Keeping the 224 Valkyrie supersonic to at least 1100 yards

[LRRiflemanSNJ]

I am looking at assembling an AR upper in 224 Valkyrie for thousand yard sling matches, trying to accommodate my handicap.

I am leaning towards a 26" 1:7 barrel, and looking to use the Sierra 80gr MatchKings. Plugging numbers into Sierra Infinitely, it looks like I can barely keep this bullet supersonic to 1025 yards at close to sea level. My desire is to build a load that could deliver 1 minute or better accuracy at 1000yards.

Has anyone had any degree of luck in loading the 224 Valkyrie with the 80gr SMK and kept it supersonic to at least 1100 yards at close to sea level?

Thanks in advance for your advice.

 

[Ned Ludd]

I don't shoot the Valkyrie, but I have a lot of experience loading heavies in the .223 Rem for 1000 yd F-TR. With the .223 and a 30" barrel, you can easily keep the 90 VLDs supersonic to 1100 yd using H4895 at ~2850 fps. The 80s will be more of a problem in the .223. They are going to be very close to going subsonic between 1000 and 1100 yd out when launched at ~3000 fps from a 30" barrel. The only question is whether the Valkyrie with its larger case capacity can get the 80s moving at greater than ~3000 fps from a 26" barrel. If "yes", you shouldn't have any problems as long as you don't push them so fast as to create problems with jacket failure.

 

[boltfluter]

Thinking the problem will be finding good tough brass for the Valkryie. Not sure what is available at the moment. Good luck with your project.

Paul

 

[Evan]

Thinking the problem will be finding good tough brass for the Valkryie. Not sure what is available at the moment. Good luck with your project.

Paul

Agreed. Have you considered a 22 Grendel? You'd have really strong brass and should be able to make at least 3000fps without drama or needing a tremendously long tube.

 

[Terry_M]

I spoke with the gunsmith at Radical Firearms today and he recommended a 6.7 or faster twist for the 90's and a 24" barrel. There's a lengthy thread on Snipers Hide by Niles Coyote about the 224 Valkyrie. Last I looked it was around 16 pages long. Several contributors, multitude of loading combos and a few pictures with write ups about OCW tests.

 

[Rodney]

I recently put together a 224 Valkyrie in ar-15. As far as brass goes, starline was my choice after doing some research. Was very consistent and is holding up well to, and I’m pushing 88g ELD-M with a max charge of Varget.

 

[264win]

I am using Starline brass and have been very satisfied with it in my .224 Valkyrie CMMG Endevour factory 24" barrel. AR Comp will produce more velocity at the same pressure as Varget. I see very little down side to a 26 inch barrel. I shoot all coated bullets and nitrocarburized barrels.

 

[Kimber.204]

@LRRiflemanSNJ you should check out these conversations on snipers hide....

https://forum.snipershide.com/threads/224-valkyrie-vs-220-thunderbolt.6939322/page-2#post-7758107

https://forum.snipershide.com/threa...un-testing-review.6935618/page-2#post-7755885

I assume that since you're talking about sling matches that you are okay single loading.

If you're interested in the 220 Thunderbolt as an AR, I may be interested in selling my 220 upper (or the entire gun) as I'm more interested in shooting bolt guns

PM me if interested.
Regards
Ross

 

[Kurz]

LRRiflemanSNJ,

Rather than trying to piece together all this disparate information, here is the simple solution without the specifics.

With a 26" barrel and your choice of 80 grain bullets, you need to achieve 3,200 fps at sea level to carry your bullet supersonic past 1,100 yards. Be aware that this result is only workable when you have pushed the limit on the velocity at the top of the pressure curve.

Personally, I would give up on the MK and shoot Berger VLDs for a better BC. You're pushing right at the limit with your requests so any little bit of help will produce better results.

This is usually the period of time when you reexamine your desired goals and set about trying to realize those goals with a different cartridge or lower your expectations slightly. You will be running your rifle and brass on the very upper level of the pressure curve.

The easier solution is to use the 90 grain Berger VLD over Re-16 and run a lower pressure with more remaining fps at 1,100 yards. You need somewhere around 3,000 fps.

 

[Rusty Rob]

I don't shoot the Valkyrie, but I have a lot of experience loading heavies in the .223 Rem for 1000 yd F-TR. With the .223 and a 30" barrel, you can easily keep the 90 VLDs supersonic to 1100 yd using H4895 at ~2850 fps. The 80s will be more of a problem in the .223. They are going to be very close to going subsonic between 1000 and 1100 yd out when launched at ~3000 fps from a 30" barrel. The only question is whether the Valkyrie with its larger case capacity can get the 80s moving at greater than ~3000 fps from a 26" barrel. If "yes", you shouldn't have any problems as long as you don't push them so fast as to create problems with jacket failure.

