lapua vs. US made brass

[DukeDuke]

Why is it so much better? We don't have the knowledge, or the proper raw materials, or the tooling, no, is the lack of qualified personnel? Quality control?

 

[CatShooter]

It's the lack of the american shooters to pay two to four times the price for brass.

Remember that 99% of shooters are not match shooters and they don't care a bit about brass quality.


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[DukeDuke]

Good point!

 

[vonb]

Price is mainly due to monetary conversion factors. I don't think it's due to the fact that "it's better". American's are trying to compete with Lapua brass via Nosler brass. It may not be on the same playing field but it's our attempt.

One thing I have noticed is that Europeans take much pride in the arms they produce. Look at Sako, Lapua and others. It may have to do with more stringent requirements for their goods.

 

[CatShooter]

Price is mainly due to monetary conversion factors. I don't think it's due to the fact that "it's better". American's are trying to compete with Lapua brass via Nosler brass. It may not be on the same playing field but it's our attempt.

One thing I have noticed is that Europeans take much pride in the arms they produce. Look at Sako, Lapua and others. It may have to do with more stringent requirements for their goods.

It is not due to monitary conversions.. Norma and Lapua have always been much more expensive - even when the dollar was very strong.

As to Nosler brass - HA!

Not even a decent try.


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[tightneck]

It's the lack of the american shooters to pay two to four times the price for brass.

Remember that 99% of shooters are not match shooters and they don't care a bit about brass quality.


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It would be interesting to know how much of Lapua's brass makes it to the US. While what you stated may just well be true, it's quite silly when you think about it. Lapua brass cost's twice as much as WW or Remy, maybe a little more than twice. The Lapua cases will last 10 times longer however, so which is really more expensive? For the average shooter who may only load their cases a few times every five years, the WW or Remy brass makes sense. But then, are they really shooters, or just folks that enjoy hitting the range a couple times a year, and hunting in the fall. Lapua isn't targeting that kind of shooter, and they don't need to, they have a smaller market that knows you get what you pay for. And Lapua's margins don't rely on mass of production, they rely on competitive shooters.

 

[BillK]

tightneck-I gotta call you out on this one!!! What qualifies you to say Lapua will last ten times longer? What study was this based on? I have use nothing but winchester and remington brass and have won my fair share of stuff with it. Unless the radioactive decay of Lapua brass is slower than the rest you can anneal necks and get whatever brass to last a long long long time. I know a family that shoots at Williamsport PA that are probably some of the best 1000yd benchrest shooters in the world that use nothing but winchester brass. In fact they use the really old winchester brass and they said it lasts a long long time. Heck I have remington brass for my 25-06 that I have been using for 13 or 14 years!!! If you are willing to sort american brass and you know what you are doing with it it is as good as anything else. If you are trying to save time and want to shoot cases out of the box and have a no turn neck then yeah Lapua or Norma may be the answer.

 

[usngunner]

I have a friend with several long range records. He personally got 32 reloads of one box of Lapua .308. That was annealing every 2nd time fired. He said it still looked good but he thew it away as he just couldn't believe it.

That is the kind of study a lot of us are using.

 

[CatShooter]

I have a friend with several long range records. He personally got 32 reloads of one box of Lapua .308. That was annealing every 2nd time fired. He said it still looked good but he thew it away as he just couldn't believe it.

That is the kind of study a lot of us are using.

I'll see you that and raise you one.

I have a loading kit for the range, and I took one piece of Remington 308 brass and loaded it 28 times consecutively,no annealing). I quit there cuz I got bored, and threw it back in the bunch that it came from - I am still shooting it.

It is not about brass life, it is about uniformity.


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[reloader243]

lol...I'm not sure if I like my Chevy better than your Ford.....or my Toyota better than your Dodge, or which is best for what...but I do know we will be have a debate about each for as long as there is a choice....to be made.
I think in-fact...the quality of the equipment, components, etc that we shoot with far surpasses the abilities we bring to the bench or hunt or shooting disipline.......We better get more shooting done and less B/S'n done about it...lol
Hope we all had a good Memorial Day...and remember how we got to beable to enjoy our sport.....
USN...63-69

 

[tightneck]

tightneck-I gotta call you out on this one!!! What qualifies you to say Lapua will last ten times longer? What study was this based on? I have use nothing but winchester and remington brass and have won my fair share of stuff with it. Unless the radioactive decay of Lapua brass is slower than the rest you can anneal necks and get whatever brass to last a long long long time. I know a family that shoots at Williamsport PA that are probably some of the best 1000yd benchrest shooters in the world that use nothing but winchester brass. In fact they use the really old winchester brass and they said it lasts a long long time. Heck I have remington brass for my 25-06 that I have been using for 13 or 14 years!!! If you are willing to sort american brass and you know what you are doing with it it is as good as anything else. If you are trying to save time and want to shoot cases out of the box and have a no turn neck then yeah Lapua or Norma may be the answer.

