer that you just knew you did yourself !
Still, aim and release was not as good as I'd like and with a lifetime of physical work and the numerous hand injuries one suffers I didn't want to go any lighter than a couple of Lbs on the trigger so opted for a different style of aiming point that suited a better visual steady hold at release.
A light colored square on black was what I found best with the hold quartering the light square for what is actually an imaginary aiming point just even quartering the light colored square.
So next with using a cheap bipod that's only on for group development and field varminting and not wanting to spend big bucks on anything much better I looked into ditching it for grouping work.
Why ?.....'Cause an old shooter told me to and doing a bit of research into 'old school' practical long range shooting had me find this:
https://www.ballisticstudies.com/Knowledgebase/Hold+that+Forend.html
Felt recoil is reduced with a fore-end hold too and that alone boosts confidence.
Now I shoot bagged front and rear, feel less recoil and am comfortable with a level of personal marksmanship to shoot the furtherest deer I ever have in my life after some 40 years hunting.
/ramblings.
My 223 taught me to shoot again after years of flinching after learning to shoot a 308 when I was too young.
Dad was partly to blame as he used nothing but 180's after previous decades of 303 use on red deer.
I got to shoot my varmint loads pretty well but there was a couple of things holding me back from getting the bug holes we all strive for.
Recoil management had always troubled me and I sissy padded up to endeavor to lessen its effects as I knew recoil would always effect the last few shots in a group. Add to that, after some decades of getting eardrums bashed from trap and field shooting, don't underestimate the effect shot report can have on your shooting ! In an effort to address this I had cans added to my 308 and 223 and then by chance discovered the subconscious effect shot report has on groups.
The day was perfect and targets and ammo the same as had been used before for near bug hole results but I was dammed if I could get under that 1/2"......until I put earmuffs on !
But results were never as good as they could be.
Next thing I addressed was optics and groups dropped more but there was always that flyer that you just knew you did yourself !
Still, aim and release was not as good as I'd like and with a lifetime of physical work and the numerous hand injuries one suffers I didn't want to go any lighter than a couple of Lbs on the trigger so opted for a different style of aiming point that suited a better visual steady hold at release.
A light colored square on black was what I found best with the hold quartering the light square for what is actually an imaginary aiming point just even quartering the light colored square.
So next with using a cheap bipod that's only on for group development and field varminting and not wanting to spend big bucks on anything much better I looked into ditching it for grouping work.
Why ?.....'Cause an old shooter told me to and doing a bit of research into 'old school' practical long range shooting had me find this:
https://www.ballisticstudies.com/Knowledgebase/Hold+that+Forend.html
Felt recoil is reduced with a fore-end hold too and that alone boosts confidence.
Now I shoot bagged front and rear, feel less recoil and am comfortable with a level of personal marksmanship to shoot the furtherest deer I ever have in my life after some 40 years hunting.
/ramblings.
Good post and link Homerange. I have a heck of a time with recoil management myself and need to work on that nearly as much as my wind calling. Not sure how to do that using a bunny bag on the rear to fine tune the elevation though. Any suggestions appreciated. I also need to re evaluate the game of golf
Thanks Jim.
Shooting from a bench with a bunny ear rear bag is no issue as the rake on the lower edge of the butt allows different positions to alter elevation. If not enough lift the bag/s with some small wooden packers, offcuts of plywood are great for this.
Felt recoil (within reason) is largely a product of hold, fit and muscle memory.
Gripping/strangling a rifle to attempt to manage recoil better is self defeating as muscles are tensed so that the body doesn't go with the recoil. I know it sounds a bit nuts but with the more shooting you do the body learns to yield rather than fight recoil. I'd advise sissy padding the butt with say 4 thicknesses of heavy toweling in order to learn this as well as staying on the lighter side of projectile weight loads.
The modern projectile has good terminal performance and there's little need to throw the big slugs at game with the modern rifle. Even a cheap lowly 120gr FB lead tipped spire point Hornady out of my horrible REM 780 in 7.08 offers excellent terminal performance on red deer at 250yds.
However for every deer I've shot with any rifle I've never felt the recoil, whereas at the bench it's an entirely different story !
One concentrates too hard on holding the rifle steady when the bagging should be doing the work !
Hold the gun tight and you'll feel the recoil, guaranteed !
Hope some of that helps......yeah I feel for anyone getting bashed around by a gun.....before you do get it sorted or your shooting will suffer, as mine did for decades.
Wildcats
Gold $$ Contributor
KMart
Gold $$ Contributor
After seeing this ,i'm going to sell all my guns and take up gooooooolfing...lol
You better get some good prices for what you sell or have a LOT of guns. She looks expensive and unpredictable.
In the end, you will be heartbroken either way.
Wildcats
Gold $$ Contributor
Hahahaha...buddy i'm well aware on how this young Gold Diggers operate.
I've witness a few of my friends go down that road,even after me advising them not to, and ended up broke and Heartbroken.
What it the twist rate on your Criterion barrel, and velocity of your load? Are you teetering on the edge of stability? Only able to get tight groups in hotter weather or higher altitudes?
http://www.bergerbullets.com/twist-rate-calculator/
I had one load for my 9 twist 223 that'd shoot tiny groups but only when temps were over 100 in my area. Not very practical.
http://www.bergerbullets.com/twist-rate-calculator/
I had one load for my 9 twist 223 that'd shoot tiny groups but only when temps were over 100 in my area. Not very practical.
I beg to differ! B.C. (golf) = booty curve.
It is a 7 twist, .223 Rem Match chamber with a .090 fb and .254nk with .2245 throat. It was about 50 degrees when I ran this test. Not sure what the velocity is, batteries died on my chrono but it is a 30" barrel. I don't think stabilization is the problem, I have consistency issues with my 6 Dasher, 308 and 6.5 Creed (b4 it became a dasher).
Someone can probably comment better on this than I can. If your shooting short range bench rest I don't think you want any check pressure. Your thumb doesn't go over the tang. The more body parts that touch the rifle the more difficult it is to be consistannt. Can some expert here go over how you hold the rifle for bench rest not FTR or sling and jacket? My technique isn't perfect but I do OK for my purposes. My trigger finger is on the trigger and the 3 below fingers pull the stock into my shoulder, nothing else touches the rifle.
This is for FTR and the trigger is 1lb so that sort of excludes the free recoil benchrest technique (or so I have been told). I have swapped to a bag rider instead of a bipod temporarily because I do not have an F Class bipod yet and the atlas isn't great for this. Right now I am working on making/buying and modifying a proper rear bag rider to fit my chassis to ride a F Class rear bag better.
I do not have velocity data, the batteries were dead on the chronograph but I thought the consensus from BR and F Class shooters was the target tells the truth, not the SD/ES.
Target tells the truth but I wont even go to the target in load testing without muzzle velocity and SD. Different strokes fot different folks. Saves me lots of time and ammo.
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