Lapua 308 brass

[mshelton]

Recently picked up a custom shop 700 in 308, not really a chamber I fool with but the price was right and it's a short little 20' job and works great for messing with coyotes.

Anyway, decided to try some Lapua brass for it, used Lapua in all my BRs, PPCs and 6.5x55 with no problem. Went to FL size the Lapua this morning, had the die backed way out to start and was going to feel my way down to a final size. Ran the first piece through, average tension, checked it in my rifle with the fire control pulled and noticed the bolt was harder to close than before I sized it. Tried another piece and the same thing, bolt was harder to close after sizing than before. Couldn't figure it out till I started looking at the case head, saw marks from the shell holder then looked at the bottom and the whole rim had bent. Now I don't have any way of measuring the force I had on the press but it was certainly no more than normal for my other cases, I'd say it was a good deal less.

I had heard that some chamberings of Lapua brass were suspect quality at times, guess I ran across one of those times.

 

[mao0720]

Thats too bad! I just bought a new batch of Lapua 308 brass that Im processing right now and it seems just fine. Id get a hold of Lapua and try to have them replace it.

 

[Turbulent Turtle]

I continue to be mystified by people who screw up virgin brass, especially Lapua by F/L sizing it before using it the first time.

Nevertheless, some pictures showing the defect before a virgin case is inserted in the F/L die would go a long way to help visualize the issue.

 

[mshelton]

I continue to be mystified by people who screw up virgin brass, especially Lapua by F/L sizing it before using it the first time.

Nevertheless, some pictures showing the defect before a virgin case is inserted in the F/L die would go a long way to help visualize the issue.

It was twice fired there high speed, simmer down...

How would a picture show the defect before the byproduct of said defect occurred? Can you tell soft case heads from photography? Should these photographs be taken of the twice fired case, once fired case, new 'virgin' case, of the box they came in, the ups driver that delivered them?

 

[Shynloco]

m.
try and get hold of Kevin Thomas (Lapua Rep- posts on this blog)) and run your issue by him. I'd imagine if you got a "bad batch", he can help get you replacements. I've not experienced your problem and I just bought a new batch of .308 Lapua brass.

 

[mshelton]

Thanks for the name Shynloco, I'll see if I can track him down.

 

[Turbulent Turtle]

It was twice fired there high speed, simmer down...

How would a picture show the defect before the byproduct of said defect occurred? Can you tell soft case heads from photography? Should these photographs be taken of the twice fired case, once fired case, new 'virgin' case, of the box they came in, the ups driver that delivered them?

Well, you left that little piece of information out of your OP. So, twice fired means it was resized once already and did not seem to have an issue. But then again, you are talking like this was the first time you were sizing it because you were trying to adjust the die.

At any rate, I would still like to see a picture of the problem and I suspect Kevin will also. The question becomes why did you not have the problem at the first resizing operation? The thought that comes to mind is that you resized it incorrectly the first time and things got worse from there. Did you use any guages to figure out the headspace of the rifle and how you were resizing the brass?

I don't suppose you annealed the brass either. It just sounds like the brass is too long and the rim got deformed during the resizing operation, maybe due to too little lube.

Then again, the brass may be bad, but why did it have no issues the first firing, resize and the second firing?

 

[mshelton]

First 2 loadings were neck sized only, never found a need to FL till the 3rd loading.

thanks for the input, going to go eat a slim jim.

 

[DennisH]

had the die backed way out to start and was going to feel my way down to a final size

Just a long shot, I still don't know what's causing the bent rim.

I check my headspace with every loading. If my brass measures 1.614 before sizing, I get as close to 1.613 or 1.612 as possible. I also trim the brass after the third firing. Both items will cause the round to chamber with difficulty. Annealing is also important.

With you stating the above, this light bulb came on. Hope it helps.

Dennis

 

[mshelton]

I have an annealer and do anneal my long range benchrest stuff, this is just a critter getter rifle and there was no need to anneal it yet. The die was 5 full turns off the shell holder. Die had been honed out with JB and cleaned, brass had a coat of Imperial wax. Very little tension was needed to drive the case in and out of the die, yet the rim bent under that pressure.

Jesus Christ could have similar problems and still people wouldn't accept that Lapua had made a faulty piece of brass.

 

[DennisH]

It's possible.

Just throwing my .02 in the mix.

I wish I had the answer for you.

Dennis

 

[mshelton]

Sorry Dennis, just me being the standard grumpy ahole, not really looking for an answer just noting the problem.

 

[MrMajestic]

Now don't get hard Peter, I'm just playing with you! ;D I am going to throw this out there as just as a brainstorming thing. Are you sure you grabbed the correct shellholder. Some nitwit, read me, has already grabbed the wrong size(larger of course as smaller wouldn't fit) and has damaged the base of a cartridge. I'm blaming old eyes and small print, that's my excuse and I'm sticking with it.

 

[mshelton]

Yep, right shellholder, though I have made that mistake in the past. Fixed that problem by etching a groove in the side of them and filled it with enamel paint. Everything gets color coded from dies to holders for priming, turning and trimming.

Br-308 blue
Ppc red
222 green
Etc, etc

Tried it again on another piece from that lot, very little resistance in pulling the case from the die will imprint and bend the rim. I'll see if I can contact someone at Lapua if even to just make them aware.

 

[CJ6]

Bent UP or DOWN. Where's the impression at on the rim ?

 

[mshelton]

Bent down, the impression is on the top, force from pulling the cases out of the die caused it.

 

[CJ6]

Lack of lube possibly ?

 

[mshelton]

Gave it the normal wipedown with imperial sizing wax like I do with everything else, the other cases I tried I added a fuz more which is still sparing.

 

[jonbearman]

Is it possible that the interior of the die is rough towards the top rendering it as a hook like surface and making very stiff coming out.Take a pick and feel the surface as high as you can go after you remove the spindle.It happened to me with a brand new redding die and they replaced it.

 

[mshelton]

Thanks Jon, I'll try that, I spun a jb coated patch on a spindle and drill inside of the die but never did afterwards if it was rough.