I'm not gonna argue about brass, if you want to use WW or Remy, that's fine with me. As far as longevity goes, no I didn't do any scientific testing. But I do have Lapua 220 Russian and 6mmbr cases with well over 200 firings on them. That's not with pussycat loads either.

 

[CatShooter]

"... But I do have Lapua 220 Russian and 6mmbr cases with well over 200 firings on them. That's not with pussycat loads either.

Now THAT'S impressive...

... or being real cheap!


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[tightneck]

"... But I do have Lapua 220 Russian and 6mmbr cases with well over 200 firings on them. That's not with pussycat loads either.

Now THAT'S impressive...

... or being real cheap!


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Maybe a little cheap. No seriously, the chambers are obviously very tight and these cases go from match duty to play duty after about ten firings. There's nothing like new brass when you go to the line at a big match. But for messing around at the range and varmint shooting, cases will last as long as I want them to. I just got back from the Super Shoot and all the brass I prepped up and shot there is now relegated to the recycle pile. I've already got plenty of practice brass and the scrap yards are paying top dollar for brass, copper and lead.

 

[varmintslayer]

As most of you know, brass is made from copper and zinc,and sometimes many other metals). The quality of your ammunition brass hinges on many factors. The biggest factor is the ratio of copper to zinc and where the brass originates. The process of smelting and combines the two metals also counts for quality. Chinese brass is the worst, they incorporate other metals and materials to lessen the amount of pure copper used to make the brass. Brass used to make large vats for brewery's is much different than the brass used to make the fitting on your garden hose.

The USA once produced the highest quality brass in the world but the environmental Nazi's put an end to most US foundry's.
Today, the highest quality brass is produced in the Netherlands and that's where Lapua happens to be. It's no accident that Lapua's brass is better. Lapua makes brass and components for all sorts of military applications as well.

Winchester and Remington both import their brass from China. I have yet to buy a quality made product of Chinese origin.

The old Winchester cases were made with imported brass but not from China, I'm not sure where it came from but I remember a press release when they switched brass suppliers.

Buy Lapua and use the best, if the price of lapua bugs you then buy some Nammo stock and you will feel better each time you order new cases.

Rich

 

[rstreich]

...Today, the highest quality brass is produced in the Netherlands and that's where Lapua happens to be....

Lapua is in Finland.

 

[varmintslayer]

I meant to say Europe, I knew that Lapua wasn't in the netherlands. My mistake.

 

[ssphoger]

I am no expert but since building my first 6BR 2 years ago I have tryed several loads using Lapua brass and Remington and every time with everything being the same,same powder, same primer, same bullet and OAL)EVERY time my grougs with the Lapua in at least HALF as with the Rem! Just yesterday I was trying some Barns 72gr HP Varminaters Lapua brass 3 shot .135" 100yds.
Rem brass .785" 3 shots 100 yd. and I did this 3 times.
Bottom line all my Rem brass is for sale and I don't care how much the Lapua is thats what I will buy.
Just my 2 cents.

 

[jthyttin]

Being from Finland, like next door to Lapua, I guess you'd expect me to use Lapua brass. Even before I was kind of irritated about the Lapua hype, but ever increasing prices broke the straw; I rather use e.g. Winchester,best quality US brass in my opinion) and sort out maybe 5-10% for off-hand use etc. With Lapua you also have to sort out maybe 1-2%.

Speaking of Finnish manufacturers, a week ago I went through some batches of Rem and Sako brass. Rem had around 1% of total variation in case weight after fireforming and trimming. Sako had around 10%. So much for the quality...,actually I think Norma makes a good portion of Sako brass).

You guessed it, I'm kind of annoyed with "Lapua this, Lapua that". Even with current reports of some varying quality people just keep believing in Lapua because they have no choice...

,EDIT: of course I was talking about Nammo/Schönebeck/Nordis stuff when complaining above. Beretta is Sako-related, my bad and fast fingers... post edited accordingly)