Curious why you are using H4895 and not Varget, higher pressure?

 

[Ned Ludd]

Curious why you are using H4895 and not Varget, higher pressure?

I like H4895 because it has slightly smaller kernels than Varget, and tunes in at ~20-25 fps greater velocity for a given accuracy node than Varget. However, Varget also works very well with heavies in the .223 Rem case.

 

[TAJ45]

Even though no personal Valkyrie interest, a very interesting read provided by knowledgeable shooters. Thanks to all contributors

 

[Terry_M]

if you're looking to squeeze the most accuracy you can out of your Valkyrie in an AR platform I recommend either cutting the front out of your magazines yourself or buying them already cut out from Cavity Back. I almost gave up on the 95gr MK's before cutting the magazines out and loading them to be .015 off the lands. Just re-started load development with RL-17 and have been able to get down to 1.5 inches at 300yds with a .01gr difference between rounds. Still need to load up 5 at the middle charge and see how they do at the same distance. No velocities collected yet.

 

[Laurie]

I'd agree with some other comments that the 80gn SMK doesn't have the highest BC value in the pack.

A question is though whether you need to be supersonic. I started my long-range 223 competition shooting in the very early days of F-Class with the 80gn SMK (back when there was no F/TR class, and we still shot on the same 2-MOA centre ring targets as the sling shooters). I've no idea what the MV was, modest though as it was a manually operated ('straight-pull') AR-15 with 24-inch Lilja heavy match barrel. Load cartridges to much over 53-55,000 psi and you struggle to open the bolt on these rifles with no gas assistance and lack of turnbolt primary extraction camming action - my cases extracted very easily. I'd reckon MVs were somewhere in the 2,750-2,800 fps range, more likely at the lower rather than top end of those figures.

These rounds performed very well at 900 and 1,000 yards albeit I had to keep calling for targets to be marked as they were subsonic at these distances and the butts crew missed their passage. The old 80gn MK is a very tolerant trans/subsonic design, much much better than VLDs with higher BCs.

Of course if you're shooting on sound operated e-targets (Silver Mountain and Shot Marker), that's no good to you as the microphones need a supersonic 'crack' to operate.

 

[Terry_M]

With the velocities and accuracy achieved from my gas gun I've dived into the bolt variant of the Valkyrie. looking forward to being able to open the throat and get every grain of powder into the case without the 95 SMK stealing volume. I've got the barrel, receiver, trigger, optic, base, rings, brass, powder, primers and a pile of projectiles. Just need the reamer, throater and stock. Going to see what I can do in the PRS this summer....

 

[Rocketvapor]

For /224 calibers, other than the 220 Thunderbolt mentioned, the 22 Nolser puts heavy bullets out the muzzle faster than the 224V or the .223 (even the AI variant).
If you plan on shooting F-T/R then stick with the .223.
All the other small frame rounds are F-Open
Most of the trash talking about the 22 Nosler is setting it up wrong.
One, gas wise to not rip up rims.
and Two, oh jeez, the wrong twist.
and Three, long bullets won't fit in the magazine.
Check out calculators to tell you what velocity you NEED with heavy bullets to stay supersonic (about Mach 1.1 works) past 1000.

 

[500yards]

the 80 ELD shoots fantastically from our 1:7 and 1:6.5 twist barrels. I've only shot to 300 yards, but the results are very impressive, excellent accuracy and about 2800 fps from a 20" barrel.

On another note, I'm testing the 95 SMK and we're getting ready to load this round. Right now I'm at 2550 fps from a 24" 1:6.5" barrel and shooting close to 0.5 MOA 5-shot groups.

 

[rsmithsr50]

and how does that work out at 1000 yards for velocity ?

the 80 ELD shoots fantastically from our 1:7 and 1:6.5 twist barrels. I've only shot to 300 yards, but the results are very impressive, excellent accuracy and about 2800 fps from a 20" barrel.

On another note, I'm testing the 95 SMK and we're getting ready to load this round. Right now I'm at 2550 fps from a 24" 1:6.5" barrel and shooting close to 0.5 MOA 5-shot groups.

 

[Evan]

The new Berger 85.5 can be driven significantly faster than the 90gn class of bullets. In my 22BR, 88ELDs went 3050fps and the 85.5 are going 3200. I'd look at the 85.5 if your 1000yd speed is too slow.